oblivion

$45? That's a bargain. Exams around here run around $65. Glad you baby checked out.

I know about Holly, I know. I've been watching her story over the last few months. Turns out, I might have a wrench in the works and might not get up there this weekend, but I will make it up there. Happy homecoming day to you and Scarlet. I hope it all goes well. And that's a great idea about shopping there. When I do make it out there, I'll see what I can stock up one. Also plan on making a cash donation since I can't offer a home just yet.

Probably my bad for reviving such an old thread. I never know which way to go - build off an old thread to consolidate info, or start a new one. FWIW, the vet said he was a 3.5/5.0 "meaning he can afford to lose a little bit of weight, but he's not "portly" or obese." We're both interested in seeing how his blood panel comes back (retesting Friday).

Nancy, are you referring to Dave's post from a year and a half ago? Or to his response to me? I'm confused again. For what it's worth, I had no problem with his response to me.

Figured I'd throw this pic from this morning up in here: Million Dollar Baby by oblivion9999, on Flickr BTW, that is me smiling - I don't know why I always look so dour. Heh.

I'm with Greywings on the Sonic Boom. My 'tiel (and former budgie) seem to prefer the perch and I've always been frustrated I couldn't get Spencer on it. After a year an a half, I FINALLY had the brilliant idea to put the flat platform on it (my scale came w/ both) and 'herd' Spencer onto it. Now I can weigh him. To each his/her own.

EXACTLY! I was speaking of Oak Park - Green Line! Our first night in the place, 3:00 a.m., windows open, I woke up to the sound of a thousand bunnies being slaughtered (if you've ever heard a distressed rabbit, you know what I mean). I bolted out of bed with no contacts/glasses trying to figure out what the horrid noise was. All of the pets were fine and I eventually noticed a freight train out the window crawling at about 0.00000002 MPH and apparently riding the brakes - squealing away. Somehow, we even got used to that. Amazing. I love train sounds. Would be kind of cool if Spencer would pick up the low lone wail if a midnight freight, but if he hasn't yet . . . . Best of luck when you get your baby. Also, re: your username, I tired for a while to get Spencer to pick up R2D2's sounds, but never has. My sister's old red lori used to have them down cold.

Something cool last night - he was getting keyed up banging his favorite plastic bottle around again. I mean, really, I worry about the obsessiveness of it. So sometimes I take the bottle and put it somewhere that challenges him - by getting him used to going on the living room floor to get it or whatever. So last night, I was a stinker and hung it in a toy which is 3 plastic rings connected together. It was about halfway down from his cage door to the floor. I'd hoped he'd either climb down and get it, or shake the rings hard enough from top or bottom to knock it loose. This occupied him for the better part of an hour, which was MOSTLY good, but I could see it was frustrating him a bit as I really had it in there good, and his shaking from the top wasn't knocking it loose. Although it was frustrating for ME as well! He'd get halfway down the ladder and look across to the bottle then give up. Had he climbed all the way to the floor, he could have gotten it from below fairly easily. I was trying to encourage him, "NO, you've almost got it. KEEP GOING!" But it was pretty cool to watch him actually pause, size up the situation (his ladder down is not right by the toy, so it was very much a spatial challenge) and try something new. It is so neat to watch the gears turning through those sharp eyes of theirs.

I can't speak to any Grey's reactions let alone yours specifically, but we used to live directly across the street, at eye level, from the CTA's El and Union Pacific high-line. 2 humans, 2 bunnies - which are fairly nervous about sounds, a budgie, cockatiel, and pair of zebra finches all got used to the sounds. The only real issue was that we'd have to pause movies if a train came by during quiet dialog. For us, not them. Remember that scene from The Blues Brothers? Jake: How often does the train go by? Elwood: So often, you won't even notice it.

Having just gone through the emergency vet routine/money vacuum with my cockatiel and facing the upcoming additional expense of daily and monthly meds and regular (3-6 month) checkups, no birds better follow me home on Saturday! I would like to visit some of the macaws, though and 'try them on for size.' Severes seem like a good 'gateway drug.' But no, the time is still not right. I'm going going to pick up an aquarium stand, maybe a cage, and to visit ONLY (and I DO need to keep telling myself that ). Is is Thursday yet? Is it Thursday yet? Is it Thursday yet??? I can't imagine how (nervously) excited you are! (Edit to add: Well, I DO have a spare budgie cage . . . )

One interesting thing is that the vet today was not concerned at all about Anya's weight or muscle mass (which in fact was down to 78g when I got her home). She speculated 90g might be too much for her, but of course hasn't seen her at that weight yet.

YAY! Anya is home! (And medicated and I am at my very understanding work place now.) She's on 2 oral meds daily for a month or two, 2 more oral meds daily for life, and a Lupron injection monthly for life. Assuming a good recheck in two weeks, the Vet doesn't see why we can't get a few more years out of her. Best early birthday present I could have hoped for. Thanks for all of the support everyone.

Yeah, I saw the chart in post #3, which is why I asked. Thanks. I'll bring it up as a question to the vet when I take him back to retry his blood test. I haven't seen a whole lot of TAGs, but of those I have seen, he's big. According to his "baby" records, he'd always been around 350g, except at one point he dropped to 330 when he had a "minor infection." He's not on a junk food diet and he's fairly active, so I'm curious what his blood panel and vet say.

372g for Spencer. Is he fat, or just big-boned? Vet didn't say anything about his weight on Friday.

I pick her up tomorrow morning! Phone mixup precluded me from having time to get her tonight. Her uric acid level dropped from 27 to 15 - great progress.

Sure, exciting news for you, but to me, that means I won't get to see her at CARE when I go up this weekend. I understand being intimidated. On the bright side, given her age, you should have fewer hormone issues to deal with, right? Congrats.

Welcome. I love that bright red tail. Timneh's are much more subdued maroon and I forget how bright CAGs are. Like others have said. Give him time. You have MANY YEARS ahead to spend together. No sense rushing - though I know how exciting it is. I dare say that cage needs some more toys and perches (which I grant, may be out of view).

I just wanted to continue this thread with a few updates. One is the tale of his recent vet visit which is embedded in a grander story, HOPEFULLY with a happy ending - it is still being written: http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?194991-How-a-routine-vet-visit-turns-into-an-emergency. The second update is something that I noted yesterday. Over the past year an a half of having Spencer when he was less 'interactive,' he'd screech on occasion - usually if on the phone, watching a movie, or god forbid, playing an instrument and singing. It's not the 'OMG, the vacuum is going to eat me!' whistle, not the 'I've been around young girls most of my life!' squeal, but just a blood-curdling, nails on a chalk board SCREECH. Contact calling wouldn't stop it and of course we knew not to yell back or join in the drama so as not to encourage it. Over the last two or more weeks - however long he's been coming out of his shell more - I have not heard that screech ONCE. Even if he is in his own room doing his own thing and not out downstairs with us, he'll contact call back and forth, but luckily, no screeching. That. Is. Awesome. That said, we had a little setback yesterday after a very busy weekend involving not begin around the house as much as the last two weekends. His travel cage was downstairs and open and he was alternating eating and playing with his bottle, but he wasn't much interested in coming out. He got into a mood/mode where he was just obsessed with beating his bottle around while holding it in his beak. He was basically doing an Axl Rose 'snake dance.' Occasionally he'd drop the bottle and though we gave it back a few times, I thought it was a good puzzle for him to figure out how to climb down and get it. At one point, he was on his ladder and threw the bottle at my wife (BTW, I've mentioned before, I think he 'likes' her, though she only feeds him on occasion and doesn't play with him much). She went to give it back to him, and he struck at her and did his alarm cluck. Luckily he didn't bite, but it was fairly damaging of her trust in him. I reminded her not to be upset at him - if anything be mad at me since I hadn't noticed how wound up he was getting. She ended up going to bed (she said this morning she wasn't bearing a grudge) and after he clucked at me a few times, too, I coaxed him into his cage and put him in the other room to 'cool off' a bit. After 5 minutes, he seemed calmed down quite a bit and I took him upstairs and put him to bed with our normal, if slightly abbreviated, familiarity. I think there was a combination of potential factors which lead to his outburst - 1) an atypical weekend, especially with Anya gone to the vet (not to mention his own vet visit 2 days earlier) 2) frustrated 'love' issues with my wife 3) a 'toy' he really loves and seemed to be getting obsessed with and 4) me pushing bed time a little bit due to having been gone most of the day. A new challenge every day.

I loved all of the sounds in that vid. I'm sure obnoxious to some, but heaven to me (and you, I'm sure). One of the advantages of getting a rehomed bird - no waiting for weaning or having to debate over which one to get. You can't pick wrong, I'm sure. Especially if you let the bird pick you.

Thank you so much, Aerial. The long, rambling thread is here: http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?194991-How-a-routine-vet-visit-turns-into-an-emergency. Still waiting for today's results.

***Update - Anya lost her fight on 7/6/2012 - exactly 5 months after I started this thread.*** I'm not sure if this is the best place for this. It's fairly personal and anecdotal, but it may also serve as a head's up on what people need to watch for with our birds. Mods, please advise if needed. Thanks. I have to admit that it had been a while since Anya (12 y.o. 'tiel) and Spencer (14 y.o. TAG - in my home about 20 months) were to the vet, but both appeared healthy, so I was questioning if I REALLY needed to do it when I scheduled their trip for last Friday (2/3). I had set the appointment about 2 weeks ago. In that time, Anya had one 'bad day,' where she seemed a little low energy, didn't really eat as much as usual, and her poop was a bit watery. I let her be and worried a bit, but the next day, she was back on her food and her poop was looking 'better,' so I chalked it up to stress/change from Spencer's recent increase in interaction/attention/etc. Fast-forward to exam day, and by the time I filled out the background information on the birds, I'd totally forgotten about her 'bad day.' This was a new vet, so I spent a lot of time outlining Spencer's deformed feet, past plucking, and my suspicion that his one wing might be damaged to the point of no longer growing flight feathers. The vet was very interested in him - grilling me on his perches, balance, mobility, etc. I seemed to satisfy her concerns that other than unsureness when working on step-ups, he was a pretty 'normal' bird. He, of course, didn't step up for her, so she had to towel him to do the exam. He had one or two pressure spots on his feet she was a little concerned about, but admitted that since his feet were SO abnormal, there really was no benchmark for what were acceptable 'wear marks' on them. She just suggested getting rid of the one hard perch I do have for him and replacing it with a rope perch. When she took him out of the room for his blood test, he even returned calmly perched on her shoulder - I was amazed (she was holding his feet to help secure him, but he wasn't upset with her at all). He didn't get off of her shoulder very gracefully, but eventually did and we got a weight on him (honestly I don't remember off hand, but I think 370-ish grams). Unfortunately she didn't get enough blood for him for a full panel and what she did get ended up coagulating in the sample tube, so was unusable. But his poop looked good and he generally checked out OK. We talked about trying to get another blood sample in a week. Then her attention turned to Anya, and she IMMEDIATELY got concerned. She did NOT like that her poop was fairly watery and her comment to that effect jogged my memory and I ran down what I had seen a week and a half ago. She proceeded to examine her and found she was VERY skinny - her keel bone projecting quite a bit. I, admittedly, had not weighed her in a while, but her normal weight is 90g. +/- 3 or so, but never below 85g. She weighed in at just 81g. She drew blood, asked me a ton more questions about environment, toys, possible food contamination, organic nuts, etc. My head started to spin. She mentioned diabetes, PDD, and a million other things. She asked me if I had any questions and my response was, "Honestly, I'm in shock. Just tell me what to do." Through all of this, Anya looked 'normal' to me - even eating in front of the vet - until they took her blood. After that, she got quiet, fluffed up, and tucked her head in her back - and that made me very worried. I waited while she did the fecal exam which found an imbalance in the gram stain. We were sent home with a bottle of Baytril and I was told she was going to rush the labs to try to find out what was going on. I had planned to just take the birds with me to work, but knowing she was sick, I didn't want to stress her and ended up taking them home. This was all wrapped up around 10:30 a.m. Around 6:00 that evening, just as we were sitting down to dinner, the vet called me. She was very concerned. Anya's uric acid levels were VERY high. I forget the exact values now, but I think she said normal is around 12 (or maybe that's 'elevated') and hers were around 27. This was an indication that her kidneys were in distress. Her white blood count was 'a little' elevated, but not 'a lot,' so it seemed to her like more than a simple infection. She was suddenly overloading me with a lot of information but I was able to pull out a few items. First, she was not concerned about whatever this was being contagious to Spencer. Second, she highly recommended getting her to an emergency vet and not waiting until Monday. She suggested Animal 911 in Skokie, a place I knew well because unfortunately that's where my budgie had died almost two years ago (NOT their fault at all). She said she would call them, let them know I was going to be coming, and would forward the lab results and her other notes. She was also going to get a monetary estimate from them and call me back. I found my wife and 5 year old daughter at the table and tried desperately not to cry in front of them. I choked down a burger but really wanted nothing more than to get going. At some point the vet called back and let me know that for the weekend, I might expect to pay at least $800. I told my wife and she just said, "Wow. Ok." Never questioning if we should spend that kind of money on a 12-year ld bird we'd gotten for under $100. That's one reason I married her. On the drive home from the restaurant, I explained to our daughter that Anya was very sick and that I was going to take her to try to get her better, but that it was possible she was not coming home. When we got home, I packed up some food for her, we each held her and scratched her head a bit, and I headed out for the 45 minute drive. They took her in, had me leave a $915 deposit (the low end of the revised estimate), answered any questions I had, and made me feel very at ease that she would be getting great care. They told me that they would only call me if there was a problem, that no news was good news, but that I was free to call them as often and at any hour as I wanted. The plan was 'fluid therapy' to flush the uric acid and try to kick-start her kidneys, as well as IM antibiotics to try to knock out any infection, with a retest of her blood panel on Monday morning to see if she had improved. Saturday I was told she was looking better, and Sunday we visited, brought her some more food, and got a few more details. It wasn't until I saw how alert she was on Sunday that I realized that she HAD been sick for a while, but the change was SO gradual and slight, that despite interacting with her every day, I had missed it. I'd started to beat myself up about missing the signs, especially the weight loss, earlier, but to their credit, each of the 5 vets I've now spoken with have reminded me how hard such illness is to spot in birds. Her radiograph showed 'something interesting.' Initial thoughts were a foreign, possibly heavy metal, body or a partially formed egg, but the most popular opinion now seems to be a calcified shell gland. The idea is that the shell gland is diseased, got infected, and brought about the rest. I saw her again this morning (Monday) and she was looking good again. She was transferred from the emergency vet to the regular clinic (same building, different entity, but thank god, slightly better rates) and we reviewed the plan. Luckily, the original vet is on Team Anya and was gracious about her staying 'in-house' there instead of going through the stress of transferring back to her. Perhaps it should be expected, but I don't want to take it for granted. Everyone has really been the bright stars through all of this. Now the plan is to recheck uric acid and white blood cell levels, administer a dose of Lupron to attempt to shut down her egg production, keep her at least one more night, and hopefully bring her home tomorrow. Best-case long-term will be ongoing monitoring of her blood panel and management of her breeding response through Lupron and environmental controls. Worst-case, of course, is that her kidneys do not respond and I'd imagine I only have a few days left with her. Wait and see. Wait and see. Wish us luck. For those keeping score at home, the vet total, minus Spencer's share, is about $1,400. That does not account for future shots of Lupron ($50/ea) and exams/panels. I include that here as information for those considering getting a bird - or those who already have birds and haven't yet had a 'rainy day.' Know what you're getting into and what you may need to spend. I don't have that kind of money in total just sitting around. I'm 'normal folk,' and it's going to take some sacrifice to pay all of it off, but there was never a question of spending it or not. Also I'd like to point out that this 'happened' despite knowing about the risks of reproduction attempts, even in non-breeding birds. One of my childhood budgies died of egg-binding. My recent budgie, Nimue, had laid a lot of eggs, despite 'doing all the right things' of light control, not stimulating her, etc. Anya, also, has always gotten 'breedy' come spring and fall just about every year, though only ever laid one egg. Thank you so much for reading.

Thanks, Aerial, unfortunately it's not good. She's at the emergency vet until at least Monday when they can retest her levels - her kidneys are not functioning. Rough day. BTW, for those curious, that's going to run AT LEAST $915 - on top of about $200 earlier this morning. Future parrot owners - are you ready for that? Thank goodness for credit cards and 'rainy day' stashes. And yeah, that's for a $100 cockatiel. And I'd spend it again in a heartbeat. I'm exhausted. More later. Thanks for any well-wishes you can pass along.

Like just about everything else regarding birds, it seems not everyone agrees. I've seen some people say the soy inks are OK, some say the pages/inks are OK, but the glossy covers are bad. Some have concerns about the glue in the binding. One of the "safer" ideas I've heard to address those issues is to remove the covers, and hang the book through the ceiling bars - so they're primarily chewing/shredding the pages, avoiding the spine. I'm sure other opinions will be along shortly.

Very cool. Good luck. I'm going to visit on 2/11.

My two cents - I am currently kicking myself for NOT keeping up my regular weigh-ins (used to do them pretty much daily with 'tiel and budgie for over 3 years and then trailed off - it was great step-up practice). Not to mention annual check-ups. We were just at the vet for the first 'wellness' check in a while for both birds. Anya, my 'tiel, is NOT 'well,' and is down nearly 10% in mass, which I SHOULD have noticed earlier but didn't despite being pretty in tune with her. I did notice she had an 'off' day on her food/poop last week but seemed to have recovered, so I just thought it was stress. She's small, usually around 90g, but was only 81g today. She's very thin. I checked her history and despite fluctuations from 85-97g, this is the lowest she's been in 12 years. Seeing her hit 85g would definitely have raised the alarm sooner. (She's on Baytril now and waiting on blood tests. May start a thread on her as well as Spencer's visit once I know more.)