oblivion

We may have to agree to disagree on this, but I doubt as many birds are "saved" as some would like to believe when the original poster is shouted off the forum. As for best intentions, they are easily lost interrible delivery.

Mine are OK. Posting this mostly as a thread-bump.

Fist of all, congrats on your retirement from the NYPD. A Grey is a great gift to yourself. Being a detective, I do not doubt your spidey sense were tingling regarding the seller. I might have expected you to ask a few more questions at the time, but things are different when you're emotionally involved, right? I hope it all checks out and was nothing more than an odd situation. Lola sounds like a great bird and like katana600, as the owner of a rehome with a more difficult collection of baggage, I'm a little envious of your easy start. It's a shame about your first birds, but life happens despite our best intentions. Lola is your chance to make it up to those first parrots - if you believe in Karma or the like. Welcome, and please keep us updated on Lola.

Yikes! Best wishes. I think Jay gave some good advice, but I can't imagine what vinegar would feel like in a fresh cut! Yikes! If it's any consolation, blood seems to have a way of looking like there's a lot more of it than there actually is - especially when it gets sprayed around. Good luck getting to the vet.

WOW. And now I'm forced to reconsider everything. Another embarrassing outburst like what happened in the "Welcome" room, and I'm going to have to copy all of my posts, make a few Facebook friends, and say good bye. MANY of the responses in the thread wulfie started were disgusting to read. Wow.

Oral meds are much different than hand feeding, but you raise a good point, Wingy. Even med dispensing should be demonstrated by someone who knows how to do it. There's always a chance for aspiration if done wrong.

Also, if a she, just think of her as "Melissa Gilbert" from Little House on the Prairie.

I literally have sweet tears in my eyes. You may be a self-described curmudgeon, but I'm a softy and not afraid to admit it. WAY TO GO, GILBERT (and Dee and Rachel)!!!

No one any more, thanks to the responses to this thread, so it's irrelevant.

Yay Java!!! May any news from the vet be as positive. Your last description of Java 'taking' her meds just gave me an idea, and I don't know why I hadn't though of it through my whole ordeal with Anya. Once every couple days, it might be a good idea to give our healthy birds a 'treat' via syringe just to desensitize them to the process a bit. Just a drop or two of juice or the like. Sure, it would only fool them the first time they got meds, but at least they wouldn't be fearful of the syringe, etc. Does anybody do that already?

Dave, thanks for the title change. Today was MUCH better as far as trust/cage aggression. Hopefully it is just a matter of settling in more. He's still skittish of toys and such, but I can walk around the house with him with little nervousness. It's really quite a sight when I take them down to the kitchen in the morning to prepare their and the bunny's veggies. In one hand, I have Spencer's "gettin' around" cage, with Navroh perched on that wrist. My other hand will have last night's bowls to take downstairs to clean, perhaps with my cell phone, etc. I think it shows a fair amount of trust that he doesn't freak out nor try to work up to my shoulder from there - even Anya was nervous about it from time to time. He stays pretty reliably on a play gym while I do my kitchen stuff, munching on morning treats, etc. He definitely likes me, seems to love my daughter, and for whatever reason, does NOT like my wife. he'll tolerate her most times, but when she simply walks by him on a stand, he'll get defensive and open is beak towards her. I don't know if it's her clothes, jewelry, hair, or just HER, but hopefully that will work out in time with treats, food prep, etc. I'm going to contact the shelter that had him before he got shuffled through his last home and see if they can give me any more information about him, especially toys and play styles he might like. He's still eating well - better than the first day - and he's actually added about 4 grams. I'll make sure he doesn't bulk up too much, but I think he had a rough week last week, so I'm sure he was a little light.

I found out today that "Navaro," is actually "Navroh." I still have NO clue where such a name comes from, but it turned up some interesting google hits. Without speculating too much, the dude's recent past looks really shaky. I'm amazed he's as sweet as he is and think it explains some of his trust issues with the cage, etc. It's always a mystery with these rehomes. Always.

THAT is a great vet visit. I hope the test results are ate least as well-behaved. Those blood draws really seem to take it out of them. Every month when Anya would get hers, she'd be done for the day - just hunker down on her perch and wait it out. Whether it was annual time or not, I think it's a very good idea for you to have taken Gilbert in given Java's mystery illness. Way to be, bird mamma!

Need to check at home, I use these all the time. Thanks for the heads up. Though I freeze the bulk of the food to keep moths at bay (started an infestation long ago with a bag of wild bird food in the garage and they never REALLY go away), so I'm not overly concerned about their potential spoilage. But yes, I will check.

Oh sure, they do lending, but Em made some good money with a lemonade stand on Saturday, so we're going halvsies on the book. She even helped me feed him this morning, and she's NEVER helped with the birds, so that's something. We are going to check out some other parrot books, but this one seemed like a 'buy.' Thanks for the tips. As he's settling in more, Nav is proving to be fairly cage-aggressive. Though he still had pellets from last night, he was FRANTIC for his Nutraberries this morning and wasn't very nice about it. I may try doing his initial morning feeding up on his play-top to get him to 'forage' away from his 'roost' and try to disperse some of that aggression. It's amazing how quickly the fight/flight responses kick in on prey critters that are otherwise so sweet. The good news is that before we had to leave for the day, I was able to easily get him out of the cage and have my daughter hold him a bit - good for both of them. She recognized him getting crabby again, and after he tried marching up to her shoulder, she calmly had him step down on his cage door, gave him a treat, and we closed him in and said good day. I'm really impressed with how she's working with him. So far he's had zero interest in toys/playing, but I know it's early, so I'm not fretting that.

Ha, Greywings, I really never know who is training whom! I am glad that we've figured each other's quirks out fairly well. Of course the only times I have 'trouble' with him are when I don't have time - he was stubborn about going back this morning before work as well, but this time from the floor. It's a little frustrating in the moment, but it ALWAYS ends on a good note, and I appreciate the fact that he's got that character and isn't cage-bound in a corner. Birdhouse, I know it's early to tell, and may only be temporary, but so far Spencer seems to be taking many opportunities to remind me we're buddies. On Saturday morning, he came out of his room and climbed up on our bed where my daughter and I were watching Scoobie Doo. That's only the second time he's done that. Yesterday I was sitting on the floor of their room, and he was never much more than a foot or so from me. He doesn't like contact, but he does like to be close. I also see that, as with Anya, after a session of fun with Navaro, Spencer seems even more interested in me. I like to think he's thinking, "Hey, that looks like fun! Maybe _I_ could try that . . . some day." It's like jealousy that hasn't gotten ugly yet. I'll be careful to watch for signs of going over that line. He still gets plenty of time of my just looking at/talking to him and our night-time routine is unchanged. We're still buds. So far. The only time he gave Navaro any notice was yesterday when in a lime-green flash, Navaro stormed Spencer's open travel cage's food bowl. That was too much for Spencer and luckily I was right there to intervene. If they want to work out stuff out on a play gym, that's one thing, but they are NOT going to tangle in a tiny cage which belongs to the bigger bird. I was willing to get bit to break them up, but luckily it didn't come to that. I will be more vigilant about when I have them both out, though, and make sure Nav knows where HIS food is.

Wingy, I saw that book referenced elsewhere, but our small-town library is lacking. I have her "Well-Behaved Parrot," and I LOVE having animal books on hand, so Amazon is putting it in a box for me as I type. Thanks for the recommendation. Speaking of "Well-behaved," we flipped through that just before making the video - I was teaching Em about the index and how to use it to find everything the book says about Quakers. Based on what she mentions there, she's clearly a fan of them. Makes sense she wrote a whole book about them! Thanks, everyone else, for the kind words. I just put the boys to bed (the birds and I are the only males in the house!) - Spencer was grinding away at his beak while Navaro was doing that purr thing he's done while I was petting him. It doesn't get much better. BTW, I'm still not sure about that name, but he seems to know it (as I was told he does). Earlier today he was out on a boing and nodding off. I quietly said, "Hey, Em, look at Navaro." As soon as I got to his name, he popped awake and got to looking busy. Pretty funny.

I've carried this story over to the Quaker room, but I wanted to kind of wrap a few things up here. First, thanks for all of the responses here. I appreciate each one and the time they took to create. If I didn't end up with the bird you presented just realize I'm not done with this bird stuff yet. I got a little flighty at the end (pun only slightly intended), but I think it all worked out as it was supposed to. A bird needed a home. I needed a bird. We're still friends after 3 days. Win-win. Wingy, to your comments, YES they can pinch! Wow. Not Grey strength, but MAN. My wife signed off on the noise level as she worked from home on Friday and said Spencer was still louder. Hopefully they don't make a competition out of it! Yesterday I was trying to catch a nap after a hard day in the sun, when Navaro woke me with some screeching. Of course it was more grating since I'd been sleeping, but in a way it was kind of sweet because it sounded like a louder, deeper version of our old budgie. Brought back some memories. I waited for him to stop screeching then went in there and did some work on his cage (switched which side the food doors are on and moved perches so I could turn it 90 degrees for a better fit in the corner), put the new runner under it, and generally straightened up and gave him some out-of-cage time. Not a bad way to follow up (but not reward with drama) a screech session. Today, no such screeching as we spent a lot of time with both birds. Thanks again, everyone.

Edit: Turns out, it's "Navroh!" I can't change the thread title, though. On Thursday, we brought home a 5-year old-ish Quaker who had just been returned from is second, but very brief home. I started typing a HUGE version of this, but I decided just to post a short version first. We brought him home 'under no obligation,' and since we'd had a few small issues - notably between he and my wife - I didn't want to post this thread until I was sure he was staying here. It looks like unless he robs a bank in the next day or two, he's in. As I said, he's about 5. I have very few details about his past. His first home was a family of unkown size. His reason for leaving is also unknown to me. From what I gather about his second home, he was recently adopted as a companion for an older Quaker as the woman who adopted him worked nights and thought her first bird needed company. As close as I can understand, Navaro was returned because instead of befriending the other bird, he always wanted to be with the woman. The horror, right? Oh well. For some silly reason, I don't have a ton of pictures yet, but I'll work on that. I did post one in my 'Which bird?' thread but I'm due for more. He's quite yellow (the pallid mutation?), and a real looker. Though he was VERY sweet the first night with only one errant nip due to a hand-off mis-cue with my wife, he's gotten a little more assertive here at the house. I've found he can be quite possessive of his food bowls, though luckily his cage has good swing-out food doors. He's also nailed me once or twice when not wanting to step up for one reason or another. He had one tense moment today when he flew (despite a pretty sever clip he came with) into the kitchen and quickly found his way into Spencer's food on his kitchen play stand. I got nailed keeping them separated, luckily not by Spencer, but everyone calmed down quickly. No blood, no foul. So, as you can tell from that last bit, I opted not to do a strict quarantine. Both birds have full blood and fecal panels from the last 6 months and though Navaro was in a house with another bird for a time and spent a couple hours at the vet, I decided to go half-assed. I use hand-sanitizer between food/water prep and handling of each, am trying not to let them share toys or perches yet, etc., but I'm not deluding myself that it's real precaution. Calculated risk. I'm actually more cautious with Anya's old toys and perches - I bleached them all last week - since, though I ASSUME I know why she died, it is, of course, possible she had pick up a secondary illness along the way. The really cool thing is that my daughter, nearly 6, is LOVING this new bird. She can not handle Spencer at all (heck, neither can I), and Anya was SO MUCH my bird that any time she would hold her, she'd just up and fly to me. AND Anya was scared of everything - and a 5-year old is capable of EVERYTHING. Navaro, though, is a REALLY good sport and she's quickly learned not to be timid on step-ups and how to keep her elbows low to keep him from creeping up to her shoulder. He can be a bit of a snot on the shoulder - in fact the one issue they saw during his brief stay at the vet's was getting nippy about shoulder removal. I'm not big on shoulder birds anyway, so we are being firm with keeping him off until a latter day, if ever. Typing this out, I wonder if that was the second-owner's main problem. She said he always flew off his gym to her. I discounted that story because the play top was TOTALLY spotless, like he was never up there. But if he DID always fly to her, I bet he landed on or charged up to her shoulder, and then she couldn't handle him. Ah, the mystery of a re-home. My wife, who unfortunately met with TWO early nips and had me worried was going to call the whole thing off, stipulated that "As long as he's nice to my kid, he can stay." you tell me, how are we doing? Just before that, we also had him playing peek-a-boo with a towel and was TOTALLY cool with it. Also, I already know he's a sucker for safflower seeds, as Spencer is, so training treats are figured out. He's not (yet) big on toys, but I'm expecting he's still got some shell to come out of and will get even more out-going. And one other small thing - it's so funny to actually see a bird heat with its feet. Spencer only does VERY rarely since he's so lacking of toes, and neither Anya nor our old budgie Nim did at all. Anyway, so far, so good. Tomorrow I'll call the lady we got him through and at that point she'll push the adoption paper and he'll be ours. (And yes, believe it or not, this is the SHORT version.

Oh man, do I know about the meds, and I sympathize. Even though Anya was tiny, never a biter, and loved me to pieces, ishe could really make it difficult. Worse than her beak, more than once, her toe nail would find one of my cuticles. OUCH! Only having to do it once a day is a blessing. Keep your spirits up. Best wishes.

I'd wondered how much that stand would be able to handle. Good call on beefing it up.

Curious, did either of you clean the limbs in any way? I know some people to a bleach soak in a kiddie pool or the like. I've used fresh breanches out of my yard before, but I wonder if I'm too cavalier.

Wow, what an ordeal. This makes me even more appreciative to have a 24/7 emergency exotics vet a mere hour away. I can't imagine what you're going through. Even though I just weathered Anya's illness with her, the way Java's came on is just shocking. Heart-wrenching. I wish you all the best regarding her and Gilbert's health, and just as important, I wish you peace over the weekend as you wait for results. Hang in there, Java!!!

So, I DID listen to your words - I even took the small car and no carrier with only the intention of meeting Navaro, not packing a bird and playtop cage home. But, well, scroll up and look at that kid's face. Mine was just about as excited. It's not like he landed on her head at a park, but it's just shy of being that perfect. So far, no major cries of distress from my wife at home.

So, now there's a new-to-us Quaker in the house. Being careful not to cut into Spencer time, I had him out of his cage this morning, and he was up on his boing harassing his bell. It came time for me to go to work and I can often, but not always, get him to 'put himself away' on request. And even if he doesn't go right into his big cage, I can USUALLY get him onto the door of his travel cage, which he loves, and THEN get him into 'home.' Today, he wasn't having it. HE wanted his bell time. I tried luring him with treats, the pointer we use for 'touch,' and even tried a step-up or two, but he just kept climbing up the boing to get his bell. I though I could thwart the little snot by holding the bell away from him, off to the side. That "gimpy" little booger climbed ALL the way up the boing, across the grated top, and down the bell itself to ring it as I held it. FAKER!!!! At that point, I broke and had to laugh. I let him have a few more good rings and then tried the travel cage again, which he eventually climbed onto. He took his sweet time going from there into his big cage, but he eventually did to a shower of "Good birds!" and a safflower seed. Turk-ey. I really wish I'd gotten a picture of him hanging from the ceiling by his 4 little nubs on one foot. Amazing.