harmonicaman68

If you are still in question about the quality of the stainless steel, get a strong magnet (sometimes available is good hardware stores) and try the test with that.

Yes. No pull would mean top quality stainless from a corrosion resistance perspective. The weak pull means it is stainless, but with less nickel. Strong pull would indicate it is just plain steel or iron. No pull means it is stainless of such a quality that the nickel content (which provides the degree of corrosion resistance) is high enough to reduce the pull of the magnet entirely.

If the magnet is weak (like a refrigerator magnet) then there will only be a weak pull. If the magnet is weak (like a refrigerator magnet) then there will only be a weak pull. By the way ... a bit of steel wool will remove any rust that eventually forms on stainless steel of lower quality. If someone inadvertently purchases a lower nickel content stainless cage instead of a type 304 stainless cage, don't beat yourself up over it. Just remove any corrosion that forms. It is still better than painted or powder coated cages. The magnet test (and I take a strong magnet with me if I intend to purchase something that is stainless steel) is good to identify before purchase.

I practiced architecture for years. A number of years ago, we had the stainless steel hardware on exterior doors begin to show rust (which it should never have done given the grade of stainless steel specified), and found on investigation that the contractor had substituted an inferior grade of hardware finish for the specified type. The contractor had to change out the hardware at his own cost. We proved his deception through the use of magnets. This substitution is common practice among manufacturers to maximize profits. I noticed on gas stainless steel barbecue grills a few years ago, that the only stainless that was of high grade was the actual burner. All other stainless would attract a magnet and therefore would eventually slowly show rust. You are doing well to check your purchase before hand. If we all refuse to purchase inferior materials, eventually those manufacturing with inferior materials may get the message.

The way to test for the highest grade stainless steel is to use a magnet. If a magnet sticks to the stainless steel, then it has too much iron and not enough nickel to protect it against corrosion.

Jayd ... did the vet take Spock off of the Batril when the blood smear showed no signs of infection? I assume that antibiotic drops would have been stopped.

Hi Jay. You mentioned that the vet gave shots to Spock. What were they? Also, how old is Spock now?<br><br>Post edited by: harmonicaman68, at: 2010/02/17 12:41

Prayers do work. GO SPOCK !!! Keep that weight on. Hang in there Jayd

Geryt video of Emma !!! You are inspiring me to get an atom for Ziva. What size did you get? I know they make different sizes and the one you purchased is large enough to have that nice sized toy installed inside.

I'm learning that regardless of what one hears ... there is no substitute for reading the scientific literature. Anecdote and hearsay do not assure safety. With Mali, I noticed that she never ate anything in abundance the first time. It made me think that she was testing first. After a few introductions, if she felt no adverse affects, she would eat the food. That is no failsafe method of feeding our fids either, but it did give insight to the way birds choose what is safe in the wild.

We haven't been through a molt with Ziva yet, but had a Sun Conure for 16 years who was VERY gentle. She got touchy when she molted and I always attributed it to the fact that the feathers came in with their sharp sheath to protect the feather. It must have felt as if I was touching her with a pin cushion full of pins when I touched her body. I left her alone for a time to let the pin feathers come in far enough that they didn't directly stick her when I touched ... and that made it better. Then I later noticed that a good bath and drying with a hair dryer helped to dry out the feather sheath. It made it easier to crumble by pinching the sheath with my finger nails. Gently allopreening your bird will make you popular, but don't force it. The sheath needs to be dry. A fresh sheath just dents and the bird will sometimes get poked as you try to crumble the sheath ... not a popular thing to have happen. Wait until the feather is completely in ... then dry ... then remove sheaths that they can't reach by themselves. Good preening :-) Post edited by: harmonicaman68, at: 2010/02/06 13:46<br><br>Post edited by: harmonicaman68, at: 2010/02/06 13:48

I love it! Connecting the dots and realizing the "Apple" is the object of their desire.

I had heard nothing about apple seeds and so have been letting Ziva tear into an apple and eat any portion she wants. No negative affects noted, but she has been so enamored with tearing the thing apart and spreading the resulting mash around the area that she has paid little attention to the seeds. If she has ingested more than one out of an entire apple being destroyed, I'd be surprised.

Congrats to Dixie on her flights! ... isn't it nice when your fid calls "mom" and comes to you ? She sounds like a happy camper :-) Now the neural pathways need to be built and her cardiovascular needs to improve through practice. Those are reasons for the seemingly slow progress (to us) but truly magnificent progress you are seeing in Dixie. I've recently heard of a breeder who is imping the flight feathers of parrots to allow them to fly if their humans have changed their minds about clipping. It allows the parrot to begin retraining for flight ... developing the neural pathways of the brain sooner and keeping the muscle mass from being lost. A B&G that was imped shortly after being clipped began flying again almost immediately. If the bird was clipped before the neural pathways formed and left clipped for the first year (until the first molt) ... they may fly, but never as naturally as a bird that was full flighted from birth.This has to do with neural pathway development, but also with muscle mass and with cardiovascular. If the feathers are restored quickly through imping, brain damage can be avoided and heart/lung and muscle mass developed nearly on a normal schedule. I am SO happy you decided to let Dixie be flighted. Her personality can develop and she can be what she was designed to be.

TPU ---This has been a great conversation. It makes me wonder what other foods may have been cautioned against, where the "evidence" about not feeding them to our birds is only anecdotal. I was especially interested in the specific proportions of seed in a human's diet that may be harmful and how that is reduced to a smaller number in birds. I assume this is a number based on body weight, just as a physician would proportion a "dose" of medicine for a child at a smaller amount than for an adult human. Jayd ... no worries about TPU caution against being "short sighted". I believe that most readers here understood what TPU meant. We can each inadvertently make a choice that is short sighted by not preparing our birds for the day when they will mistakenly fly out a door or window. Personally, this conversation has raised my awareness that I should start preparation of Ziva for that very thing. In that way ... this conversation has been beneficial about more than just food ... I'm going to begin purposed socialization of Ziva toward some survival skills. No one wants their feathered friend to escape, but we all want them to survive long enough for us to find them before a predator does.

Praying that Spock and Risha are 100 percent restored to good health !!!

I very much appreciate what Shanlung has done to develop a harness style that is able to be made at home, inexpensively by those owned by Greys and other breeds of birds. I also have much benefited by his wonderful posts about the adventures that can be lived by out flighted friends (and ourselves) when we allow the Greys who own us to be and do what God created them to do ... fly, forage, explore, play, play jokes ... and even prod us to appreciate them as the very different companions they are. When one thinks outside of the box as Shanlung has done ... and takes our personal flighted friend along on casual day trips or longer ... there is no end to the variety or benefit. I would like to clear one thing up. I don't get anything for recommending any harness type. I do have my birds use the Aviator because I believe it to be of excellent construction and easier (if not safer) to obtain for those of us who may not feel comfortable (or safe) making our own. It isn't one size fits all, but comes in a number of sizes to fit small birds like my daughter's green cheek conure, middle sized birds like our late sun conure Mali, larger sizes for Greys and Amazons and even larger for blue and gold macaws or hyacinths. Further, at least the Aviator harnesses has been around for over a decade now. I've had one of the Aviator harnesses since 1999 or 2000 when I paid the going retail price that that time ... $19.95 US for one for Mali as Steve Hartman was developing the Aviator including the selection of material for chew resistance, the welded stitching, the shock cord, the attachment of the shock cord (apparently stretchy material is difficult to reliably attach to other materials), etc. The harness I bought for Mali in 1999 was subtly different than the one I purchased for Ziva in 2009. It is good to recognize that all makers of the various harnesses are continuing to think about the products they have developed and try to improve them. I believe the Aviator has about 9 patented innovations that make it unique to other harnesses. Steve manufactures to specifications he developed and tested. To my knowledge he still does some manufacturing or repair of materials himself. I know he has the equipment and that he personally packages the harnesses and sends out orders daily. No large workforce of laborers. Just Steve. The folks on the GreyForums site who have ordered them from Steve Hartman know he isn't a "big company". He gives personal attention to assure that each order is handled promptly. On his website, look at the home and grounds of the aviary he works out of. He is a sole proprietor of a modest parrot breeding operation on an acreage just north of Westerville, Ohio. It is Steve and a few volunteers who love parrots (1 on weekdays and 3 or 4 on weekends to help with visitors during the summer). His wife works as a nurse to make ends meet. One of the nice innovations of the Aviator is the DVD that comes with it. It helps folks to learn how to successfully put the harness on their bird without spooking the bird ... Some of this related material is available for viewing online if your internet speed good. Those videos reveal that the Aviator isn't like any harness I have seen by others except that all harnesses are designed to fit the bird's body. The adjustment is easier than most (although I agree with some other posts here that it is easier as a two handed adjustment than just trying to do it one handed). It is also easier if you introduce your bird to it early in their life. My suggestion is not to wait for a special occasion to get it for your Grey. Get it as early as possible and put it on often ... even if you aren't going outside. Try to do enjoyable things together with your birds with the harness on so they know it means fun. I didn't get a harness for Mali until she was about 6 years old. She got so she knew the harness meant fun, but she was relieved to have it off. Ziva has worn the harness since her feathers first came in. She knows the harness means fun and her body language does not noticeably change ... she wants the harness on to go ... when we get back, she stands still to allow me to gently take it off ... beaks it a bit and then flies or runs off to play like a kid who has just had their winter coat and boots removed when they returned indoors. It is just a different form of play to her. I'm sorry that this conversation has apparently hurt Shanlung. Shanlung's innovations and research into how to make a harness at home are applauded. It is just that some who don't feel qualified to construct a harness that is secure, nevertheless want our birds to have the experience that Shanlung has shown us SHOULD be made available as we try to improve the quality of life of our feathered friends. To me ... the real teaching I have received from Shanlung is not the harness ... but that I need to consider Ziva's quality of life. During the 16 years that Mali lived, I didn't take her out on the harness nearly enough. With Ziva ... partly because of Shanlung's example ... I take Ziva to work at least 1 day per week. I take her out on weekends as well ... Shanlung has caused me to take Ziva's life experiences in a different direction that has helped her personality and skills to emerge more fully and has simultaneously made Terri's and my life much improved for the enriched experiences. I believe that this is the motivation that Steve Hartman has had as well. Praise God there are people who have been motivated to be innovators in their attempts to make the lives of our flighted companions more fulfilled. Shanlung, you and innovators like you have helped us remove the blinders. Shanlung ... I'll look into supporting the charity you recommended.<br><br>Post edited by: harmonicaman68, at: 2010/02/04 12:28

whg - - Some interesting features of the Aviator include the construction of the line from the harness to your wrist. It is a shock cord that is stiff, but not so stiff as to jerk the parrot when it reaches the end. Shanlung on his blog has referred to the strength of a Grey's flight when spooked. I agree. The first times I had Ziva outside she spooked. When she came to the end of her harness tether the force was VERY hard and the shock cord of the Aviator stretched so as to gently turn her. I was amazed at the speed and strength of her flight and the pull on my wrist for a bird that was only 3 months old at the time. The stretchy shock chord did not pull her up short as a dog leash with no give would have done. I believe it's stretchy property kept Ziva from being harmed by the interaction between the strength of her flight and the strength of a harness to resist her. After having experienced this. I believe that any good harness, homemade or otherwise should probably include the stretchy property of a six foot to twelve foot shock chord with 100 percent elongation properties, in between the harness and the place the parrot is anchored. Ziva's strength in flight has increased MUCH now that she is 8-1/2 months old. She keeps practicing and lengthening her flights. Thanks goodness for a strong yet gentle tether.

Hi whg ... the harness you reference is not the Aviator. The Aviator is the lightest of the harnesses that are commercially available. They come in multiple sizes and have no rings for the bird to worry at. If you have another harness you like or want to build your own as Shanlung has suggested, I wish you well. Personally, I would love to see how Shanlung builds his. It would be fun to try.

WHG ... try the Aviator Harness and the Flight Line extension for it. You can see it in action and order it at http://www.hartmanaviary.com/ Ziva forages and flies to me when startled, but there are no worries about her getting lost and becoming a meal for a predator, because the harness allows quality of life AND safety. Quality of life requires there be life. Thanks to Shanlung, danmcq, Pearllyn, RockysMum and whg for this conversation. I'm challenged to keep Ziva flighted and to work with her all the more on the Aviator Harness. What an incredible honor to be given an opportunity of friendship with the Greys who have accepted us.

Here is a report that sheds light from a different viewpoint. http://www.kusi.com/weather/colemanscorner/81583352.html

Hi Jay and Maggie !!! Thanks, Jay, for moderating this new room for those of us who want to learn more. Blessings to both of you. To you Jayd for sharing your knowledge and to you Maggie for sharing Jayd. It's no small thing that you both commit to helping others.

Hi Jill ... Thanks for the compliment ... I agree, Terri is beautiful Jingles ... yes ... Kara (our daughter-in-law) had a midwife present. She and Michelle (our other daughter-in-law) use the same midwife. I always worry a bit with home births, but these ladies are CHAMPS and our sons really support their decision to give birth at home. They have even influenced our youngest daughter to go with no pain meds with her second child. The babies are SO much more alert when they don't come into this world drugged. I've been amazed kittykittykitty ... I can assure you that Terri didn't take offense When I read her this thread, she was beaming almost as much as in the picture! Blessings to ALL!

CuteMandaPanda, Pearllyn, Jilly, Judy and all, Thanks for the well wishes. You are right ... what an amazing and wonderful day! Blessings to all of you. Jack