shanlung

kukushka, Trust your heart. Be she/he be baby or adult, and you feel she/he is the one for you, you will know. Be understanding with them at all times. You will be rewarded with more than you expect. There is another thread I started. http://http://www.greyforums.net/forums/african-grey/79118-getting-a-very-young-bird.html#79179 Do not be afraid to read that. After all, that adult that you may get was that baby earlier on. The more you know about them the more you will be prepared to live a good life with them Shanlung

http://parrothouse.com/congotimineh.html Above is a very interesting article to read. Especially for those who are thinking of getting a very young not weaned bird (any kind of bird) in hope of bonding with. That is not even necessary as Tinkerbell was already past weaning when she came to me. Yingshiong was about 3 years old when he was captured from the wild and came to me when he was 5 years old. Yet you can see how they bonded with me. Getting birds young, or even getting 'hand-fed' birds might even work against you in the long run.<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/05/30 19:30

This poll pleased me. No need for me to say which way I voted as that answer is obvious. Its not just the poll, its the comments here that gladdened me together with the happiness expressed in your living with flighted parrot at home.

Anyone who try to make you think that you can safely fly your parrot outside if you buy and watch a video they made is lying through their teeth. So much depends on the temperament of the parrot, the temperament of the caregiver and the environment that they evolved together with. Make me feel sick to my stomach.

Zarlock wrote: I criss-crossed Bantienyen day after day. I touched base with whom I felt might be influential people there. No road or track junctions were without posters. Schools were blitzed by me and my wife to widen that circle of eyes. I might be a very pathetic sight to those there hearing me call out again and again. But I did gain their sympathies in addition to their warm wishes. Posters help, but that alone probably would not be enough. I gave them reasons to get back to me should sightings occured. No one there would suddenly aquired a grey without their neighbours knowing and getting back to me. Getting Tui back depends on the groundwork that you must do and in widening your network of eyes and ears. Do not lose hope. And now is not the time for despair and misery. There will be time for that after you get Tui back.

Terri, Listen to your heart. There is absolutely no need for you to try free flight. Allowing Bella and other of your birds to fly indoor is already superb of you and wonderful for them.

What a lovely looking spider. Nice macro shots you took.

Ozzy, Saying that even 'trained' parrots fly off into the distance is indeed your right. But it begs the question what kind of 'training' was done? If those 'training' was sound in the first place? And if the owner really understood what they should be doing instead of what they have done. I repost below a letter posted here about a year ago. It seems as relevent now as when I wrote it then. aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa More thoughts on wing clipping A letter from http://www.greyforums.net/forums/limitstart/30/african-grey/8152-wing-clipping.html Dave is an old friend from another forum that I met again in greyforums recently as MrSpock. MrSpock wrote: Proper wing clipping will allow a bird horozontal movement and the ability to glide downward to a floor. The ideal wing clip is one that allows a bird to fly about 8 ft before gliding down. Hi Dave, In an ideal world, what you say above may be right. The other extreme will be extremely severe clipping of wings. When I was in Riyadh and in a parrot shop, this grey jumped off the top of cage about 5 feet from ground. The sound of him hitting down, the spray of blood around him, and the screaming of that poor guy hurt me crazy. I do not wish ever to have another keel bone broken even if not in front of me. People clipped for a few key reasons. 1. They had been conditioned to that because of what they read or were told. This seemed to be peculiarly American. Tinkerbell wings were so nearly clipped by me at the beginning as the books I read all recommended that (all American books) as well as forums in 2002 when I first had Tinkerbell. I was lucky enough to bought a British parrot mag to give me second thoughts. 2. The sight of initial flights, the crashing into walls was extremely frightening and I thought my precious Tink was crazy in trying to fly through walls while I stumbled about chasing her with a pillow to cushion her falls after hitting the wall. Once again, I so nearly reached for that scissors and Tink the flyig grey of Taiwan so nearly did not exist. But that british mag persuaded me to let that continue for a few more days. She then found her flying skills to turn, slow, hover and stopped banging into walls. Folks, this episode is inevitable. Your birds may be natural fliers, but even so, they MUST develope their muscles , flying skills and sense of balance. But at this early stage, their speed will be very slow(even if it appeared fast to you) and chances of harm to them will be there. You can minimise this by letting them fledge in a small room, with curtains or rope nets around the walls for them to fly to and cling too. Or you can run around like me with a cushion. If you see a human toddler trying to walk and falling down, will you have fear for his/her safety and not ever let him discover balance and walk? Will you have him/her crawl for the rest of their life because you are afraid to see them fall? This is same as your choice for your bird. 3 By clipping wings and thinking thus the clipped bird will never fly away. I need not repeat my earlier postings of clipped birds that flown away. In what Dave said , that is true in an ideal world. Unfortunately, we live in the real world. But most people then went on to extrapolate that then, their bird will never be able to fly away. That is where I draw that line. So after you got that 'perfect clip' and your parrot then fly about 8 feet and not gaining height. But again, have that clip been tested under worse case condition? Such as a sudden blast of air horn , or a strange hat thrust in front to see if that parrot cannot gain height in a spook situation? Can you bear to do a sudden spook, or allow others to do that to your parrot? To see if that clipped wings hold good in spook conditions? And with Murphy at your elbows, how about throwing in that gust of wind at the same time? Can you ever guarantee such conditions will never ever occur to you? People had thought so. Their parrot paid heavier price than they did. Your choice again to see if you can beat those odds. On a different note Dave, I tried to log in to your old forum to let you and other friends there know about my last trip to be with Tink in Nov last year. If you did know, fine. If not, you might like to read this Tinkerbell Interlude photoset and videos, and start of next chapter of life. Also as to why I am now here in Brisbane , down under. http://shanlung.livejournal.com/65169.html Shanlung http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

There are other very fundamental principles to using harness. "Using harness" http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wUsingHarness.html with URLs to training and things to do with harness. and of course. Never ever hold leash in hand. ALWAYS CARABINER LEASH TO BELT OR TO BACKPACK.

lovemyGreys, I am just passing on what I learned from other giants, such as that birdwhisperer of Tsaoling. And what I was taught by Tinkerbell and Yingshiong. Pay attention to your beasties, they know more then you think. Training works both ways.

Lovemygreys, Harness will enable people to take their greys out safely. This is a slow process. And consists a bit more than just stuffing the bird into harness or even training the grey to accept harness. Harness is only the secondary restraint. The primary restraint must be the comfortness of the parrot with you. NEVER EVER HOLD THE HARNESS OR LOOP AROUND THE HAND. ALWAYS CARABINER THAT HARNESS TO YOUR BELT OR YOUR BACKPACK. I forgot my own rule and I nearly died. Read how that was punished. I was lucky. Do you want to go through what I went through? http://shanlung.livejournal.com/71760.html

Harness training is much more than just training the parrot to wear harness. It is a whole new mindset being brought into play. http://shanlung.livejournal.com/8284.html should be referred to for details

Jane said it pretty well. They have so much nuances and they do try hard to communicate that to you. Problem I think is that people are looking for easy solution. And the solution can be easy. Pay attention to them, and treat them with respect and dignity due to fellow sentients. Forget all those stuff about watching for their eyes to pin before biting. Their lunge can be lightning fast, and their pinning of eyes might be done in half a blink of an eye.

lovemygreys, Believe me, you have no idea how it felt to lose your grey. I have been through that first hand, twice. But with Tink back, tried as I might, I could not conjure again the depth of anguish and pain during those times when she was not back. THAT NIGHTMARE WAS SO HORRENDOUS THEN THAT ONLY A SHADOW OF THAT FEELING CAN EVER BE RECALLED. AND DURING THAT TIME, YOU FEEL LIKE DYING IS THE LEAST OF YOUR MISERY. Carly, My relationship with Tink is different now. She is not with me all the time and I get back about 1 month in the year. The places that we go to are out of this world. The beauty meant the terrain is also extremely rugged. With the harness, I could take her anywhere. And when we went out, its often from morning to late in the afternoon. Can you take your Carly for day long hikes in your Sierra mountains or Yellowstone park? And to continue to do that in new different places all the time? Do understand the environment and lifestyle are very different for the two of us. All greys are not the same. I know Tink spook very easily, maybe a lot more than yours. Also, Tink is no longer mine. She is Mr Yu, who kindly allowed me to take her out. If I take her out without harness in safe areas, that act might encourage Mr Yu to do the same. He just do not have the knowledge and 'feeling' to do that. I must act the example that I know he can follow safely. I have deep deep respect for Murphy and his army of assistants. They strike at time least expected. I prefer to plan for the worse scenarios, and not what I, or others, hope for.

Hi Matt, http://shanlung.livejournal.com/8284.html Above might be able to answer you, and with URLs embedded in it to give you explicit details how to do it. You might find answers to questions that you have not even thought of asking.

Welcome to this world of living with parrot, especially a grey. Since you are thinking seriously of allowing your Cheerio to be flighted, you should go into Tinkerbell webpage. She is my grey, flighted and would join me in the mountains and places in Taiwan. How that was done, and the training are written in detail. This will show you a window into living with a flighted parrot. http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/ Please read this earlier thread here on wing clipping. http://www.greyforums.net/forums/african-grey/8152-wing-clipping.html That thread will give you a lot of information for you to think about.

Raz is right. There is nothing easy or fast in flight training. Especially so for CAGs. CAGs spook very very badly. And when they spook, everything you trained them will be forgotten in those moments. Freeflight must never be undertaken lightly. You do not even know what nightmares are until you lost your CAG. I have been there. It is way way beyond your worse imagination. Take care. Read Tinkerbell Legacy - Part 2 in Tinkerbell webpage Warmest regards Shanlung http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

I am sorry to hear of your loss of Tui. Not withstanding what Raz said, I feel CAGs tend to spook too easily and are not the best candidate to free fly. When they spook, no 'bonding' will hold them back. Never mind if you have trained them for recall. During training, Tinkerbell flew to me without hesitation when given her cue. It is dangerous to think that recalls will get your parrot back when outside. Especially in my case where I was in Taiwan with Tink and we went to many rugged places in the mountains and forests there. That is why I believe in using a harness whenever we went out. You must train the parrot to wear harness. And that harness must at all times be carabinered to you or your backpack. A summary of that training and details of harness is in here http://shanlung.livejournal.com/8284.html I forgot to carabiner once in Dec 2007. Account in http://shanlung.livejournal.com/71760.html (which may be a roadmap as to what to do and who to reach out to) I flooded that area with posters and fliers. I was very lucky that Tinkerbell was returned, after 3 weeks. During that time, people comforted me that their parrot were recovered as late as a couple of months later. Tough as it is, do not lose heart. I hope you get Tui back. Warmest regards Shanlung http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

Tinkerbell - A good closure - April 2008 http://shanlung.livejournal.com/2008/04/

Folks, Thanks. Here is a happier Tinkerbell story that happened last weekend http://shanlung.livejournal.com/73532.html Warmest regards Shanlung

More self flagellation on my part. Tinkerbell - Bantienyen In Retrospect http://shanlung.livejournal.com/73232.html Warmest regards Shanlung

Thank you. I thought I consolidate into here. Just in case people coming into this thread think that there are no risks in what I have done. And in a way, how the pain can be like and how recovery is done. The Agony http://shanlung.livejournal.com/71760.html and the Ecstasy Tink is back with Yu family again http://shanlung.livejournal.com/72611.html and the details of that rescue Tinkerbell - Rescue at Bantienyen http://shanlung.livejournal.com/73198.html Warmest regards Shanlung http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/72611.html Above are the bare bones. I was too excited to get more details. I will do so today for a detailed report. Thank you for all your prayers. Warmest regards Shanlung

Merry Christmas from Tinkerbell, Shanlung and Joy from Taiwan. Total healing and final closure had been acheived by all of us. Blogging been on in Livejournal. http://shanlung.livejournal.com/2007/12/ Videos of us being uploaded and seen in http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=shimmertje&p=r Warmest regards Shanlung http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

An update. Come 20 Dec 07, me and my wife will fly off to Taiwan to be with sweet Tink again to mid Jan. I will blog that daily into my Livejournal. With the last farewell to Yingshiong, me and my wife decided its just too agonising to have to say goodbyes to creatures. No birds will get inside house unless it is fried, curried or roasted. Only when we are certain we stay on for a few years (no such thing as forever in our planet as of now), will we get a furry or feathered companion to live with. But wild beasties do befriend us. At first, only crows and bush turkey came regularly for the food I set for birds. The earlier flock of crows that I disliked swarming about the food dishes resolved itself to a single crow that condescend to patronising us. I do like this particular crow that you can see in video later. We called the crow Princess Mononoke http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_Mononoke And if you have not seen above, do yourself a BIG favour and see that movie. PM was given that name because she did this sound of one of the Kodamas (forest spirits) in that movie. We hung stuff in boxes that needed to be pull up feet over beak like Tinkerbell pulling up target stick on chain. PM did that after a few minutes and was the only crow here that did that. PM is still painfully shy and extremely wary, but less so of my wife. But then, I had to leave for office too early in morning. Placing food for PM to pull up (video in above) became a ritual for us. If I have more time later on, I will go into formal clicker training with wild creatures and see if that will be the bridge into deeper relationships with them to go beyond a bribe provider. Rainbow Lorikeets still fly about the trees across the road. I have yet to prepare the special food required for them to try to entice them to us. Two butcher birds that I mistakenly called currawongs are regular friends. One friendly and the other still very shy. The friendly one will fly through the open door to sing to me to announce his presence and will take mince from my hand. The shy one refused to take from my hand. A pied magpie is another regular caller on my verandah, a most beautiful and elegant creature. He apparently talk as captured by my wife in her videos http://http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=shimmertje&p=r Photos of birds coming to my feeders http://http://www.flickr.com/photos/shimmertje/sets/72157601924716943/ Bush tail possums came for their nightly feedings, a one eyed possum and what I call 'mother and child'. I was pleased that the possums will spook and run away when other people walked on the foot path 30-40 feet away. Yet the possums accepted us sitting a foot away from them. And just a few weeks ago, the child allowed me to stroke his back as well. His mom got used to me a while back already. Photos of bushtail possums at my veranda and allowing me stroking them http://http://www.flickr.com/photos/shimmertje/sets/72157601852137489/ Video of me stroking the possums are also in above. My wife keep a blog and update that a lot more regularly than I ever did that perhaps you might like to read as well. If you think you are a bad learner driver, you have not known my wife yet. I think driving instructors might even pay my wife not to engage them as driving instructor. After all, I am willing to continue to pay them to minimise stress on myself in teaching her how to drive. She is a lot better with birds and creatures than she is behind the wheel. http://http://shimmertje.livejournal.com/ Warmest regards Shanlung