shanlung

Thank you folks. Sorry if I do not reply to each of you individually. Instead of the 2 weeks I thought I would wait, I had a call this afternoon that Riamfada will be handed to me. I took her in and she is with me now, a most beautiful Congo African Grey.

luvparrot, that is fixed and you can read and see the photos there now. cflanny, it is a pleasure to be with folks that share love and passion for all things bright and beautiful. I probably learn more from all of you than you all did from me. Some of the most innocent questions from beginners with a day with their bird triggered my head into more overdrive than many of the sayings of people with decades keeping of birds. You all are on a long magical journey with your beasties and birdies. Take all you need from whatever you read and apply it if you see fit to your relationship with your creatures. The relationship should be equal with equals, and no one be the boss, you or them. Shanlung

Catching up in Muscat and Riamfada might fly with me. http://shanlung.livejournal.com/79690.html Warmest regards Shanlung (removed that extra http ! Sorry about that folks)<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/10/19 20:44

Remember all the wonderful times you have had with Alfie, and he have had with you. You both were priviledged in that your paths entwinned, making living that much more magical, even if the time was shorter than what you wanted. Passing on is part of life. Hurting will be less with time. Warmest regards Shanlung

Always secure and protect the perimeter of the flight space where your CAG lives. Door, especially those at perimeter (my back door to patio) opening to outside, that do not automatically close had been rigged by me to close themselves by jury rigged system of pulleys, Dyneema fishing line and heavy bottle of water as counter weight. Very ugly looking, but effective. Pity I did not take photos of those before , the ugliness of it was that embarrasing. Door at perimeter should have hanging curtain of heavy beads. It was not necessary for me at front door because door opened to lift lobby which was a sealed area. More perimeter protection explained in detail in Tinkerbell Legacy. Something you know about but not read, or read and discarded. Practise recall exercises with your parrot. When push comes to shove, that may not work. In fear and in totally strange environment, spook factor may predominate. When push comes to shove, that may not work. So do not rely on it. But it is so much better if your parrot recognised recalls and done it with you. Your heart/mind will become more confident instead of fearful that add to bad vibes spooking your parrot even more and making recovery more difficult. It is so much difficult for parrot to fly down than to fly up. You should train a parrot to fly down from heights. Read this old writing on the best angle to get an up parrot to fly down http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/w6gyrodrop.html Be paranoid and remain safe. Editted and added. Skuffy, I know the pain you are under. Thank you for your courage in letting people know and that may help others to avoid this.<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/09/29 07:23

<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/09/24 21:55

Ground rules are important. My earlier writings always stressed that. Why must it be assumed that no ground rules be applied? I always state that we are equals, not birdies /beasties at higher lever.<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/09/24 21:56

It is amusing to me, and to others here that allow free flight to their birdies in home to read of fears that the birdies poop at random and all over the place. In the case of Tinkerbell and of Yingshiong, there are at least 7 main areas that were made attractive for them to go. Cage doors were wired opened as food were kept in there. Other places would have water. Yet other places might have 'titbits' randomly placed there for 'foraging'. Yet other places might have favourite toys, changed now and then. In other words, those places were made attractive to them. Those places were 'named'. As part of our interactions would be to cue them to fly to those named places in order of calling. Doing just recalls would be boring to all parties and they are too intelligent to subject them to numbing repeats on repeats. It was only fair where there were places involute to them as I did chase them from places that I deemed to be mine and 'out of bounds' to them. Not as if that was heeded all the time. I would say that 95% of the time their poops would be in those places. Needless to say, those places would be 'prepared' by newspapers or large paper towels. I treated those remaing 5% with humour that you must have if you are going to live with a flighted birdie/birdies at home.

I do hope that there is time for companionship and friendship. Sadly when one 'commands' and beasties to 'obey', friendship and bonding goes out of the window. Just like if one can really be true friends with the 'boss'. Can it be that different if you are the 'boss' to be obeyed instantly. Maybe it is just a state of mind, as when you watch them to see if they 'obey', you miss seeing the nuances of what they want to tell you. By the actions and even motions I could feel on my shoulder when Tink was on me, I knew she was going to poop. I then took her off and asked her to poop. If I gotten entranced with other stuff, and missed her telling of me, then thats my mistake and she could and should poop on me. At my invitations, Tinkerbell and Yingshiong flew to me when cued. At my requests, they flew back into their cages when asked. No alphaship, but just interactions between sentient beings of equal standing. Life is a lot more than being an alpha. It will be a lot more fun for all parties.

LindaMary wrote: I would have agreed with you before. That as those beasties are flock animals that perhaps they shared a different form of communication thats still much a puzzle to us all But not after I have had YingShiong, the male white-rumped shama. Shamas are solitary birds, so much so that males will kill females when not in breeding season. Male shamas are so territorial that they will fight any males. Makes one think they are hermits and not likely to interact at all. I was lucky enough to have shared part of my life with YS. Might have been coincidental for all I know. But there had been times that before he flew (or I heard his wings flutter), I knew he was looking to me and would fly to me soon. So it is not just with flock beasties. And another snippet of things we do not really want to talk about. Even if it was not between me and beastie It was between Ivan my cat and wife when in Hongkong. http://http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/ivan1.html Ivan photos in http://http://www.flickr.com/photos/shimmertje/sets/1428189/ And if you are in my wife Flickr , and you curious as to sights in Oman, she uploaded lots in Flickr. I have been too lazy and laid back to update my own blog or to take photos. That will change if and after I got a bird here in Muscat.

They know. In no uncertain ways, they know the emotions and feelings in us. When I came back from work, how Tinkerbell interacted with me depended entirely on how I felt. Should I have had a bad day, she would fly to my shoulder, rest there quietly while I veggie myself watching TV and with a drink. For 30-45 mins, she would remain there preening herself or preening me. On good days, she would fly to my shoulder, pretend to perch there, and then reached down to my pocket to snatch my ciggies to fly off with them to destroy that on top of cupboard, or in search of my cat or ferret to dive bomb them. Even though I have tried to act happy when sad, or sad when happy, she always knew my true state of mind and was never fooled. I can add more instances, but that would almost be metaphysical. Such as not all recalls to her were made verbally. Love her as I do, those times still made me flinched a wee bit.

When I was in Taiwan, a man showed me his hand with 3 and 1/2 finger. He told me that half ring finger was taken off by his grey. Until then, I never thought that could have happened. Here is another writing that hopefully be of use if that bite ever done onto finger or on hand. I hope that my having written that on 11 May 2005 will not make it too obsolete for use here. I also believe the fear of getting bitten might trigger the empathic sense in the parrot, making him/her fearful and inducing that bite you were frightened of. Perhaps knowing how to react might take away that fear replacing that with respect for the beak, but not fear. And you can get into a better relationship with your CAG. http://http://shanlung.livejournal.com/7051.html Tinkerbell Legacy - Rant 08 How to avoid getting badly bitten by your bird Shanlung

An earlier letter from thread here. http://www.greyforums.net/forums/african-grey/8152-wing-clipping.html Hopefully giving additonal food for thoughts for folks thinking of this option. MrSpock wrote: Hi Dave, In an ideal world, what you say above may be right. The other extreme will be extremely severe clipping of wings. When I was in Riyadh and in a parrot shop, this grey jumped off the top of cage about 5 feet from ground. The sound of him hitting down, the spray of blood around him, and the screaming of that poor guy hurt me crazy. I do not wish ever to have another keel bone broken even if not in front of me. People clipped for a few key reasons. 1. They had been conditioned to that because of what they read or were told. This seemed to be peculiarly American. Tinkerbell wings were so nearly clipped by me at the beginning as the books I read all recommended that (all American books) as well as forums in 2002 when I first had Tinkerbell. I was lucky enough to bought a British parrot mag to give me second thoughts. 2. The sight of initial flights, the crashing into walls was extremely frightening and I thought my precious Tink was crazy in trying to fly through walls while I stumbled about chasing her with a pillow to cushion her falls after hitting the wall. Once again, I so nearly reached for that scissors and Tink the flyig grey of Taiwan so nearly did not exist. But that british mag persuaded me to let that continue for a few more days. She then found her flying skills to turn, slow, hover and stopped banging into walls. Folks, this episode is inevitable. Your birds may be natural fliers, but even so, they MUST develope their muscles , flying skills and sense of balance. But at this early stage, their speed will be very slow(even if it appeared fast to you) and chances of harm to them will be there. You can minimise this by letting them fledge in a small room, with curtains or rope nets around the walls for them to fly to and cling too. Or you can run around like me with a cushion. If you see a human toddler trying to walk and falling down, will you have fear for his/her safety and not ever let him discover balance and walk? Will you have him/her crawl for the rest of their life because you are afraid to see them fall? This is same as your choice for your bird. 3 By clipping wings and thinking thus the clipped bird will never fly away. I need not repeat my earlier postings of clipped birds that flown away. In what Dave said , that is true in an ideal world. Unfortunately, we live in the real world. But most people then went on to extrapolate that then, their bird will never be able to fly away. That is where I draw that line. So after you got that 'perfect clip' and your parrot then fly about 8 feet and not gaining height. But again, have that clip been tested under worse case condition? Such as a sudden blast of air horn , or a strange hat thrust in front to see if that parrot cannot gain height in a spook situation? Can you bear to do a sudden spook, or allow others to do that to your parrot? To see if that clipped wings hold good in spook conditions? And with Murphy at your elbows, how about throwing in that gust of wind at the same time? Can you ever guarantee such conditions will never ever occur to you? People had thought so. Their parrot paid heavier price than they did. Your choice again to see if you can beat those odds. On a different note Dave, I tried to log in to your old forum to let you and other friends there know about my last trip to be with Tink in Nov last year. If you did know, fine. If not, you might like to read this Tinkerbell Interlude photoset and videos, and start of next chapter of life. Also as to why I am now here in Brisbane , down under. http://http://shanlung.livejournal.com/65169.html Shanlung http://http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

Desiree, Take a look into this website. This is one of the most detailed site as to how you can live with a flying CAG at home and the training and bonding that you must do to take a harnessed CAG outdoor safely. http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/ Warm regards Shanlung

ROTFLMAO :laugh:

Here is an old email written back in Feb 2004 that might be still be applicable. This is in Tinkerbell - Part 1 The Early Period "Period of fledging before clipping." http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wfledgeNfly.htm

Just yesterday when I collected my kitties from their neutering, my vet in Muscat Oman was telling me many greys were treated by him recently for respitory problems. Needless to say, all those greys were clipped. Why am I not surprised that they went on to have respictory problems? I might still get a grey here. Should there be one with big problems and rejected by owner , the vet told me he will get to me. I and my wife will then give he/she the love and care that they lacked and will return the gift of flight back to him/her Shanlung<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/08/23 08:10

:-) You worry too much. Just do that as-a-matter-of-fact. I do think they know what is needed to be done and what is tormenting and they can differentiate very well between those two. They might not like it, but I cannot believe they will hold that against you. ps. Tink didn't like baths, but she got it anyway.

Getting a bird back will require luck. Luck will need a lot lot of hard work and leg work as catalyst. When you want to cry and give up in despair, and you still press on as much as you can with all that pain in your heart. Luck will not coming from just wishfully hoping or praying for luck. Shanlung<br><br>Post edited by: shanlung, at: 2008/06/22 07:06

Way way way back when I was about 14, my friend's dad had this grey. With nothing better to do, I taught him an extremely colorful phrase. To our shock (my friend CM and me), he said that unmentionable phrase in my voice. In those days, mischiefs were always taken care of by dads with cane , whippings and outright ban on further associations. Especially if his dad got back to hear that and gone on to complain to my dad. Being terrified of retributions, me and my friend opened a bottle of Black Label Johnny Walker for that grey. He was rather happy , and we were all happy , as that phrase got *hic* forgotten. Dont tar and feather me folks. That was a long long time ago and we did not know better. Perhaps that guy should have either taken a tot of black label , or give a wee bit to Ziggy, and continue to keep his CAG.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4619764.stm If you have extra boyfriend or girl friend on the side, its not a good idea to have a grey alongside.

Tari wrote: Tari, I am not sure I quite understand you on towel training to get a harness on. If you need to use towel to get harness on, neither you nor your parrot is ready for harness as yet, not in the long run at least. Perhaps you might like to read this. http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wUsingHarness.html

Hi Dan, Is that video still in Youtube? Many of the videos that my wife posted on Tink and Yingshiong gone. I am surprised that your video is gone too. Or is my not getting those videos a thingy peculiar to my being in Dubai.

Dan, What you wrote is almost what is in my mind, except that your grammar is better than mine. "On the other hand, I do not believe that taking the un-weaned baby home thinking that by finishing the weaning process, the new owner will have a "Closer" bond with their bird. It is dangerous, when performed by an unexperienced person and does nothing towards guaranteeing that bird will love them deeply for it. " What you said above is the real key. Physical needs is just one facet of the relationship. The emotional needs of the beastie all too often have been ignored. And then they go on and wonder why their beastie has an 'attitude'. Pchela, Let there be no end to the research that you are doing. Its time to worry when you think you know it all and need not learn more. Enjoy your time with your babe and do not worry too much. Earthquake , or typhoon, or global warming might hit you way before he switches loyalties. Shanlung

Pchela, That article was not actually written on young birds but on a totally different issue altogether. I read that sometime back. But when I re-read that last night in a new light after my wife (who took most of the photos of Tink and me) replied to my forwarding of that to her. (she in Singapore and I in Dubai). I seen all too often little chicks , some with eyes still closed, offered for sale. Because there is such a demand. And too often we read of 'hand fed' parrots offered for sale. Because of the perceptions that they make better 'pets'. And as I pointed out, young or old make good companions. Companionship is a relationship between you and he/she. Not just because you raised them from young. There is no fault with you handfeeding your CAG. The more you know, the more you will be prepared and the better the chances of you living a good rewarding life with your grey. The most important part is that you must not try 'Alphaship', and you give your baby all the respect and consideration due to any other sentient being. And I know you will have a good and rewarding life with your grey. Shanlung