Buffy

I spend many more hours on this forum than I really should but have loved every minute of it up until this thread. The meaning behind written words can so easily be misinterpreted so I may very well be completely off base, but I feel that Kieron (key87) has been bullied, belittled, and misunderstood. He repeatedly stated that he knew he needed to do more research. After several harsh posts, he continued to thank everyone for their comments. As it turned more and more dramatic, it just became ridiculous to me. I feel that his cynicism was warranted, and am amazed that he continued to return to the website and respond to each comment, except for two, with explanation and thanks. When he stated that this was a hobby for him and not a means for making profit, I took it to mean just that, that he is interested in breeding these birds due to his love for them, not to turn a profit. I have to respect that. Dave's second post was very well put. This really isn't a forum for information on breeding. Why couldn't that have just been said in a kind way from the beginning and then left alone? But after that post, it just went on and on. You don't teach people by being negative or talking down to them. It got to where every time I checked my email and saw that someone else had posted on this thread, my stomach turned with dread. By the time Kieron had posted the ooooooo!!!!!!!!!!! post, I was right there with him and completely understood. I LOVE this forum and have not experienced this in the year that I have been following it. I would like to personally thank Morana and Judy for their much more positively stated posts. And again, I may be completely off base, but this was how I interpreted the things that were being said in this thread. To Kieron, I deeply apologize for not having said something sooner. As I said, I LOVE this forum, I LOVE having access to knowledgeable grey owners who can give me advice, share my ups and downs of being owned by greys, and recently I have relished playing in the silly game room with Ray P, Birdnut, and Luvparrots, so I did not want to do anything that would ostracize me from this forum. If we are lucky, we spend our entire lives learning and growing. I hope this experience hasn't thwarted you, and that you continue research and grow in your knowledge of these amazing birds.

Hi Tamara! Like you when I started researching Greys I too, decided to go with a Timneh after reading all the negative stuff about Congos. However, the breeder I was most impressed with only had Congos. Here I am now with 2 congos. I have not had any of the negative experiences I've read about with Congos. Socialize your baby bird early and teach bird and child to have a respect of each others space, and I think you will be very pleased with your Congo. good luck!

Welcome and congratulations to you and Millie for finding each other!

I love the picture!

Welcome to the forum Key87. Hope to hear more from you. England is always so far ahead of the United States in its animal welfare legislation and general attitude toward pet ownership, so it does not suprise me that you do not have the large number of birds available to be rescued that we do in the United States. I live in a rural area in the South, and I constantly see Greys being available for rehome. I was actually looking on three rescue sights today. They were filled with Greys. With that being said, I am a bit of a hippocrit because I bought both of my babies from a reputable breeder. Her knowledge and ability to answer endless questions was pivotal in helping me get through my first year as an african grey mother. I wish you the best of luck. Being a passionate bird lover manifests itself in many ways. Some people rescue, some breed, and some just have their pets. However, we are all blessed with the devotion of our fids, our strong connection and understanding of our fellow bird lovers, and the ability to empathize with the trials and tribulations of being owned by parrots. And I second what Morana said: Introduce us to your current flock!

So Thumper loves palm oil but Echo refuses so I tried yet again today. Echo loves almonds. I haven't bought almonds in about two months. So, I bought some almonds the other day and was sure that Echo would be so excited to eat almonds that she wouldn't notice the palm oil I had melted over the top. Ummmm, didn't happen. I put the palm oil almonds down, she looked at them and knew immediately that something was wrong. She looked at me like I was the worse person on this Earth. Needless to say, the dogs really enjoyed the palm oil flavored almonds! I'm going to trick her one of these days!

Whenever I'm reading the threads, I find myself wondering how people pick the names their birds have, so I just thought I'd go ahead and ask how your bird got its name. I'll start: I'm a huge Joss Whedon fan, so when I got Echo, that was the name of the main character in his show 'Dollhouse'. Thumper was originally supposed to be Sully after the movie 'Avatar'. However, he would thump his foot so loudly and frequently that the bird breeder told me it would drive her crazy because she could hear him thumping from the nursery all over the house. She said grey babies frequently thump and dig, but he took it to a whole different level. I would get so tickled visiting with him and watching him thump his foot, so when I would go visit him each Saturday, I'd say 'bring out my Thumper!' And ofcourse, it stuck. I never could call him Sully. I should have known then that he was going to always be in something!

Thanks for sharing. Its those moments that I love best.

Thumper will shake his head back and forth a make a series of sounds that I call his 'huffing and puffing'.

so very sorry.

Welcome to the forum and congratulations to you and Lona!

Marble looks very sweet in the pics. the sun conure was adorable. Made me want one, but I just need to keep reminding myself of how loud they are.

How funny! I'm glad Cosmo is ok!

I love the pictures of Isaac. He is very handsome! I know exactly what you mean Kim. I thought Echo would never finish her first molt. It seemed to last forever. Its been 4 months and she is still missing one flight feather on each wing.

Welcome and congratulations! It's going to be a long wait for your baby. I remember that wait well! Once I picked the bird breeder I was most impressed with, I had to wait 7 months for Echo, but it was worth it. I joined 3 forums in the beginning and have only followed this one for quite some time. In my opinion, it is by far the best!

I have worked with animal rescue groups for many years. The 'hot button' issue right now is hoarding. Most no kill animal shelters will take in animals from hoarding situations due to the popularity of this issue in the media. After hurricane katrina, it was easier to adopt out animals that were listed as Katrina rescues because of all the media attention. Many rescues in Lousiana and surrounding states would get tons of calls for Katrina dogs and cats, but couldn't be convinced to look at any other animals in the shelter if the Katrina pet was already adopted out. After Michael Vick, adoption of pit bull terriers went way up. Because of all the shows on various channels about hoarding, rescues from hoarding situations are much easier to adopt out than other rescues right now. Anyway, it should be fairly easy in Los Angeles to find someone to take some of the cats. The trick is going to be convincing her of that. I also work in the Mental Health field. There is still a debate as to what causes hoarding and how to treat it. With animal hoarding, it seems to be a little bit easier to define. It often comes from a sense of lonliness and feelings of abandonment. These issues are much harder to address. However, sometimes, an animal hoarder is truly a devoted animal lover who got in over their head. It's extremely hard for them to admit that they aren't taking good care of their pets because this means they are an 'abuser'. That is very difficult for them to come to terms with. It is a fine line of convincing them to release some of the animals without being accusatory. Are her cats spayed and nuetered? If they are not, that would be the most important step to working on the issue. Getting into therapy would be very beneficial for any hoarder to help deal with the emotions that lie beneath the behavior. It is a very hard issue to deal with. Hopefully, you can reach out to her family members. Even if you can convince her to relinquish just two cats, it will help for the time being. The most important thing is to take small steps. Overwhelming a hoarder will often just shut them down. If anyone can get her to admit that her cat situation is an issue, then progress can often move swiftly from that point forward. Best Friends in Utah is the largest no kill animal shelter in the United States. They have done a lot of work with educating people about animal hoarding. They may have some information on their website that will help you. If you google them, you should be able to find the website quickly. Good Luck!

I'm definitely no expert but have had some of your same issues. Echo didn't talk until she was 14 months old, and then it was just stray words here and there that she didn't seem to understand the meaning to. Now she and I will have a 15 minute conversation. Her vocabulary has exploded in just the last two months. Thumper, my youngest, is only 7 months old. He already says two words and mimics many sounds. They each develop at their own rate. I'm sure he is picking things up earlier because of Echo. Echo has also always seen her cage as the 'necessary evil thing' that she must be in when I'm at work and at bedtime. Thumper on the other hand, loves his cage and Echo's cage. He will stay out for up to an hour and then take a break in his cage. He will then come out of his cage and fly into Echo's cage to hang out for a while. When I brought Echo into my home as a baby, I was so excited and overindulged her every whim. She had some issues with being overly dependent on me and was not developing normal independent play. It was impossible for me to be in the house and her in her cage without her exhibiting the exact same behaviors as your baby. I went through a hard few months of correcting that mistake. Like you, I never saw any sign that she was playing with her toys either. I had the best luck with using foot toys and highly shreddable toys to teach her independent play. It was a long process, but she will play with almost anything now and has started just in the last month entering her own cage without being placed in there.

I love hearing these kind of stories. Our birds are so intelligent.

I am so sorry as well. The pain of losing a beloved pet is devastating especially when it is so unexpected. I would highly recommend getting a necropsy done before bringing another bird into the home. I feel it is vital to know the cause in case it is an environmental toxin of some sort. Do you have a carbon monoxide detector? Your story reminds me of one I recently read in a bird magazine in which it was a carbon monoxide leak. Other than that, I always think its important to open your loving home to another animal after losing one, but that is, without a doubt, a personal decision you and your family have to make. You and your family will be in my thoughts.

Happy Hatchday Averi! I love the baby book. I wish I had thought of doing that.

Love the picture. Parakeets are my first love! I've been thinking about getting another one but have been a little worried as to how safe it would be around my Greys. We have a bird fair coming up in February, and I am contemplating bringing home a keet or two. My very first bird was a keet named Jasper. He looked just like yours.

I agree with Barbara. Try all the methods until you find one that works. I heated it and poured it on food with no luck, tried to give it to them semi-solid with no luck, tried to rub it on almonds with no luck, I even tried rubbing some of it on their favorite plastic foot toys to trick them into eating it with no luck. However, someone posted on here to try refrigerating it and giving it to them in complete solid form. This worked perfectly with one of my greys. He goes nuts when he sees me get it out of the refrigerator. He loves for me to cut a small chunk off so he can hold it in his foot, and eat it up. I still have not found a method that works for my other Grey yet. Your post brought back memories for me. I had several people recommend red palm oil to me, so I ordered it online, and when it came in, I looked at that mushy stuff and thought what in the world have I ordered!

Oh and the other issue I have with Birdtalk is I have found them contradicting themselves several times. For instance, I started giving my birds toilet paper rolls because Birdtalk said they were good, cheap toys for parrots. About four months later they had an article about things that are toxic to birds and listed toilet paper rolls as being toxic due to the glue on them.

I continue to subscribe to Birdtalk, but my biggest issue with it is that it seems like very few articles with not much 'meat' to them and a whole lot of advertisements. I do like that they list the bird fairs. I LOVED Parrots magazine. The articles were amazing and in depth. I also loved how they tied bird ownership into environmental issues in a couple of the articles. It was right up my alley! I ordered Good Bird yesterday. Thanks everyone!

I think I would be concerned if my fid never wanted to admonish or nip at me. In my opinion, it means they feel comfortable and safe enough to express their individuality. I think too many birds are sold to second owners because of this. True bird lovers have done their research and realize that this is going to happen no matter what food you feed them or what environmental barriers you control. I believe my Echo and Isaac are right about the same age. I look forward to Elvinking and I posting many similar laments over the next few years!