Dave007

It's gonna be hard. First off, I doubt you'll get any vet money you put out. That doesn't normally happen and the reason is that in another person's eyes it didn't have to be done. Screamers/screechers---not uncommon for any cockatoo or macaw, If his playstand lessened the noise it's a good thing. UMs are a somewhat friendly bird as opposed to the other larger ones. Gram negative results aren't that difficult to cure. Many TOOS have that problem. I'm sure the vet told you it wasn't serious but if he didn't you can call him to make sure. Many TOOs wind up in shelters because they're naturally nervous, extreme pluckers, and require lots of hands on attention. They also wind up there because they're much older and haven't been treated properly even tyhough many times, it isn't the owner's fault. A TOO doesn't like to be caged. It will cause plucking and moodiness. They're attitude and personality is just the opposite of a grey. One popular way that people sell or give away their birds is through an avian vet's facilility. Ads are posted and many see them and decide on it. Also concerning UMs--they're much more friendly to other species than the much larger TOOs. Being with other species that they like causes them to be even quieter. Not toatally quieter but somewhat quieter. Of course you can list the bird on Craigslist but I've seen people sell their birds to others that groom them to be breeders and that can happen very easily with a young bird such as yours. They're at the breeding age when they reach 7 yrs old. You can ask neighbors or friends if they're interested or you can put the bird in a shelter which I doubt you wanna do. Many people go out of their way to learn as much about the species in order to find out if it's possible to keep the bird. There are no guarantees that one species will get along with another and that also applies to your future Zon. I would first try the vet and he may know of a good place for him. They constantly get that type of info on a daily basis. The big thing here though is to only ask for a much smaller amount of money because you are selling a bird that comes with some type of history.

Many people are told the same thing that you just told her and many people give the same response that she gave you. So, why don't you just take some time and seriously talk to her about coming to this board and read all of the pitfalls and dangers concerning behavior that birds go through when they're in the same situation as that bird. It may strike a nerve. She doesn't have to be a member and there's loads of information about birds that have only been owned one time, birds that have had a couple of owners, birds that are in shelters etc etc. Sometimes it works cause people do care about their birds but continually do the wrong thing.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/28 20:04

Lindamary Dan's thread was called Wonderful Rescue in VA and the link is http://www.projectperry.com/africangreys.html

My feeling is that the bathing somehow stimulates something inside which causes it to happen. It definitely has something to do with a natural instinct. I do know that if a person is bathing their bird in room temperature or slightly cooler water that will make them do it more if the fresh water in the bowl is cold. Many greys love to bathe in very cool water. It's kinda depressing to give a bird a very thorough bath and then put a fresh bowl of water in and within 1/2 hour, it's all over the cage bottom and all over the wall but mine have been doing it for years and I mean All of them. The thing I do which works about 50% of the time is not to put in any water for at least 1 hr. Sometimes it works and other times it doesn't. PS--yes, I believe you can use cooler shower water. Cool water can't hurt them and it takes the same time for them to dry off naturally in cool water or warmer water. Another PS--My 2 quakers do the exact same thing. Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/26 22:37<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/26 22:40

As greys get older, they will quickly rush to their bowls for a bath immediately after getting a bath especially if the bowl water is cool. It really has nothing to do with their being clean or not.

I'd like to put my 2 cents into this thread. I really don't belive in spending extremely high prices for bird products when it isn't necessary. That applies to large items as well as the smallest items. Recently, Dan put in a supurb great post and link concerning an area that was being built for greys that came with all sorts of issues. I think these very high prices really don't benefit greys or other parrots anymore than average equipment is priced at and that aviary was a good example or practicality as opposed to beauty.. All that's being done is using very high priced material whose main purpose is to make these cages and other products * decor oriented* which that aviary wasn't. A bird feels no more comfortable in expensive equipment than in regular priced equipment. The only necessity in getting average type cages is to make sure that it was built and designed for different species. It doesn't have to be pretty nor does it give any particular advantages to a bird/birds. A very young baby bird will be no better or grow up better because they're in a high priced *custom made cage or aviary. I believe that most of the very high priced equipment is a ripoff. It's made because people will buy it and as long as people keep buying it, it'll be keep being made.. That could also apply to the tiniest of bird products---toys. There are toys that so lovely, colorful and come in special shapes and designs. Does the bird appreciate all of these things? Well, they simply destroy them as quickly as average priced toys but people will run out and buy more and the process starts all over again. I bring up Dan's great thread for a particular reason---I looked at the video and really found nothing very surprising about it other than the people there mainly focused on environment as opposed to beauty. It was designed to imitate the bird's naturally environment which would provide birds with more shelter and confidence. That aviary took a long time to be built and can now be used to show people about parrots in a natural state. The extra work that went into that design was in the roofing which was made to discourage predatory birds because most will land on flat surfaces as opposed to dome surfaces. That was done to make the birds more relaxed and less fearful. The metal that was used wasn't anything special. It was material that was safe for birds and strength and longevity. The interior wasn't filled with objects that were stylish. It were packed with things that birds have in the wild. That whole project was designed for the birds, not for beauty. The design has been totally successful. Even the food area was made to imitate natural conditions--a large communal area where birds could feed as a group which is the normal way that they feed The reason it didn't surprise me was because I made an outdoor aviary ( much smaller). The total price for the whole thing was approx $450. It took 3 of us to put it together and the only extra feature that was put in were hinges that made this aviary collapsible. That aviary of mine has lived in 3 states and can be stored away when the bad weather arrives. When it's open in the backyard, I can put 3 pairs of breeder greys who aren't human friendly in plus 3 pet greys and 2 quakers. Every bird gets along. The aviary is also helping one of my pet greys learn how to fly because it never could because it never had any feathers at all for the first 3 years of it's life. So personally, I can't get excited about unnecesary, extremely high priced items whose main reason has to do with decor. Personally, I feel that a more important thing to focus on is getting the bird to live away from the cage as much as possible. That's much more productive than a high priced, custom designed cage that simply looks good.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/26 20:28

"""""Lastly if you could give one piece of advice, to all new bird owners, what would it be?"""""--------( potentially new bird owners) Don't buy any parrot if your main interest and desire is to get a parrot just because it's supposed to talk. Many people do that and those people are disappointed. All parrots talk all day long. It's a person's job and desire to learn what the parrot is saying that's most important and satisfying.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/22 16:51

Char You always have them? I'm very sorry about your condition. Keep your chin up. Tomorrow may be the day that things will be looking up for you. You've got a strong family because they're abl;e to comfort you when you have a particularly bad molt. At least your whole predicament has created an even better bond with your bird. It's a good thing that you except your problem as a simple fact of life. Good luck. By the way, Barnum and Bailey has a job opening you may be interested in.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/22 03:57

There is no such thing as normal feather plucking. Birds who need to pull out broken or damaged painful feathers --that's an injury. Birds who are chronic or acute pluckers do so for a variety of reasons, none of which is normal. Birds who help remove old dead and dried feathers---That's molting. Birds that constantly scratch at dried, scaly skin in order to loosen older feathers---that's molting. The name of this thread should be "what do you think about normal feather preening and molting"

<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/21 03:25

Well, you have loads of questions concerning all different aspects of training, basic care, socialization. There's many books on the market but none of them can possibly cover all of these things and there's a big chancce that not all of this material will work for every single bird. There's nothing set in stone. There's some books that cover the basic everyday care of greys and other species. There's some other books that cover specific aspects of biord relationships with others but that may not covr all greys and other species./ All parrots have very individual personalities. You can have 3 greys in your house and about the only thing similar is the color of their feathers. What works for one may not work with the other. Some books out there give very faulty information and should have never been allowed on the market. The best way to find out about your particular parrot is to find out what the many different methods were used by people who were dealing with the exact same situation. A little bit of info from each person can be put into a pot, stirred and what comes out is your personal solution. That's what this board offers and there's many many solutions and there's loads of people willing to share. i can give you one opinion on one thing you mentioned--socializings with others---most of the time all members of a family have to be totally and equally involved with a bird from the very beginning and not expect that bird to take to everyone equally and that should be expected. There may be less success in that area if the bird has lived in different homes and has developed ingrained habits from each place.

Sometimes, when a clipping is done the wings and feathers will look fine but sometimes as they grow back, it's not in the direction it's supposed to be. If the feathers didn't grow back at the same time, one could have overlapped 1 or 2 other feathers causing the feathers to be aimed in a different direction. That's only one possibility though. I really don't know about deformed feather growth being from a calcium deficincy. But even though it's difficult the bird needs to be taken to a vet because one of the things he'll be checking is shaft direction and possible shaft infection. It's not an uncommon problem. Sometimes, a few key feather shafts are painlessly removed allowing others to fall into place. There really isn't much we can offer here other tha it's good that you made an appt. Concerning the water dish, until you find out what the problem is, buy a water bottle feeder and replace the bowl. Make sure that the your tiel can see water coming from it when you first put it in. Keep it very close to where the water bowl was. We'll hope for the best.

Fill the sprayer with the aloe. Put the other container in the fridge. The sprayer is good for 8 to 10 days at room temperature. Actually, it's good for even more but 8 to 10 days is good to start off with until you feel comfortable using it. The big reason about them saying it needs to be put in the fridge is because aloe juice is made for people who have digestive or other stomach problems. They would need to drink it. We bird nuts only spray it.

You don't need to cook any branches that have had the bark removed. Just take that branch over to your sink and with a wet sponge or towel, soap it down and let dry. BUT, if you feel better about putting them in the oven, that's alright too as long as you don't burn the wood.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/17 22:33

Those are average type oak trees--very safe but in order to make them an even better more permanent perch in your cage, do this 1--get one that looks pretty dead and useless. 2--measure approx length in your cage where you want it and cut it to that size. The more bent and knarly the branch, the better. 3--Take the branch and totally cover it in water for about an hr or until you see the bark becoming soft. 4---peel off all the bark. You'll be left with a very hard branch that birds don't particularly like to chew through because it's similiar to natural branches 5--let the branch dry off--may take 1 hr. Wood that has had the bark taken off dries pretty quickly. 6--slice a couple of notches in either end 7--voila!---a natural branch from a tree. Every cage I have has natural branches from my backyard. I put the originals away to use for other things.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/17 21:45

PitSoulja I think you'd better check the descriptions of baby birds in the wild. A Blue jay is just that--blue. It's always blue. A baby blue is identical to the parents. There is only one type of Blue jay. It's very obvious as to the color of the species. The blue jay can easily be identified from the time it's hatched. The baby bird above wasn't just hatched. This is a baby blue jay. An adult blue jay a noisy, cackling, clumsy type of bird that is aggressive to it's own kind. It's a ground feeder who prefers worms and bugs to other foods. Personality wise, the blue jay is nothing like the beautiful delicate bird portrayed in Hallmark cards that feature them. PS--I have plenty of them coming on my property. They are frequently around with robins who are also ground feeders and eat the same thing. I have woods that start 30 ft. behind my property so loads of different species show up all the time including the winter. Concerning Baxtermom's pictures of the baby bird that she had for a few days, I may have been wrong when I called it a bunting. It very well may be a mockingbird. Both are extremely similiar to each other. I see them all the time. As a matter of fact, I wish they would go away because they invade my outside feeders and the other species of birds that normally eat there aren't getting an equal chance of eating this year. When I say lots of them, I'm talking about at least 100 to 150 of them coming all at the same time. This is a baby blue jay. <br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/16 19:13

Giving small amounts of eggs everyday is alright as long as it doesn't affect the consistancy of droppings. Eggs have calcium. You can even crack egg shells in very tiny pieces and feed it if your bird likes it. It also has calcium. Any shells should be thoroughly rinsed.

It means that the bird want's to be lightly rubbed in sensitive areas which you shouldn't do. Continue the petting but avoid the vent area and under the wings near the body. The noises are common and they make those noises when stimulated.

There's only one brand at Walmart FRUIT OF THE EARTH 100% ALOE VERA JUICE 1 GAL JUG APPROX $9 It's in the phatrmacy section. Probably where laxatives and digestive products are sold More than likely, Tom paid an extra dollar because he had the female clerk carry it all the way up to the cash register.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/15 03:39

You're welcome.

You say that you're sure there has been no change in things? Okay then, do things in reverse. Make some changes. Move the cage around. Don't keep moving his toys around. It's only been a few weeks? It's probably a temporary thing that he has to get out of his system. Does she yell in or out of the cage?<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/14 23:03

I don't know what *black* millet is but when I go to the animal feeds place that I buy all my food, I purchase about 20 to 25 sprigs of millet. They're all loose and a person can pick which the ones they want. I usually get the ones that are about 15 inches long and about 2 inches in diameter. They cost me $.63 each. They also sell the thinner ones that are given to smaller parrots. The color of the millet I buy is beige. I give them to all my greys and my 2 quakers. I cut them into 6 inch pieces and hand them out. Matter of fact, I gotta pick up a few things today and I'm getting another load of them.

Leave all of the feathers alone. The rest of the ones that broke off will soon fall out and new ones will eventually appear.

Honey isn't good for parrots because they don't metabilize it quickly. It may seem like they do but they don't. Small parrots such as quakers and conures and budgies and parrotlets can actually die from too much honey. Honey isn't even good for hummingbirds. They'll eat it and die. Anyone who deals with hummers will tell you that the nectar is not on the safe list. It's sweet and of course, parrots like anything sweet. A bird will also eat very sugary products that's made with the sugar we use but that doesn't make it safe. The honey that's used in seed sticks has been extremely thinned out because it's use is simply to keep the seeds in one place. You would be taking a chance with honey. It's not recommended on any bird list and that would come under the fruit list. Mixing it in with other foods doesn't thin it out. It simply masks the thickness. My opinion is to stay with safe things which are acceptable to birds internal systems. A very young bird is much more active than an adult bird and an adult bird doesn't metabilize honey or maple syrup or other types of saps very well. That's why nature stops them from eating it even though they perch and roost on trees that contain them. So, it's up to you. I wouldn't do it because there's too many other natural fruits that can be given which are definitely safe.

I just wanna say one other thing on the other side concerning making a fist and putting it in the cage to have him step up. Your bird is 8 yrs old and many habits are ingrained. Your bird can easily be one that doesn't like your hands in his cage. There's many greys like that and they can be quite younger than 8yrs old and still develop that attitude. You've had the bird for an extremely short amount of time. If he steps up when outside the cage, let it go at that until you have a much bigger picture of your bird and that's gnna take a while. If he's the type that doesn't want your interference in his cage he will bite hard and it doesn't matter whether it's a finger, a fist, a wrist or any other thing that's close and can be bitten.