A compromise.

[Acappella]

I'll preface this by saying that in my house the phrase "step up" is never used. It has bad associations from his former home and sets him into fearful trembling immediately. Well for the last couple of months my boy has discovered he likes hanging out on my desk. He climbs down his cage, across the floor, up the desk leg and then waves his little foot around until I let him climb onto my arm and place him on the desktop. Sometimes his behaviour requires that I remove him from the desk to go back into his cage to 'think about what he's done' (yes, I know that's wishful thinking). He becomes quite willfull at these times and had started to bite me when I was trying to get him to step up. I know I should 'take the bite' but it got to the point where he was biting down on already raw skin. So I did a bad (to me at the time) thing. I decided that when I had to move him in a situation where he didn't want to be moved, even though I was afraid of a breach of trust, I would try stepping him up onto a perch. Of course, he was not happy about it, and I felt like a bad parront, but now we've reached a compromise. When he sees the perch he still makes his displeased noises, but he steps right up onto it as he knows I mean business. This way I can get him into his cage in a rush if I have to, and I can still step him up onto my hand for fun moves (Wanna come with mom? Wanna go to the living room?). Do you guys think I'm a bad parront, or a wimp, for resorting to a perch for step ups?

[SRSeedBurners]

Whatever works. We have a Jardines that is VERY willful. When he gets hold of something he wants and knows you're coming to remove him or the thing...he will lunge and bite. Jardine bites are no playing matter (they clamp down and auger in with hydraulic beaks). I will actually use things to deal with the Jattitude, including gloves which you read all over the place is a no-no.

[Echo's Mom]

I don't think it's a bad thing, but I've never had to deal with anything like you are.

 

I've used step up from the beginning (again, I've Echo since a baby, so no negative issue with her) ... but yes, there were times when she wouldn't step up on to my hand and I needed her to. This is when I started "training" Echo to step up on to her T-Perch (I used almonds and pistachios - yes, I bribed her LOL). There are times when I need to put her in her cage (for example if I'm sewing but need a break, I'll cage her for 10 minutes or so - if I leave her loose she'll just wreak havoc on my project LOL).

 

I'll ask her to step up onto my hand a couple of times, and if she won't then I get the T-perch and a nut. Half the time all I have to do is pick up the T-perch and she flies onto it! She has yet to fly away from it (even when I've gotten close to her with it). She always always always gets a nut when I've put her in her cage. (I did learn to wait til she was IN her cage before giving her the reward - I started giving her the reward as soon as she stepped onto the T-perch and she would take the nut and fly off! LOL ... little brat!)

 

MAYBE, just MAYBE, you could work towards that?

[katana600]

I admit, I have a similar strategy. However, Miss Gilbert has a panic aversion to the hand held perch. My "go-to I-mean-business" strategy is to place a washcloth in her vicinity behind her and just leave it there and give her about five minutes to decide it is much better to go in my direction and do what is necessary rather than to look at the washcloth. I haven't toweled her but the vet has and it is not a pleasant association. I seldom use that tactic and it remains effective. I am working toward the hand held perch a little at a time. Even though the wash cloth or the stick seems to be punitive, it really is all in how you use it. If we were terrorizing them with it for our amusement it would be horrid. But really it is a stop gap measure of distraction. In my opinion, the perch and treat method is a very good thing to teach. Some day the one they respond to and trust may not be there and it is a familiar ride for a stranger to perhaps get them into the cage should we have an emergency.

[BaileysPapa]

Having handled aggressive or fearful birds, I agree that whatever works is fine. Some birds are fearful of hands, and our flesh can take only so much pain & scarring. I think that it is fine for birds to step up onto perches, sticks, or whatever. You are not a bad parront. You are resourceful. What would be the alternative? To not take the bird out? To scare it into submission, by doing something like clapping your hands, and have it fly off to the floor, where it would then look to you for rescue? No, the perch is a good idea that works well for both of you.

[Mistyparrot]

I'll preface this by saying that in my house the phrase "step up" is never used. It has bad associations from his former home and sets him into fearful trembling immediately. Well for the last couple of months my boy has discovered he likes hanging out on my desk. He climbs down his cage, across the floor, up the desk leg and then waves his little foot around ................

 

Will he ever be able to fly?

Steve n Misty

[Luvparrots]

My greys each have their own "you can put me back in my cage, but first........." I have both my greys step up. They were taught this by their breeders, thank the Lord. But they are willful and unafraid of me, I never punish my greys, they are just big kids. Frankly they remind me of the comics the Rascals. Surely some of you remember this old, old gang of city street kids????? Our Gang, Muggsy and Alfalfa.

Anyhow, Ana Grey, TAG, flies to the top of the kitchen cabinet then she will fly to the top of her cage and allow me to step her up for return to her cage. Sterling Gris, CAG, flies to the top of the refrigerator from wherever he is and then I can step him up for return. This is their ritual and because they are flighted, I have no control. And I do not mind because it reminds me how unafraid and part of the family they feel and are.

 

I have their aviary built outside and attached to the house so if there is a fire (I live alone) I can direct them to the birdroom and out the window into safety until I can get outside and retrieve them unharmed.

[Acappella]

Will he ever be able to fly?

Steve n Misty

 

Steve, technically he Can fly, he just doesn't think of it as a way to get around. The only time he's flown, with a very few exceptions, have been when something startles him off his perch. His flight is wild and undirected, usually with a messy landing, although that is getting better. Well, he's not flying into walls as much. Basically, he doesn't know he's a bird. I don't think he was allowed to fledge before he was clipped for the first time, and he was kept clipped all the time. I let his wings grow out years ago, but he hasn't made the connection to use them to fly. I don't know if he ever will.

[kins2321@yahoo.com]

Acappella... You are a GREAT parent! Step up can be off anything, but use it over and over to understand the concept .It is very important in my mind. It didn't help me when I had a fire though.... my firm voice of " IN NOW", got across, everyone jumped in their cages, they were dragged outside, dogs were put in the car as we had always practiced. I was freaking out, but birds recognized there was something wrong and thankfully didn't argue! Kids were FANTASTIC... and thankfully followed our fire drills to perfection!

Sorry to get away from what we were discussing... practice stepup from anything they are interested in. I hope your baby will fly eventually. Do you have someone to sendoff and another family member to receive? Sophie enjoyed learning how to fly this way. Kiki our Amazon really was the one to teach her how to fly. Kiki would take off... land on the couch wait for Sophie.... then take off again expecting Sophie to follow. It happened! Sophie changed her wing flapping to be more like Kiki's. It was amazing to watch! Nancy

[neoow]

I have to do similar with Alfie. He sometimes decides that he doesn't want to step up (particularly if it's to be put back into his cage) and I have to grab a perch to get him to step up on. Otherwise, I get several beak shaped marks on my hands and arms! With the perch, he will give it a few bites and will either give up and step up or will run around the top of his cage to do his best to get away from me/the perch. Eventually he'll give up and either step up or will fly on to me.

If it works, it works. I think they sometimes just want to test the boundaries... or that they just wake up on the wrong side of the perch!!

[Echo's Mom]

Steve, technically he Can fly, he just doesn't think of it as a way to get around. The only time he's flown, with a very few exceptions, have been when something startles him off his perch. His flight is wild and undirected, usually with a messy landing, although that is getting better. Well, he's not flying into walls as much. Basically, he doesn't know he's a bird. I don't think he was allowed to fledge before he was clipped for the first time, and he was kept clipped all the time. I let his wings grow out years ago, but he hasn't made the connection to use them to fly. I don't know if he ever will.

 

A while ago I had a little quaker and she had the ability to fly, but not the knowledge. I took out the air mattress, filled it up with air, covered it in blankets and sat on the floor and "tossed" her onto the air mattress.

 

OK - that sounds horrible, but it wasn't LOL ... I was giving her a "lift" and she would flutter down (about 8-10 inches).

 

Once she landed I held out my hand and she'd come hopping over and I asked her ... wanna do it again? And she'd chirp and bop her head up and down ... and we'd do it again.

 

After a couple of days of this, she got the hang of it and was actually flying down, instead of fluttering. I went up a bit higher, and a bit higher over the next couple of weeks, and before I knew it ... I'd "tossed" her onto the air mattress and she started flying around my room! It was a bit chaotic for a couple of minutes as I was trying to catch her ... but if you could have seen the look on her little face!

 

She was bopping her head up and down and chirping and hollering wow wow wow ... it was incredible!

 

It didn't take much longer for her to figure out how to fly ....!!!

[Acappella]

I'm just afraid to break trust with Dorian. It took literally years to get him to step up onto my hand, and years longer before he stopped shaking violently when he was on my hand. I've had him for 9 1/2 years, and I'd say it's only the past year and a half that he's become truly comfortable being carried around. He still grips on like heck I've got the scars on my hand and arm to prove it, but the shaking has stopped. I'm afraid if I tried your technique it would ruin that hard won trust.

[Echo's Mom]

Acappella ... I hear ya - only YOU know what is good for Dorian ... it was just a reminder that popped in my head when I read your story. The look of pure joy on little Ellie when she figured just what she could do with those wings was beautiful!

[Timbersmom]

I'm in the same boat Acappella. Timber is fully feathered now but does not try to fly. I think he never fledged. He did startle a couple of months and actually flew UP to another area of this cage (from his rope perch, just a couple of feet), but other than that he doesn't attempt flight. I have had him 3 years and our relationship is good, but I'm not going to scare him or push him. He seems content and that's all that concerns me.

[kins2321@yahoo.com]

Such great posts! Everyone knows their birds and what will work for them while always making sure, NOT to betray the trust. ( Echo's mom.... that is pretty funny!). But you knew, you would not betray your birds trust before doing it.

Sophie probably would never have flown well, except it is difficult being the " boss", and everyone else can fly well and you can't. She obviously wanted to learn, and for some reason, Kiki was tired of her flying and plopping. Sometimes birds just work well together, and it was the most amazing moment for me, to see Kiki teaching Sophie. Nancy

[Mistyparrot]

A while ago I had a little quaker and she had the ability to fly' date=' but not the knowledge. I took out the air mattress, filled it up with air, covered it in blankets and sat on the floor and "tossed" her onto the air mattress.

 

.........[/quote']

 

That is much how I helped Misty learn to fly at around age two. I adopted him from a nice couple but Misty was asymmetrically clipped with all the flying ability of a feathered brick. Once his flights had grown back I helped him back by launching him onto a large soft bed saying "Fly Misty". Now ten years later he still calls out "Fly" or "Fly Misty" as he circuits the room. That will never grow old for me

 

Steve n Misty

[Acappella]

I don't think Dorian would even let me hold him in a way that would allow me to toss him away. He still clings to me for dear life when he's away from his cage. I can't imagine him letting me hold him around his body. Maybe in another ten years lol. (Only kinda kidding, Dorian moves at a pace that could best be described as glacial)

[Acappella]

Now ten years later he still calls out "Fly" or "Fly Misty" as he circuits the room. That will never grow old for me

 

Steve n Misty

Wish you could get that on video, that's beautiful.

[Echo's Mom]

LOL ... and I love the "feathered brick" comment ... too funny!

[Greywings]

Pookie came to live with us at 21 years old as a non flighted bird. She only flew like a rock, straight down. She needed to learn flight as that would keep her safer if she fell avoiding those crash landings on our tile floors. I did the same thing in our bedroom standing about a foot away from the bed than launching her off my wrist a little upwards in trajectory. At first she was just flapping to balance her landings then as she got stronger she could levitate a bit and land softly. She advanced to being launched from a few feet to across the room and she was so exuberant as she gained control. I think flight is a confidence builder for parrots. Now she can fly like a jet with tight turns and pinpoint landings but often just climbs around her in/on the cages and the furniture. Since we have multiple birds I think it is also a safety issue so escaping from a bully is easy.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Greywings

[birdhouse]

We never use the words "step up" because Phenix came pre-conditioned to bite on (that) command. Eventually it was just easier for everyone to get the same training until finally, we even stopped using it for the rest of the flock. Even the vet(s) know better.

 

Phenix also came w/a mortal fear of sticks or perches which has not really diminished very much in all this time. So I have a thick old terrycloth robe sleeve, (which I very rarely have to use I just realized) that's my fall back. I left a piece of the body of the robe attached when I cut it. So, if I need to, I can wrap or cover the fid because this sorry little innovation doubles as my go-to for nail trims & medication, as well.

 

I think it sounds like you got sick of butting heads w/Dorian & found a compromise like you said. I also think no matter how far our relationships progress, compromise, creativity, negotiation & sharing the upside of the power curve is pretty much the only way to make it work w/most of our parrots, but especially the rescues.

 

I also think that Dorian is also proof of your good work as a parront. So, stop second guessing yourself (... until next time ")

[chezron]

I think you did a really good thing getting your bird used to stepping on to a perch. Way to go! Have this as your go-to emergency move.