To clip or not to clip?

[tarm]

Shanlung,

 

Great to see you posting here. I did not realize you were a member her. I stumbled upon your pages from the manna mash yahoo list. I have very much enjoyed reading all your accounts of your life with your family and birds. I have also learned a great deal and giving me new direction to look in to increase my knowledge of keeping these great birds. Thanks for your input here and I could not agree more. BTW, I was very impressed with the simplicity yet great functionality of your flying harness design.

 

Tim

[shanlung]

tarm,

 

Happy mash making to you and your fid. All pure goodness that you make with love and with none of those shelf life extenders commercial parrot food companies added.

 

For folks who might wonder what tarm was talking about, take a look into how Tinkerbell Mash is explicitly made and you decide for yourself. In days of belt tightening, Tink Mash is the cheapest, and yet the best and most nutritious food for your birdie by far.

 

See and judge and decide for yourself.

 

Morning with Harry & the decision// Sultan of Oman Palace// Tinkerbell Mash Batch 7

 

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/109957.html

 

Tinkerbell Ultra-Lite harness was conceived of for Tinkerbell to enable her to go out with me in the mountains and forests and parks of Taiwan and given to the world in 2003 and improved and improved on. I asked only for a donation to Gerald Durrell Wildlife trust or for wildlife organisation of your choice.

 

A design that is effective and simple to make and made fitted exactly to your birdie with no buckles, bows and whistles and kitchen sink to 'adjust' the size as if your birdie size yo-yo up and down instead of remaining constant.

 

Sadly and most disgustingly, that design was hijacked in Oct 2005 by lowlife with 8-12 patents to 'protect' it. In the earlier days , that lowlife even lifted words I wrote to package with 'his harness'. Make me want to puke.

 

Below is Tinkerbell Ultra-Lite harness

 

 

 

Ramadan & Kitties on beach// Chess -1st Saturday IM Tournament // Tinkerbell Harness for Piper

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/104066.html

 

 

Tweedle,

 

I see far as I had stood on the shoulder of giants. One such person is Mr Lin, the Bird Whisperer of Tsaoling in Taiwan, a simple farmer and periodic tour guide of people to his remote hamlet of Tsaoling.

 

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

 

The letters on that bird whisperer of Tsaoling

The letters on that bird whisperer of Tsaoling are below in chronological order. They are all in Part 1 - Early Period of Tinkerbell.

 

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wTsaoLing1.html'>http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wTsaoLing1.html

 

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wTsaoling2.html

 

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wtsaolingrevisit.htm'>http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wtsaolingrevisit.htm

 

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wtink2bottles.htm

 

The visits covered a period of time as can be seen from the date of the letters. You can see in between the 2nd and 3rd visits the additions to the birds of that bird whisperer.

 

He, that bird whisperer of Tsaoling, is the man that inspired me the most.

 

He should be the man that I aspire to be. If you have no time to read all above, then at least read http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/wtsaolingrevisit.htm

 

I am a dwarf when compared to Mr Lin.

 

Dave,

 

I cannot even keep up with myself as to where I am. My memories kept being displaced. I got occasionally chastised by my wife when I told her where to buy things when she told me that shop was not in the city we were in and that I was thinking of another shop in another country altogether.

 

You might have followed my blog enough to know how those horrid birdies aged me with their wild escapades and their parroty jokes.

 

I am happy the harness worked out well for you and your Smokey and Tee can join you outside the house.

 

I missed your old board. We have had so many interesting exchanges there. I was about to archived into Livejournal some of those letters when your board crashed and all those letters lost. As those were written off the cuff and online, sadly, those were gone totally.

 

And send Gary my warmest regards.

 

I note in your signature the Milofor Buddha. He is of special significance to me.

I wonder if you read how that came to be in

 

Fragments of earlier memories of Taiwan

This entry is not on birds or animals. This is my memoirs that I wanted to write before it faded away with time.

 

There are some adult themes not suitable for minors.

There are encounters of mystical strange nature.

 

DO NOT READ FURTHER IF YOU FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE

 

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/111670.html

 

 

 

 

Warmest regards

 

 

 

Shanlung

 

山龍

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9

[Cheshire Cat]

Personally, and this is just me, I would never have Tui clipped. I just see something cruel in it when birds are magnificent creatures and that's why they have wings - to fly! You'd be taking away that fundamental element which makes birds so beautiful, and it is afterall, every bird's right to fly.

[KimKim]

Babalu was clipped when I rescued him 2 years ago, and I have kept him clipped. I am unsure what I want to do now, I thought I wanted to let them grow out (he has one feather grown in on one wing now). But like anyone else I am nervous about any accidents... I am still doing my own research and have bought the aviator harness and slowly trying to get him use to it. In my head I want him to be able to fly and be a bird, but.......... My husband doesn't want him to fly because he has allergies and thinks feathers and dust will go everywhere.

[Keywe]

I have allergies too...I bought a really powerful air cleaner and put it next to her cage..problem solved.. It catches feathers and dander like you wouldn't believe, and it makes a good white noise, so I think she sleeps better.

[tarm]

Is he actually allergic to the him or does he just have allergies. If you have him in the same house unless its huge with multiple zones and no air purifier near him that dust and dander is everywhere already so if its not bothering him now...... If he is actually allergic to him then that is harder and he likely is already having issues to some extent. Maybe best if you want him to have flight to put a air purifier in the room/s your husband is in the most. That is a frustrating situation.

[KimKim]

Keywe, what is the name of the air filter you bought? I have been thinking about getting a good one...

He has allergies to allot of things. We also have 2 dogs. I keep the place pretty clean hoping it will help him, our new place here in Va is a 3 level townhouse. He knew when we met that I loved animals, one of the dogs is his. I don't have allergies so I don't know what he goes through, I just have to listen to him snore and complain:). We have been together for over 4 years, 3 with dogs and 2 with the bird. I think I just need to invest in maybe 2 good quality air filters, one where the cage is and one in the bedroom. The good ones are so expensive though.

[Cheshire Cat]

My mom has emphysema and has to have oxygen at night and sleeps downstairs as she's disabled. Right from the beginning we agreed I wouldn't keep a bird in the living room because of my mom and her chest. We kept cockatiels a few years ago and they'd make my mom cough all the time. This is why Tui is in my bedroom. I get the feathers and dust all over the place. But I love her and it doesn't matter to me about that.

 

I think wing clipping is up to the owner in question. I know a majority of owners don't agree with it. Even the vet I visited yesterday said never to have Tui clipped and described it as, "You wouldn't cut a dogs legs off, would you?" I can understand where he's coming from, but it doesn't physically harm the bird unless the feathers are clipped too short.

 

An air filter sounds like a great idea; you don't need to have your bird clipped and your husband is less irritated by the dust.

[JDS5607]

just out of curiosity , how many owners on here own clipped birds ??

 

Both lovebirds, my sun and my grey are clipped. My Nanday isn't because he simply doesn't know how to fly... we believe his wings were clipped before he learned to fly as a baby. He kind of flaps, but it's like, flap left wing, flap right wing, flap left wing, flap right wing :\

 

I've done the research on both sides, and this is just what works for us

[Elvenking]

Wow...those are som beautiful free flight photos. I reminds me of when Issac was circling me in the open field while I was so worried about him. Had I not been so scared for him, I might have enjoyed the majesty of his flight at that time. I do think back about it though. He was beautiful in the sky.

[shanlung]

Wow...those are som beautiful free flight photos. I reminds me of when Issac was circling me in the open field while I was so worried about him. Had I not been so scared for him, I might have enjoyed the majesty of his flight at that time. I do think back about it though. He was beautiful in the sky.

 

 

I guess you must be referring to Riamfada. I am glad no one else here is crazy enough to do what I have done.

 

I must do another repeat of my warning before I go further

 

I strongly urged people here not to do free flights with any kind of parrot as

FREE FLIGHT IS LIFE AND DEATH PLEASE DO NOT TRY THIS YOURSELF UNLESS YOU DO KNOW.

NEVER EVER FREE FLY WITHOUT THE KNOWLEDGE AS THIS CAN LEAD TO LOSS AND DEATH OF YOUR BIRD.

 

Notwithstanding what you have seen, I am extremely conservative in my approach, a tiny step followed by another tiny step. All the earlier training of Riamfada in harness and leash in different wind conditions, cross wind and head and tail wind.

 

And hide & seek recalls. Look at this if you dont know hide&seek recall.

SA 2010 & current affairs // Cost of mash experiments & sexy cleavage// More Riam hide&seek recalls

 

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/116336.html

 

 

 

 

Also training in flying DOWN in great height, especially when I found castles here in Oman.

Harry Potter // Rustaq // 1st overland into Lhasa

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/105488.html

 

 

I cannot repeat in this post the explicit details of what I had done which can be read in the URLs in that earlier posting of free flight photos. Perhaps it might be worth your while to go and read that , especially the warnings and more on what I went wrong.

 

If that put you off free flight totally, I think I have done you a huge favour.

 

Free flight is not necessary at all as the risks are so huge and Murphy do lurk just about everywhere. Even if Murphy aint around, parroty jokes can induce life shortening heart attacks.

 

Allowing your Issac to be flighted at home, in a safe secure environment covered about 98% of all the good things a flighted birdie can get.

 

Allowing your Issac to join you safely outside to fly in a good secure harness aka Tinkerbell UltraLite harness will add 1.9% to that 98%

 

Total true free flight add 0.1% more but the risk of seeing the ball of grey becoming a speck and disappearing altogether is real.

 

Hope you are much better now that Issac is back with you. But have you regained all the years you have lost in that 24 hours when he roamed about outside?

 

I think not. But that is part of your cost of entering the Overnighters' Club.

 

Try not to pay refresher dues on that Club. The refresher dues will be even more costly than the first time entry.

 

I know that from first hand experience. Try to take my word for it.

 

Or read the terror I have had in BanTienYen

 

 

The Agony

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/71760.html

 

and the Ecstasy

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/72611.html

 

Tinkerbell - Rescue at Bantienyen

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/73198.html

 

Tinkerbell - Bantienyen In Retrospect

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/73232.html

 

 

 

 

Warmest regards

 

Shanlung

山龍

 

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/

[Keywe]

Keywe, what is the name of the air filter you bought? I have been thinking about getting a good one...

He has allergies to allot of things. We also have 2 dogs. I keep the place pretty clean hoping it will help him, our new place here in Va is a 3 level townhouse. He knew when we met that I loved animals, one of the dogs is his. I don't have allergies so I don't know what he goes through, I just have to listen to him snore and complain:). We have been together for over 4 years, 3 with dogs and 2 with the bird. I think I just need to invest in maybe 2 good quality air filters, one where the cage is and one in the bedroom. The good ones are so expensive though.

 

We have a Kenmore from Sears... We paid around $100 for it, and we keep a pre-filter in front of the HEPA one to help it last longer. I clean the pre-filter out about once a week and it's amazing what it catches! The prefilter is black, and everytime I take it out, it's white. I have Keywe in our Florida/office room, 12x12 feet, and I've always had tons of white powder all over my desk, computer, etc... since I put this in here, it stays clean!

[tarm]

shanlung,

 

I do not foresee me ever free flight'n other than in large indoor enclosures such as a warehouse or the like. I very much like what you have created with the harness and use of braided fishing line. That is the only way I think I will ever be allowing outside flight. I have read many of your stories and commentaries. Frankly, I think some of the positions that were found over on the freeflgiht list are fool hardy. Maybe its different with birds such as B@G Scarlets and the other large macaws but from everything I have seen Greys can fly and fly a long ways and very high comparatively. So even if a big Macaw were to not come back it likely would not land out of site given proper and reasonable location choice. A Grey as your experience with Tinkerbell showed can and will fly right out of sight in the certain ( usually spooked) conditions even with no good perching locations for over 5 miles. Harness and line for me.

 

Cheers,

 

Tim

[Elvenking]

Shanlung....ohh I hope you don't think that I would ever consider 'Free Flight' training Issac. At most..out on a harness if i can ever get one on him. I have seen your home-grown harness and am curious. Issac will not let me get the Aviator over his head...he just will not have it. So I am wondering if there is another solution. What do you think?

[shanlung]

tarm, elvenking, and all others too.

 

I am most happy to put the fear against total free flights.

 

Believe me, that Overnighters Club is the most terrible place to be. Yet that required the successful recovery of the birdie.

 

If the birdie is gone and not recovered, you will walk only as a shell of a person and as a zombie on Earth. No one will know if you can recover, as you will fade away.

 

I think elvenking will agree with all that I said as we all seen in real life and real time that he walked that terrible road.

YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE ON THAT ROAD EVER!

ELVENKING AND I HAVE BEEN LUCKY.

WE ARE AT LEAST IN THE OVERNIGHTERS CLUB.

NOT THE ONE BEYOND THAT.

WILL YOU EVER BE THAT LUCKY?

 

In that freeflight list, I am considered a heretical madman and to be tarred and feathered on sight because of my advocating a safe intermediate ground of taking a birdy out on harness, especially a grey against all they say.

 

I proceeded to design that harness and develope my system as can be read here

http://www.geocities.com/shanlung9/harness1.html

 

 

Freeflight list do not even believe in the intermediate step of semi freeflight flying in warehouse until I first did that in 2002 and reported on in detail.

 

Freeflight list was started by a person with a show with many birdies to chose from with more to take from. Prepared to use 'weight management' . If birdie do not come back fast enough, even more 'weight management'?

 

If you are like them, go walk with them and that path.

 

 

I, you, and others have that one and only one birdie that is our love and life. And not a flock to pick and choose, and to replace even.

 

If you are like me, you can read my meticulous notes in my blog and walk with me.

 

People who could not get a commercial harness on their parrot wrote back to me their parrot accepted Tink UltraLite harness, a harness just 3 grams in weight and they made to their size without bows , buckles and kitchen sink to 'adjust' that harness.

 

Go into this thread here and see the URLs.

How to make Tinkerbell Ultra-Lite Harness

 

http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?190575

 

 

If you all make and use Tinkerbell Ultra-Lite, I will walk alongside of you.

 

I see no reason to advise on any commercial harness other than to tell you to throw that into the rubbish bin. Or you can take that up with that maker. Not with me.

 

Even with the best of harness aka Tinkerbell Ultra-Lite, it must not just be a stuffing of the birdie inside. They live to 70 years and more.

 

What is a few days, or even a few weeks to slowly bring them to like the harness?

 

What is the hurry ? Are you in a race ? If so, harness usage is not for you.

 

I took about a week as can be seen in my blog. I knew Riam accepted the harnesseven earlier, and I resisted a couple of days from completing that procedure to be sure it had been slow and easy on her.

 

You can see Riam sticking her neck into the harness and actively assisting me in the harnessing as she loved it and knew that was the precursor of taking her out into the sunshine and adventure.

 

What we have done can be done by you too.

 

Be careful, be paranoid and be safe.

 

And if you use Tinkerbell UltraLite, I promise you will not walk alone.

 

And you can enjoy your birdie with you outside safely clipped or unclipped.

 

You will not believe the magic that will come with that.

Edited August 6, 2010 by shanlung

[Elvenking]

Great stuff Shanlung, I will read over your articles when I have some time off of work this evening. This is good stuff. It is going to take a little time with Issac, as he does not like things going over his head very much. And in order to create a positiver relationship between him and the harness, i have to get him in it once to show him that it means getting out to fly about. Like you say though, it is no race...so if time it takes, then time it will get. Thanks for all your helpful information.

[tarm]

Shanlung,

 

I agree with your comments and statements.

[pearllyn]

I know this is a debate that will go on and on...... and on, but I can't help but think that if you don't want a pet that flies, get a hamster, a guinea pig, cat or a dog.......but don't get a bird then cripple it. It may not cause physical harm but what about emotional?

Steven, to get Isaac to accept it, when Alfie was going through her "no way to the harness" phase, we did the following maybe half a dozen times and then she decided it maybe wasn't all that bad. Offered her to put the harness on, and when she refused, went without her - even if it was just outside so she could see where we were. Sometimes we would take her away in the car and try to put the harness on her to go for a walk, then do the same, if she refused, go without her. She learned really quickly that if she didn't put the harness on she got lef behind, and now she never refuses it. SHe doesn't love the harness, it's more of a tolerance, but she would def rather wear it and be with us, than not. Good luck with Isaac - I think he'll come round for you.

[Guest]

KimKim,

 

The feathers and dust are going everywhere now anyway. Even the smallest movement of air takes bahzillions of microscopic particles from place to place. The only way the dust isn't going to get into the other rooms of the house is if the house is completely sealed off and no one lives in it. Course, even if a spider came out at night and walked across the wall, dust would be sent on its way from point A to point B.

 

On an aside, perhaps check out "Eat Right For Your Type." It's a book by Peter J. D'Adamo, M. D. and without hijacking this thread, I'll just say it is well worth a read. I and many of my friends and family have been helped immensely by modifying our diets and other lifestyle factors as outlined in this fantastic book. Oh, and this book is so much more than "Eat more vegetables and walk 30 minutes/day," by the way.

[Elvenking]

I know this is a debate that will go on and on...... and on, but I can't help but think that if you don't want a pet that flies, get a hamster, a guinea pig, cat or a dog.......but don't get a bird then cripple it. It may not cause physical harm but what about emotional?

Steven, to get Isaac to accept it, when Alfie was going through her "no way to the harness" phase, we did the following maybe half a dozen times and then she decided it maybe wasn't all that bad. Offered her to put the harness on, and when she refused, went without her - even if it was just outside so she could see where we were. Sometimes we would take her away in the car and try to put the harness on her to go for a walk, then do the same, if she refused, go without her. She learned really quickly that if she didn't put the harness on she got lef behind, and now she never refuses it. SHe doesn't love the harness, it's more of a tolerance, but she would def rather wear it and be with us, than not. Good luck with Isaac - I think he'll come round for you.

 

What a brilliant idea. Yeah...I just have to proceed slow with him. I think I just have to get him out once, and actually have him have some fun outside...then I think it might get easier. Thank you for your suggestion.

[Guest]

I forgot to say ...... (And I tried to edit the post, but it was too complicated for this non-computer-literate person! Sorry for the extra post! I hope no one gets upset with me! I really did try to edit my post instead of adding another post!)

 

 

If he has sinus issues, then another way he can help his poor sinuses feel better is by using a neti pot. You are essentially rinsing out the sinus cavity with a weak saline solution. Think about it - what is causing the inflammatory response within the sinus? It's the allergen. So if you rinse off the allergen, then you are removing the problem, as opposed to simply squelching the body's response (sniffles, sneezing, clogged up nose and sinuses, etc.) to the allergen with a drug.

 

Using the neti pot looks intimidating and like it might hurt, but I assure you it does not hurt one bit. In fact, if you look on youtube, you can easily find many vids of people using the neti pot, including a 3-year-old little girl.

 

Ok, hope your hubby feels better soon! Hope my two suggestions are at least helpful to someone out there!

[KimKim]

Thank you, I will look into the neti pot, I have never even heard of it. I will also look at the book, but we already try to eat healthy, we were both US Marines, I am out now and he is a lifer!

[Keywe]

the neti pot or a sinus rinse with saline (bought at any walgreens, cvs, etc...) works wonders... I've been using that for a couple of years and you wouldn't believe what comes out. You may feel like you are drowning at first, but the key is to relax, hang your head over the sink, and open up your mouth and nose at the same time and squirt the water up and let it do it's work... It helps tremendously. Also, I just cleaned out the filter after about 2 weeks and I can't believe I haven't had it the whole time... It's amazing how much dander it catches...

[KimKim]

Ok, so I went out and bought him the neti pot and a new air cleaner, the same one Keywe suggested. He used the neti pot and liked it, and also liked the newer air cleaner, I got the medium size one. I told him we can go back and get another one if we like the way it works. So far so good, and he hasn't said anything about me not clipping Babalu lately... Until I have to tell him to keep the bath/house doors shut, then he will probably say something about having to worry about that. So far Babalu has on new flight feather, it looks silly.

[KimKim]

here he is, with his new feather