LisaM

In the long run it will be worth it. And good luck on the toweling. I have pretty much given up on that. Mine freak out if I'm even folding towels in the same room. That said, the vet has no problem toweling them. I need to have her show me exactly how she's doing it because I clearly don't have the knack. I need to do the whole desensitizing thing too. The way I see it, there's real-time, kid-time (you know, slowing down the minute you say you're in a hurry) and parrot-time...which makes kid-time seem like lightspeed. :laugh: Lisa

Here's another incident: Tonight one of my parrots was on my shoulder. For whatever reason, he let out a really loud piercing screech right into my ear (yeah, still ringing a bit). It made me jump which in turn made him fly off my shoulder onto the table. I said a loud "OUCH" (reflex, couldn't help it:blush: ). He was at the other end of the table and turned around looking at me. I said (covering my ear with my hand), "Max, that really hurt". After a few moments he put his beak on the table and walked across the table back to me with his beak on the table the whole time (never has done that before). Came up to my arm and sat there with his beak on the table, head against my arm. I said, "that's okay, I know you didn't do it on purpose". Now I know he doesn't understand the words I said, but probably felt the meaning behind them. He then stepped up onto my arm and all was well. It was like when my dog puts her head down knowing she did something she wasn't supposed to. It was definitely clear that he knew that something he did upset me and that seemed to be his way of trying to make amends. Lisa

Or you can go to www.tinypic.com You just browse for the file you want to upload and then select "message board" in the Resize field, click Upload Now... When it's done, copy the IMG code into your message here (the whole thing including the IMG in brackets at the beginning and at the end) and it will magically appear. At least it seems like magic to me! The site doesn't store it or anything, just use as needed. Hope that helps. Lisa<br><br>Post edited by: LisaM, at: 2009/02/08 01:30

When I'm skritching Kenya's head/neck, I see "powder" but not flakes. If they're preening on me though, I get little flakes all over. I think it's more the casing off new feathers in my case. And Kenya would accept hours upon hours of skritching if I had the stamina for it. If I stop she starts banging her beak on me to remind me of the task at hand. :laugh: I equate it to a good massage...I hate it when it's over! It may be the oils in your skin/fingertips that cause the feathers to get/feel softer while you're scratching him, but that's just a guess. I can't say that I've really noticed that happening with mine. If you think it's dry skin (and even if you find that it's not), you could (and some would say should) try to get Aloe Vera Juice (not gel) and spray it, undiluted, on him, trying as best as you can to get under the feathers and to the skin itself. Another thing is to give him Red Palm Oil if you're not already doing that. Lots of info here if the search the forums in case you haven't seen it already. Does he seem to be preening any more aggressively than in the past? That could be a sign that his skin is bothering him too. Does he get regular showers (soaking to the skin as best as possible)? If so, what frequency/temp? I scale back the frequency of showers in the winter to 1-2/week. Lastly, it is DEFINITELY a great indication that you are building trust with him if he is letting you skritch more. You may also be able to tell if he's getting more relaxed (mine sometimes almost falls asleep now) while you're doing it for awhile. Heck, I almost fall asleep while I'm doing it sometimes. It's very relaxing to me. I think I go into a "bird skritch trance"! :-) Lisa

Well Welcome to Bubba! He looks like he's in pretty good feather. More pictures would be fantastic! (not to try to guess age, just because we love pics! :-)). What, if anything, do you know about his history? Did you get him from an individual or through a store? Any idea of how many homes he has had or what his diet was like or what his housing situation was? Even though the vet is a couple hours away, I would definitely recommend getting in for a wellness check and baseline work. Give him plenty of time and space and "ambient", soft attention. It sounds like he's coming around slowly and is just adjusting to you and his new home. Having rehomed an older one myself, I can only hope you have as good an experience as I have. I can't imagine life without Kenya. Please keep us posted on the "coughing" and how he's adjusting. Lisa

That's great to hear Jason!

danmcq wrote: That is SOOO true. All of my parrots are like that too. Our male Ekkie LOVES one of my husband's friends that the other two don't like at all. He plays pretty "rough" with him but he seems to love it and keeps going back for more! From the first time she met my mom, Kenya, our CAG, would step up to her. She even let her skritch her head once (but not since). She's very leery of most others at first. She's almost 15 but we've only had her for 3 years so I have no idea how socialized she was in previous homes (we believe she had several, unfortunately). Lisa

I think it's fine to keep the cage in your office as you spend a lot of time in there and it may be the best place for him to sleep at night. If I were you I would get a playstand for the living room and then he can be in there with you when you guys are in there, going back to his cage to sleep in the office. One thing to note however. In your pictures you have a container of nuts (It looks like Archer Farms from Target?). If they are the nuts that came in the container, they are likely roasted/salted. I would provide "raw" nuts to him to cut back on the salt. They also sometimes like the nuts in the shell as they have to work at it to get the food out (natural foraging opportunity). You may have to teach him that there's a goodie inside by chiping away part of the shells at first. Almonds are great for this. Also, I would use nuts as a treat or as a small part of his overall diet, not "free feeding", as he may choose to eat them before anything else and though they have protein and healthy fats, they don't need that many. I would keep pellets or at least a mixture that is heavy in pellet % as his "free feeding" mix. He is ADORABLE!!! :kiss: :kiss: :kiss: Lisa

Ours are out of their cages (and usually on their playstands) almost the whole time we're home unless we need them to be there for some reason (they keep flying off the playstand when we need them to stay there, a visitor is afraid of birds, etc.). That said there are periodic days when they unfortunately get very little to no out-of-cage time (if we have to go somewhere in the evenings and aren't going to be home until well after their bedtime) and the occassional weekend away (Fri-Sun). Most weekends they are out all day from the time we get up until it's time to go to bed. Most weeknights it's from the time we get home until the time we go to bed. We haven't had any problems getting them to go back in their cages when we want/need them to. Maybe it helps that we have three so they watch eachother or the fish aquariums or something, but they don't seem to be negatively impacted by the inconsistent schedule sometimes. We do the best we can. I think the important thing is to do like Dan said and get them used to having the amount of time with you that you predict will be similar to the long-term amount they'll have with you.

Edi - I'm so sorry to hear this news. I know you had high hopes and more resources at your disposal than most of us when it comes to nursing a Grey in poor health back. You did everything you could and yes, you definitely provided him the best 4 days of his life. I'm sure he felt the love you had for him. Re: craigslist...I got all three of my parrots through craigslist/local paper classifieds. They are wonderful parrots that just needed a new home. Some people have good reasons for finding a new home and not all of them were abused or neglected. You will often find that they weren't on the best diet ever though. That was the case with me but other than that mine have been fantastic additions to our family. Good luck to you and please stay with us while you search! Lisa

I have come to realize that there are some people who just will not likely ever adjust to having birds in the house. This can be for many reasons (noise, mess, etc), but they're there. Think back to before you were pregnant and if you think the mess would have bothered you as much then. If so, it's likely it will bother you in the future. I think animal poop is somehow different than baby messes. Nature must make us moms immune to the nastiness of baby poop/puke in order for our species (humans) to survive. I have a friend who has several kids but if my bird is sitting on the back of the chair and poops on the floor she freaks about how she could never stand that in her house (she likes the birds other than that). If you think it will be a problem forever, you should really try to get your husband to consider rehoming him. It may cause more strife between you and your husband more and more and you'll have enough on your plates trying to raise a child. Just my two cents. I certainly don't think you should feel bad about your feelings and like DavidH, I'm a bit concerned that you really think your husband will hate you for asking him to rehome the bird. I hope that is not the case. Please let us know what you decide. No matter what, we will be here for you and for Mika. Lisa

As far as the packets of dried fruits...you have to be sure if you give them those (and they should only be a small part of the overall diet for Greys) that they are "unsulfured" and don't have added sugar or salt. The ingredients on the bag should list the fruit only. One thing you can do to make seeds healthier is to "sprout" them. Basically you are soaking them for a period of time (usually overnight) and then rinsing them out a few times a day until a little sprout comes out of them. There are more detailed instructions if you search for "sprouting seeds". This will only work on fresh seeds, grains and beans though. Sprouted seeds are actually very nutritious for them. This is in addition to the pellets (which I hope you are able to find or at least order online), fresh veggies, cooked "mash", etc. There are a lot of choices to give other than seeds. If you read through some of the "sticky" threads at the top, that will provide a wealth of information as far as ideas as well as what NOT to feed them.

Okay, I'll be the odd duck on this one. I do move my perches around every couple of months. I keep the sleeping on in place for my Grey though because I think it's the best place for it. I also move the food bowls around, but the water is at a spot where it's easy for my daughter to take them out and put in clean ones so that pretty much stays put (it's on her list of morning chores). I don't feel it's necessary, but I don't think it hurts anything unless you have a bird that really doesn't adjust well to change. All of mine like to go in and explore around their "new" cage for awhile after I put them in after moving things around. I put my grey on her sleeping perch so she can "survey" things a bit first, but soon she's climbing around and figuring out how she's going to get to each bowl, etc. I should add though that I'm also one of "those people" who rearrange my living room furniture (including the bird stand locations) every couple of months as well. :blush:

There are many "homemade" muesli recipes that have a lot of the same ingredients that many of us use in a "dry mix". Many of the packaged Muesli cereals have added sugar/salt so I would definitely check the entire ingredients list. My dry mix contains a variety of grains, dried fruits, nuts, dried veggies, etc. I provide a small amount of that in one dish in their cage during the day and a mixture of pellets in another. I move the bowls around the cage too to try to increase their "foraging" opportunities. On the grains, I would try to use whole grains instead of flaked or rolled. And I also use the same grains along with some beans in a soaked mix, cooked mix, or to "sprout". Lisa

Oh, come on Linda...you can't tell us that without telling us at least which one is your favorite??? :laugh:

Alex is fabulous. The reason she and her husband won't take on birds of their own is that she was diagnosed and went through chemo/rad treatment for ovarian cancer 3 years ago and it was pretty late state and likely to recur. Her husband has prosthetic legs and only has limited motion/use of his hands/arms. It would just be too much for them to take on for the long-term. Besides, like grandparents, they can come play with ours but don't have to deal with the "messy" stuff! :-) And I'm pretty sure my other friends wouldn't dream of trying their food (though I have been caught sneaking treats out of the fruit/veggie/nut/pasta mix...all human grade foods of course though!). Don't worry Judy - I'll bring out the good stuff for you! Lisa

Pchela - This is what my vet used to recommend with Sunshine Factory (RPO)...If you want to mix it in with pellets or seed, you can put it in a cup of hot water (not boiling) to "melt" it a little. Then you can pour it over the seed/pellet/whatever and then stir it around and it will coat pretty nicely. Make sure it's cooled off before you give it to them. Lisa

Saturday evening we had a couple over that we like to hang out and play games with. I had gone to the birdie store earlier that day where I stocked up on a ton of stuff. The wife, Alex, absolutely loves all my birds but they can't have any of their own. So I was mixing up an assortment of pellets to put in their foraging toys (Their mix of Roudybush, Tops and Zupreem and I add in a bag of Harrisons). So Alex, my friend who doesn't even HAVE birds, decides to do a taste test on the pellets. She actually didn't think any of them were too bad, but here is the order starting with her favorite: 1. TOPS 2. Roudybush 3. Zupreem 4. Harrisons She thinks it may just have been that the Harrisons is a lot "harder" to chew. My husband is embarassed that we had friends over and fed them parrot pellets. I, on the other hand, thanked her for doing a good service to parrots everywhere! :-)

I feel bad for you Char as I'm sure no matter what we all say you're still feeling a bit guilty. Please try not to. Our feathered friends live a long time. It's best to start out with one who is at least healthy to start out with and you never know what would come in the future due to his previous care. As for the vet bill, maybe if you explained the situation your vet would give you a bit of a discount or at least a small credit towards your next appointment there (or discount on food, etc.). Maybe not but the worst thing to happen would be they would say no. Never hurts to ask. Good luck to you and I'm glad you found someone from whom you can get a healthy baby in the spring. Lisa

Your vet can get a blood sample for the testing. I'm a ninny about those things so that's what I did. :-)

Dave has some great detailed questions for you to discuss with your vet. I hope you are able to find some resolution for your baby. Maybe since you're catching it while he's still pretty young it can be changed around. There have been some great stories of people working with their "old" greys who have plucked for years and years and now are in fantastic feather. Please keep posting about Molly's progress. I can't imagine how difficult it is for you to go through this with her and how awful it is for her. That's an interesting collar. I've never seen that type before but it looks like it's probably better than those big ones that stick out forever. I always wonder about the affect of not being able to do even normal preening and how that impacts them but in cases like this, a collar may be a good idea (I have no opinion one way or another and fortunately have never been in the position to need one so far). I do like that one better than the others though. Warm thoughts out to you and Molly!!! Lisa

I'm glad you're still coming back here Kook. IT sounds like everything you're going through is part of a normal grieving process. I'm very glad you're not jumping into something too quickly and that you're giving yourself permission to feel what is natural for you. You will make the best decision for yourself when the time is right. I am also thrilled that you found an alternative to that horrible, horrible store. It's difficult because it sometimes makes us want to "rescue" all the poor little ones in the bad places. As you found out the hard way though, often it's just not possible. Warmest regards out to you. And it sounds like your husband is being pretty supportive in these circumstances. Give him a hug from me too! Lisa

The online LLP (Living and Learning with Parrots) course with Susan Friedman was the best time I have spent learning about parrots (well, second only to HERE of course :laugh: :laugh: ). Seriously though, it helped me identify several things I was doing that were reinforcing the exact behaviors I was trying to eliminate. It puts things in a very logical format and there is ongoing support after the course is over within a Yahoo Group. There was a waiting list (it took me over a year before I actually started the course), but it was well worth the wait. Lisa

I think there is a lot less hype this year. Arizona? Lucky to be in the Big Game. Heck, even our Vikings beat them this year! :-) Guess our division has to send someone though... That said, the grocery store was busier yesterday when I went than it was the day before Thanksgiving or Christmas this year! Lots of parties going on. We'll likely catch the last half. Lisa

My very best wishes for you and Jac and for his recovery. It must be difficult to have him going through all that. Know that you're doing everything you can and hopefully he will be back to his old self quickly. Lisa