Jane08

Oh yeah there is nothing funnier than a grey who wants attention Rangi plays the game where he flies to somewhere he is not allowed (usually the kicthen bench) and then yells "Look you naughty boy, who's a naughty boy" as he knows this will get me running becuase I know he is up to no good when he uses this sentence. If I ignore it he then starts to throw things on the floor. I then come in and say to him "now I am coming to get you" and he will race off as quick as his little legs will carry him doing bunny hops all the way, shaking his little red butt at me and yelling "now I am coming to get you".

She will take care of the rest that didn't come out by herself. This has happened to Kea a couple of times, she chewed the broken feather off and then a couple of days later while she was preening she got the rest of the shaft out. Just keep an eye on it.

They do go through stages, our 2 went through the difficult stage of not wanting to go back in the cage and many times I was late to work because of it. I was also home alone with both of them as my boyfriend travels for work, with Kea who really didn't like me and Rangi who was very stubborn. Let's just say I shed many tears over this period. There is nothing wrong with bribery to get them in the cage. Maybe spend 5-10min just doing exercises with Ecko, like start back with step up and spend 5 min getting him to step up and give him a treats for doing it. Do other exercises that he finds fun and this will have you interacting with him and build your confidence. I did this with both of ours and I couldn't believe the change in them, Kea really started to bond with me even though my boyfriend was the favourite. Rangi started to go back in the cage easily. Just give it time, take a deep breath and realise that you can change this.

This me trying to get Kea in the cage in the morning, she drives a hard bargin. Me: Kea, I must go to work you must go in the cage Kea: Go to work, coming back soon Me: yes Kea Kea: Can I have a piece of sausage Me: Ok Kea as long as you go in the cage Kea: Ok Then I am obviously not faster enough getting the sauseage and all I hear is Kea: sausage, sausage, sausage, sausage.... Me: Yes kea the sausage is coming By this stage the little rat is sitting on the perch just outside the cage and I bring the sausage over and she leaps on me grabs the sausage and is in the cage.<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/10/01 15:14

Kea sort of has a laugh that she uses and has done it in context a few times. The best was when we watched a scary movie and she was on my boyfriends shoulder. There was the scary part coming up and you can hear the music building and just as the person was going to get killed Kea let out this huge scream and my boyfriend lept with fright. It was so funny serves him right he is usually the one who tries to scare me when we watch those movies. She must have felt the tension building and knew that something big was about to happen.

Jeez that is one big pantry of bird stuff Katana. It's like we are packing to move at the moment and my boyfriend said the birds have 6 boxes of stuff to move and I am like what the heck they have more boxes than me. We also give them sugar cane and I just jam it in between the bars of the cage, or I cut it into bits that are easier for them to manage and then they just hold it and munch away.

Janfromboone, yeah our 2 make all the add on noises like toot toot, they even do the tune from the film close encounters, so they say "what do we say when the spaceship comes" and then they whistle the tune. My boyfriend teaches them crazy stuff. I also think like others say if you make things into a big game for them they seem to accept it better. It's like that saying curiosity got the cat, sometimes Kea will pace up and down torn between her fear and the fun she is missing out on. It's like an internal war going on in her head, but finally she can't control herself and has to see what the fuss is about. I have found that our 2 are totally different. Rangi doesn't really worry about new things coming into his environment, he will have an initial reaction but he is so curious he can't help himself but look. The thing he is scared of is things outside his environment, like the neighbour having a blanket hanging from their balcony and Rangi can see it. He becomes a quivering mess. Kea is the opposite she freaks at anything new in her environment, but if it's something outside she just looks at Rangi like why are you shaking I don't notice anything. One thing I do make sure that I have at home is a safe place, so a place both our birds know they can fly to if they ever feel insecure. This place is the top of the kitchen cuprboards and I never put anything up there. It gives me peace of mind and less stress to know that if something scares them they won't fly willy nilly crashing into things and looking for somewhere to land, they go directly to their safe place.

Greys and change is something that I have been looking at for awhile. Many people say that greys hate change so things should be the same, routines etc. For the last 3 years I have played around a bit with this and our 2 greys. Every 6 months we totally change the inside of their cage, all new sticks, eating bowls in different places. At first they are apprehensive, but they are so curious that it doesn't take long for them to go in and have a play around. They seem so stimulated by the change. We have changed where they eat their food many times, from the kitchen to the living room, to the cage. We take them out in the car nearly every month, to a relatives place, for a bird play date etc and as soon as they get in the car they are saying "shall we ride in the car, toot toot". They seem to love the different environment at other places. Their eyes are wide and that curiosity mixed with a bit scared look is there, but soon they can't help themselves and have to explore. We take them outside in summer and the stimulation they have there is amazing.I watch them as they clap eyes on different things and are so interested. It all came to a head last week when we bought a house and started to pack and renovate our place to sell. We moved the whole cage into the bedroom, they took this in their stride and it didn't take them long to adjust. Yesterday we showed them the renovations. We had done a feature wall and when Rangi saw that he was so shocked he fell off my boyfriends hand. The next reaction he had was to be lifted up and he wanted to go and have a look. I guess what I am trying to say is that I think change can be a good thing. Greys are very curious intelligent birds and need stimulation. I really think it has to do with how you introduce the change, your reaction to them and the change and how you help them through the change. Do you all change things for your grey, are you too scared to do it, or do you have set routines for your greys?<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/09/29 09:17

I do feel for you but you must know that there is no such thing as an antisocial grey. The grey does not have the problem, it's you. Don't take this the wrong way all I am saying is that we teach our greys how to behave and interact with us and sometimes we are not aware of the problem we are creating. We are the ones that create these problems, i.e the biting and then we blame our birds which isn't really fair. Your bird is trying to communicate with you and you are not listening so he resorts to biting which achieves the desired results. He gets something out of this behaviour and thinks it's ok. Totally not his fault. Believe me I know the frustration and you are right it is a bummer, but it doesn't have to be like this if you are prepared to work at it. I thought Kea would never ever interact with me but with months and months of changing how I dealt with her really paid off. There is no quick fix, it will take time, an action plan and patience. You have such a young grey and this can really be turned around, don't give up on Dexter he deserves more than that. Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/09/25 16:38<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/09/25 16:38

I would also give him some space, if he bites you when you touch him stop touching him, this is his way of telling you he doesn't want it. I had the same thing with Kea, if I got anywhere close to her she would take a piece of me and hard as well. I also became scared of going near her and I know she sensed this and took advantage of it. I just stopped putting myself in those situations where she could bite and my confidence started to grow. I then devised a plan to overcome the biting. The first part was just to become more aware of her body langauge and what she is telling me. Second I would just get close to her no touching and quietly have conversations with her and give her an odd treat. The last step was to use those treats to train her to do things. She really responded to the training and we went back to basics with step up, wave and finally fetch. I did this for months with her and she really changed and we started to have fun together. I became confident in handling her again and the biting stopped.

Very interesting because I have always thought Kea has more slanted or almond eyes which Rangi doesn't have, his are more round

I also keep the grate in as I know if I took it out they would have a free for all at he bottom of the cage for the left overs and poop would be all over them. I am a little clean obsessed so I clean the grate everyday. I just take it out and put it in the bath.

My first thought is it's for lazy people who see it as a quick fix.

Well we have a male and a female, we got the female as a friend for the male, both are flighted. We had Rangi just over 8 months before Kea came along. They were both babies which made it easier for them to get along. We have had no problems of them getting on and they are actually in the same cage. They are bonded to each other but Kea is obsessed with my boyfriend and Rangi loves me so we have no issues with them rejecting us in favour of each other. Yes my sanity is tested sometimes because if one is up to no good in one room you can be sure the other is taking advantage and is up to no good in the other room. Really it hasn't been as bad as I thought. My first thought was god how do you get both in the cage at the same time, but as soon as one goes in the other wants to follow. We always use this trick, if you get one to do something the other one always thinks he/she is missing out and wants to follow. Using this method has made things very easy. For us it was the best thing we could have done for Rangi it didn't stress him at all, he was happy before but we really noticed a positive change in him when Kea came along which we never thought would happen as he was happy before her or so we thought.

I also think if you are aware of your bird and have a strong grounding you will have no problems. We have one of each and really Rangi the male actually started to calm down a lot after he turned 2. The biting stopped and he started to go back in his cage easily. I really think the worst stage with him was up until age 2. Kea is nearly 2 and I can see signs of her wanting to be assertive, but this is not the first time she has shown these signs just in other ways. Maybe having 2 of them helps because if one of them starts to get bossy the other one tells him/her to pull their head in, much better than we could.

I think the best way would be to contact your local bird association or Avian vet who would be able to put you on the right track to find a bird to adopt. There are lots of restrictions with shipping birds in Europe because of the brid flu and some countries will not even accept importation of birds.

I am another one that did that with the pomegrnatate and it is so hard to get off. Ours was all over the wallpaper. Another mistake I made was giving them a blueberry bush with loads of blueberries on it. It took them no time to de berry the bush and re decorate the walls blue.

Oh god Char that is so funny, imagine taking your bird to the vet for masterbation, lol. I was always told that you should not encourage it as you would be giving them foreplay so to speak and then no folllow through and that they become sexually frustrated by this. I guess I won't have this problem as we have a male and a female, although I have already had a talk with her about babies and that if she has one she won't be keeping it, hehe.

When I read your post I think what do you mean re establish a bond, you already have it if you are able to cuddle with her for an hour every night. I don't even have that with our female Kea, but we have a very strong bond but just in a different way. She sounds like a normal grey. I can't count the number of times our 2 have been through different stages, same as Alfie, suddenly one day deciding no I don't want to step up and go in the cage and me having to change the way I get them in. This could go on for a few weeks and then suddenly back to going in the cage easy. One day suddenly flying to my hand and biting it and this going on for a month and then it stopped. For me I have taken this as normal grey growing up stuff and have never taken it personally. They don't do these things to be mean, they do it for a purpose and if you really listen and watch what they are trying to tell you it will be much easier. Must admit I do find it a bit odd how people think that there grey will be this well behaved animal for the rest of it's life with no issues or problems which need working out together.

What a cutie, she has that possesed look in her eyes in the last photo, like my life will end if you don't stay home with me.

Totally agree they are special. I had a moment with our 2 this morning. Rangi was perched on the back of my seat asking me for kisses which he got, while Kea was perched on my hand gazing out the window. She would then turn her head and look at me and I had tears in my eyes thinking how precious they are and how much I love them and what a responsibility that is. I am responsible for their happiness, caring for them, teaching them, feeding them, loving them, activating them, playing with them, keeping them safe whilst giving them freedom, their health and this is for the rest of my life. Can't get any bigger than that.

Sorry to laugh, but this sounds so familiar. Rangi used to do it to me, sit on the back of the couch and then out of the blue race down the couch and bite my arm. I also just ignored it and told him not to bite. He would then run across the couch to my boyfriend and mess with him, same thing the ziper and buttons. I just took him off straight away and put him back on my couch. Didn't make a big deal of it. He now does this thing with my boyfirend by getting as close to him as possible and waits for my boyfriend to touch him and then he bites him. My boyfriend understood that so didn't touch him, but Rangi being Rangi would again get close and when my boyfriend didn't touch him Rangi would touch my boyfriend on purpose and then oh you touched me and he would bite my boyfriend. Rangi also went through a phase of flying to my hand and immediately biting it hard. That lasted for about a month and then it was over he didn't do it again. Kea is nearly 2 and is also having her willful stage. The not wanting to go back in the cage, flying to the head and pretending to bite. I just smile at her and tell her very calmly not to try it on as I am not having it. My boyfriend says Kea is the boss of the house when I am not home.

Lol that is great. When I am preparing the whole chicken to roast it Rangi loves to watch and is so curious and I tell him this will be you "roast rangi" if you don't behave. He now knows the word for chicken.<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/09/04 13:28

Moobu yeah I knew you were talking about anti rewards i.e. setting them down etc and no I didn't mean give a positive treat for the bad noise that would just not work. It's like Rangi loves to torment Kea sometimes and just approaches her in a certain way or touches her feathers with his beak and she lets out this distinct scream like someone is killing her. I know he enjoys hearing her scream so it becomes a game with him and he gets so much enjoyment out of it. It's like the noise of her scream encourages him. Dan I also tried something similar with Rangi when he would bite me I let out a scream (similar to the scream Kea would let out when he bit her as when she made it he backed off). Big mistake he loved it, so I also dropped that one. Dave I can just see you having tug of war, lol what a laugh. They all seem to love noise especially the vacuum cleaner, the TV, forget cranking that up at night to drown them out they just get louder.

I really don't think the noise for somehting done wrong is a good idea. Our birds do the wrong thing because there is something that they get out of it which they enjoy, you could end up actually reinforcing the bad behaviour because you are giving them the attention for doing somehting wrong. This is exactly what they want. It could also force your bird into other bad bahavours that you don't want.