Jane08

Like judy says hang in there and I hope it gets better.

Please don't be depressed, we have all done it with our greys. Don't take it personally he doesn't hate you, he is just confused and trying to figure out what is going on and this is his reaction to the situation. I have always found that if I scare one of our 2 I then go over to them, not too close and quietly apologise to them and then ask if they are ok and then I leave them alone to get over it. The worst thing you can do is rush over all concerned and force yourself on them. Then I just act like nothing has happened. When I come back 5min later everything is fine.

I just remembered another thing I have done in extreme cases. I place a sock or something they are scared over over the door and then they don't fly there. I know it looks odd with things over the door for awhile, but if it saves the door frmaes then it is worth it.

I know what you mean, they make a wood chipper look ineffective. It is frustrating especially if you are up and down like a yoyo for 2-3 hours everytime they land somewhere they are not allowed. One thing we do is if we see they are chewing on the woodwork more than usual is we go out in the forest and get them fresh sticks to chew on. This seems to have really helped Kea with this problem, she now sits on her play tree chewing the sticks instead of the doors. We made the play tree as high as the door so she still feels like she has somewhere high to sit.

Hhhmm and here was me thinking that was a normal grey behaviour. I have 2 of them that are bullies then. Rangi's favourite thing is to fly low over my orchid plant and brush it with his feet to knock off the flowers. They also fly to door frames, the kitchen sink where he throws things on the floor, tries to chew the wooden kitchen chairs. I just take them off when they land somewhere they are not allowed and place them on a perch or their play tree. It has got less and less over time with them flying to places they are not allowed as we have been pretty consistent with taking them off. They do learn it does take alot of time and patience. Can't you try with training first, clipping seems as bit extreme.

I think they understand in more ways than we give them credit for. Yes they might understand speech but I think this is a secondary thing, their main way of communication is body language which us as people are pretty crap at understanding in other people let alone our greys. I now just sit sometimes for say an hour and just watch our 2 and look at the different body language they give off in certain situations. Even when they interact with each other it is mostly with body language, there are minimal noises that are made. One aspect of them understanding which I don't think we give enough attention to is the fact that they have an amazing ability to pick up on feelings and emotions. They are so sensitive to this and as people I don't think we are as switched on to feelings and changes even subtle changes as our greys are.

It's brilliant isn't it having them fetch. I trained Kea to also fetch, she would run across the table grab a ring and race back and place it in my hand. She absolutely loved training....hhmm then again it was probably the treats she loved and would do anything for.

Yes you are right we go into parenthood the same way but there is a major difference....there is loads of support for being a parent and you are actually shown how to take care of your baby. There is nothing like that for a bird owner, to actually be shown what to do and how to take care of them. Personally I would rather see someone give up their bird if they found they couldn't cope with it, so that it could go to a loving home rather than spend the rest of it's life in misery.

Like Judy says they do disply body language before they bite it's just that you might be missing it as sometimes it can be very subtle. This is very common for young greys testing what they can do. You need to teach them what is acceptable. Both of ours have been through it and the way we dealt with it was to avoid being bitten as much as possible by watching for body language. If we missed the body langiage and got bitten we then immediately took them off us said "don't bite" and placed them on the perch and turned around and ignored them or walked out the room. They soon learnt that the fun stopped and this was caused by them biting too hard. When they used their beaks in a way that was acceptable I lavished them with praise and told them how good they were. If it was a really hard bite I placed them back in the cage for a short time. This needs to be immediate though so they undersand the link. After consistently doing this they both learnt what is acceptable when using their beaks on us.

The only sure way to find out is DNA. There are theories out there and people say they can tell by the shape of the head the size of the beak, red feathers around the vent etc, but none of this is reliable.

I actually understand some of these reasons. People read all about getting a bird and really the reality of it is totally different from what you think or read especially if you are a first time owner. I read everything before we got ours and nothing prepared me for the shock of what they were actually like. Yes we did have discussions about giving them up at times when we felt we were in too deep. I think the only difference between us and others who give them up is that we were willing to do anything to change things, like go on a training course, trying new things and most of all the fact that we made the commitment to get them and couldn't break this commitment.

I play this game with Rangi where he hangs from something upside down and I tiggle him under the wings and hold his back. Anyway in the last 2 days he just decided to let go with his feet and beak and to both our surprise rest on his back in my hand. Now the first time we both freaked a bit and he tried to flap his wings, which of course didn't work as he was on his back in my hand. I nearly dropped him, luckily he rolled off and was able to fly away. I feel very vulnerable when he does this and I don't really like it, but he has insisted on doing it for the last couple of days. The question is how do you get them back up if they are on their backs in your hand? My boyfriend said offer my other hand for him to grab with his beak and right himself. Well tried that and he nearly took my finger off. Any other ideas?

This sounds so familiar. The first thing I learnt is that it's no good to chase them. Our 2 used to always be able to tell from my anxiety level when it was time to go in the cage. This really affected them. If I stressed them I would then go away and come back a few mintues later when I had compossed myself. Now I put this image of me successfully putting them in the cage in my head before I even start. I then approach them very calm and explain to them that I have to go to work and they need to go in and how good they are and I am so proud. This is all done in quite a high pitch voice like I am excited. At this point I always used to have a treat in my hand as well. I then tell them they can have the treat if they go in. I then ask them to step up and slowly walk them to the cage. Pretty much 99% of the time I give them some sort of treat for going in the cage. I have found over time that they have learnt how it works and they go in the cage without a hitch 99% of the time. Of course they always expect the treat which they do get all the time.

Don't worry Rhonnie I am just a big cry baby when it comes to our birds. I even cry when my boyfriend takes one of the birds to the vet for the yearly check up. You did a brilliant job of conveying all the emotions, I loved reading you post

Oh boy the tears are streaming, beautifully said and 100% true. You are very lucky to have Ceasar who seems to have taught you a lot and Ceasar is very lucky to have someone who listens to him and enriches his life. I wish all grey owners were like you.

We painted and wallpapered our place just the other week and did exactly like you said, placed the birds in the closed bedroom. They were fine no problems at all. Good luck

Yes ours are less energetic in the winter monrings. I really noticed it when I got them up an hour later than normal this morning. They both came out still fluffed and sat there like, did you have to get us up. I then fed them and it was peace and quiet for 20min which is very unusual. We have been through a couple of winter seasons now so I see how they change with each season. Hope lily is ok.

I am so sorry to hear this, we also went through a really rough time with Kea to the point where I told my boyfriend I couldn't take it any longer. She would also screech and screech and screech to the point where she would have me in tears. I really feel for you, it is so stressful. Good luck with finding her a home.

Our 2 are so spoilt that when we looked for a new house we took into account their needs. Needless to say they have ended up with the best room in the house, it even has under floor heating and not even my bedroom has that.

Just so you know clipped birds can also escape and cliping your grey is no guarantee that it won't get away. Flighted birds do not think they are in control of the house, this is totally false. Yes they do have accidents as young birds maybe flying into a window, but they soon learn where the windows are and become ver capable of looking after themselves. Please don't let your breeder pressure you, it's your choice you are the one purchasing the bird. Our breeder also wanted us to have our first grey clipped before we brought him home as we were first time birds owners. We really insisted that he be flighted and we have never regretted that and this was my first bird ever and I managed it.

Well said Dave totally agree. We have 2 unclipped greys and they have never ever been a problem. If you have seen the enjoyment a grey gets out of flying you would never ever even think of clipping their wings.

Yes Kea sticks her long lizzard like tonugue out the side of her mouth and she usually licks my boyfriends face. I tell him it's obscene and tell her to put her lizzard tongue away. They are never scared when we come home no matter what we have on. I can be dressed up in winter clothes hat, scarf, coat and Rangi let's out a scream flies down the hallway and lands on me....then he realises that this picture is not right and what is that on your head and around your neck.<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/10/08 16:01

Rangi also does it to me and I have always thought he is just preening me, because he does it mainly at night so I always wash my hands as I know he will try and do it. I have never thought it was sexual because he has Kea for the sexual stuff and I was just part of the flock that he preens sometimes. Sexualy maturity is about 4-6 years, some can be younger at 3 years, but of course they all show bonding signs when they are younger as we all know from the dropped wings to the regurgitation.

Yeah that looks sore. Kea did the same a couple of months ago and we put flour on it until we found the quick stop in the house. We just made her stay in the cage for a day so as not to aggrevate the foot and to rest it. We also just kept an eye on it for infection.

I went to one called Pet Smart when I visited San Fran. Got this great thing called the bird kabob which our 2 loved and tore apart. Also got them some foraging toys there as well and intelligent toys.