kins2321@yahoo.com Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Guys... noone is wrong, to clip, noone is wrong, not to clip! Everyone needs to stop...make their own personal decisions. BOTH choices are GOOD ones! To care for a grey, it is important to follow your own choices for your bird . Shanlung... I have followed some of your suggestions, some things I chose on my own. I know you stand by your convictions, but sometimes your passion, can irritate some owners! ( sorry!) Carlsjr, has every right to follow their beliefs. YOU... have every right to follow your belief! Your belief is respected... but if someone has a different belief... except it, and respect it as well. What doesn't work, is getting a site divided.... choosing sides. The bird site is meant to assist each other. Lets get back to that! Nancy and Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanlung Posted December 14, 2011 Author Share Posted December 14, 2011 Guys... noone is wrong, to clip, noone is wrong, not to clip! Everyone needs to stop...make their own personal decisions. BOTH choices are GOOD ones! To care for a grey, it is important to follow your own choices for your bird . Shanlung... I have followed some of your suggestions, some things I chose on my own. I know you stand by your convictions, but sometimes your passion, can irritate some owners! ( sorry!) Carlsjr, has every right to follow their beliefs. YOU... have every right to follow your belief! Your belief is respected... but if someone has a different belief... except it, and respect it as well. What doesn't work, is getting a site divided.... choosing sides. The bird site is meant to assist each other. Lets get back to that! Nancy and Sophie Good for you and your bird. I am actually very neutral on clipping. Drawing the line only where the idea that clipping of wings meant the bird will never be able to fly away. As in the first letter here, that was how Riamfada came into my care. I have another reason to be very neutral on clipping. I might be in extreme circumstances where I might have no choice but to take away that ability to fly readily from a bird. It is very unlikely I will ever get a normal healthy grey again. If ever another grey enter my life, it probably be a rescued given to my care with no other hope left to that birdie. Should a grey be given to my care and is blind, I might have to clip the wings to take away flight. That would be after a long period in safe surroundings to see if flight can be allowed to him/her. If I feel it will not be safe for that grey to be fully flighted, then sadly, I will clip. I also bear in mind that blind people do walk, do run and even ride on bicycles. And I do know of many blind birds allowed full feathers and flying. But not all will be the same. So that scissors will remain very far away, but still there should I need them. I have read of a grey, under a truly world famed grey behavior lady whom I have loads of respect, but sadly that grey was psychotic and flew into rage on no provocations and doing flying lunges on everyone except her. Should such a case confront me, and after trying my best and assessing no other way to go, I will clip. With that in the back of my mind, I cannot but remain very neutral in this issue. Other than to stress clipping will not mean your birdie cannot fly away. And without knowledge of flight and with clipped wings, the chances of getting that birdie back alive, is very very slim. I have many friends, very good friends with clipped birdies. They gave a very good life to their birdies. They have kids and kid friends running in and out of the house all the time. Having fully flighted birdies have requirements which must be met. Circumstances were not right for them to live with a fully flighted bird. Perhaps that might change in the future and perhaps they might change their mind later. I do not look down on them, and neither do I look up at them. That we do things differently meant nothing to me other than we do things differently. Seeing the costs of suicide bombers of one kind and the other to press folks that they must do things their way, we all should agree that we can do things differently and still remain friends and appreciate the differentness in all of us. The world will be a boring place if the only flower is the rose. And I am happy you are different from me. I do not think I can stand another exactly like me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kins2321@yahoo.com Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Shanlung.... of coarse... getting a new grey in your life, out of forever homes, doesn't mean you will never have a healthy grey in your life. You can make them healthy again! Greys ARE set in their ways, but with an " optimistic" attitude...they CAN be rehomed. You have AMAZING birds! People on this site truly respect you, including me. We all need to respect each others beliefs, including cultural diversity. Lets start there! Nancy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tias Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 WOW! what an interesting thread to read....Very insightful, unfortunately I was not given the choice whether to have my Tia clipped or not, when she was rehomed to me, I went to get her and the woman had already done it, so I wait patiently hoping she will again become flighted....Thank You all for your views and opinions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanlung Posted December 14, 2011 Author Share Posted December 14, 2011 Shanlung.... of coarse... getting a new grey in your life, out of forever homes, doesn't mean you will never have a healthy grey in your life. You can make them healthy again! Greys ARE set in their ways, but with an " optimistic" attitude...they CAN be rehomed. You have AMAZING birds! People on this site truly respect you, including me. We all need to respect each others beliefs, including cultural diversity. Lets start there! Nancy Dont you think I have enough of greys after Tinkerbell and Riamfada? and you have read I did not even want Riamfada in the first place, hoping that lady will keep Riam in which case I would have given her all the help she needed. But it was fated Riam was given into my care, and I could not walk away. The only hookbill that I will take will be one that truly needed me and I cannot walk away from. That will exclude any normal birdie that others can and will take care of. That being said, Riam did suddenly pop into my life, so my predictions of future is not very good. I also have to say birds in my house will not be in a forever home. I am fated like the Flying Dutchman to roam about and not have a home port. I can only promise that during their times with me, my beasties and birdies will not lack for anything to live a fulfilling life when with me. And they will have the best of next homes. What is a forever home in these very troubled times we all are in? Jobs all that secured? and value of money remain that same? Health never failing? Heck! Our precious planet will not even remain the same as we have seen from the fiasco starting at Kyoto and continuing on to Durban. See my latest write up if you have not done that. Shanlung foraging for birdies // Jackie and clicker training // climate change http://shanlung.livejournal.com/134514.html Or on second thoughts, just enjoy the first two parts and not see the last part. Better to keep on the blinkers and rose tinted glasses to better live and enjoy life and smelling roses as if tomorrow will always be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsjr Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 umm wow guess i hit a nerve uh? this is how you deal with people who disagree with you? so i get the ignore list. gotcha, i understand now why you were kicked out of other parrot boards. you are intolerant of ANYBODY who dares challenge you. i have no idea what you are talking about with 3,000 years ago in china and a straw dog and the taos bible. honestly i really dont care either. humm you "to see a westerner craft that on me is laughable" that one sentence speaks volumes about your character and views. i would love to see you write to explain yourself. because if im not mistaken you just insulted me for being from the west... are we not as evolved as you or something? are you calling me stupid? wait yea you did call me stupid and pathetic. see bolded. well yea your writings are LONGGGGGGGG and since english is your second language its pretty darn difficult to read PLUS you have stuff scattered all over the place. Rest of you who enjoyed what I wrote and especially Mistyparrot who defended me, Thank you. Much of the attack on me was based on psuedo science.Making me to be something I never claimed as that I wrote scientifically and to be demonished as anecdoctal, and by implications everything he chose to say is scientifcally based. What he liked became facts, what he did not like, a ton of manure of his chosing will be dumped on top. And using of straw dogs. By claiming for me what I never claimed for myself, thereby setting up a straw dog, then go to beat and tear that straw dog he created to pieces, to prove he was so much more superior. Chinese knew of straw dogs 3 thousand years ago and that was written into the Taoist bible Tao Te Ching over 3 thousand years back. To see a westerner crafting that on me to use on me is laughable, and pathetic. As if I do not know of that kind of cheapest of cheap arguments. If he want to clip, just go and clip. No need for any kind of scientific rigmarole and clownish contortionistic exhibition of his own stupidity and his own confessing what I wrote was too long and too difficult to be understood. But with him safely in my ignore list, I never ever see whatever he will write. Back to what I rather want to talk about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvparrots Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 I am officially closing this thread. This forum is for sharing information and knowledge about our greys/parrots. That is not happening here. So take a breath and cool off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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