Newbie in wheelchair needs advice

[Inky]

Hi, I am NEW but could really do with some ADVICE and HELP.

 

I live in London, England in a house together with my Husband, friend and housekeeper. I can walk a little on crutches but mostly I am in a wheelchair. Both myself and my husband work from home but we also go into the office a few days a week. Our housekeeper is around mostly - unless she is out shopping for food etc.

 

I have been reading extensively about African Grey's since I would like to buy a baby that has been weened but I have a few questions:

 

1. How many hours a day (on average) would I need to devote to talking and playing?

2. Will the parrot be happy with the radio or tv on for company during the days no one is around?

3. Can you buy baby parrots that have been toilet trained?

4. Does it matter that I am not very mobile, would it still be possible to let the bird fly?

5. How often should you (on average) take the bird out of it's cage?

6. Will the bird be able to bond with all members of household - even if we add a baby?

7. Can we give the AG to a friend when we go on holiday?

 

I know that each bird is different but I'm just trying to ensure that buying a Grey is a sensible thing for me to do since I don't want to be cruel and get one if it's not going to be good for the parrot. I thought that all parrots belonged out of a cage but the forum has convinced me that AG's can be happy in captivity.

 

Look forward to receiving your responses.

 

Thanks again in advance.

 

Inky

Edited March 23, 2011 by Inky

[Dave007]

Hi, I am NEW but could really do with some ADVICE and HELP.

1. How many hours a day (on average) would I need to devote to talking and playing?

2. Will the parrot be happy with the radio or tv on for company during the days no one is around?

3. Can you buy baby parrots that have been toilet trained?

4. Does it matter that I am not very mobile, would it still be possible to let the bird fly?

5. How often should you (on average) take the bird out of it's cage?

6. Will the bird be able to bond with all members of household - even if we add a baby?

7. Can we give the AG to a friend when we go on holiday?

 

I know that each bird is different but I'm just trying to ensure that buying a Grey is a sensible thing for me to do since I don't want to be cruel and get one if it's not going to be good for the parrot. I thought that all parrots belonged out of a cage but the forum has convinced me that AG's can be happy in captivity.

 

Look forward to receiving your responses.

 

Thanks again in advance.

 

Inky

1---greys can be ok with 2 to 3 hrs out of the cage. Of course, the more, the better but many people here go to work full time and the bird is left in a cage during the whole day.

2---Many people put the radio or Tv on when the bird is alone but if it's done as a regular routine everyday, the grey will slowly dismiss it and not pay as much attention to it but using a TV with cartoons is a good idea.

3---No, baby parrots can only be potty trained in the home as the bird gets older and it does take quite a bit of work to do that especially if the owner is a novice at owning a grey. Even potty trained birds will defecate in other places. You would need good mobility to catch the bird doing that and putting him in an area where you want him to go. In your situation, letting the bird go in the cage is the best thing. Easy to clean up that way.

4---That's a hard question to answer for a few reasons. Many people think it's a bit cruel to clip a bird's wings because they were meant to fly. Other people clip wings but I have to tell you that a proper wing clip won't prevent the bird from flying. A wing clipping won't allow a bird to fly vertically, only horozontly AND the wing clipping needs to be properly done to lessen injuries. If a clipped bird escapes, it can fly straight ahead, not upward and that alone can cause the bird injuries.

5---As often as you can. As time goes on, a grey becomes very sedate and likes to perch alot--even on people ( you/hubby). It's not a constant flyer as when it was when young. That happens aroung 4 to 5 yrs old. Constant verbal contact is necessary as well as physical contact.

6---That can happen when all the people living there get involved with the bird and all the duties involved which includes cleaning, feeding, treat giving, handling. The bird may take to one person a little more than the other person but in general, if socialization begins at an early age, the chances of success are better.

7---Yes you can but but because the bird is an individual, it may not like that. Having someone come toi the houseto feed and water is always a better idea.

 

As far as likes and dislikes, greys aren't very fond of childrren who are scooting around them. Greys can become nervous.

If you have other animals roaming the house, you need to watch out for problems

 

 

Hope this helps a bit.

 

PS-------There are other handicapped people on this board who have greys and have had success but it's important to keep in contact with experienced grey owners like who's on this bioard to help you deal with unknown situations and believe me, there's gonna be situations.

Edited March 23, 2011 by Dave007

[Inky]

Dave, thank you so much for such a comprehensive response. You have helped considerably and I shall share this response with husbands and friends. If you have time, just a couple of supp. questions:

 

1---greys can be ok with 2 to 3 hrs out of the cage. Of course, the more, the better but many people here go to work full time and the bird is left in a cage during the whole day.

 

SO PEOPLE GO TO WORK ALL DAY AND LEAVE AG ON THEIR OWN WITH NO PROBLEMS?

 

2---Many people put the radio or Tv on when the bird is alone but if it's done as a regular routine everyday, the grey will slowly dismiss it and not pay as much attention to it but using a TV with cartoons is a good idea.

 

CARTOONS ARE A GREAT IDEA - THANKS!

 

3---No, baby parrots can only be potty trained in the home as the bird gets older and it does take quite a bit of work to do that especially if the owner is a novice at owning a grey. Even potty trained birds will defecate in other places. You would need good mobility to catch the bird doing that and putting him in an area where you want him to go. In your situation, letting the bird go in the cage is the best thing. Easy to clean up that way.

 

THIS IS PROBABLY MY HESITATION POINT: IF I LET THE BIRD DEFECATE IN ITS CAGE WON'T I STILL NEED TO POTTY TRAIN IT TO GO IN A SPECIFIC PART OF THE CAGE? DO YOU THINK THAT IT WOULD BE EASIER FOR ME TO GO FOR AN OLDER BIRD THAT HAS BEEN POTTY TRAINED (PERHAPS AT MY REQUEST BY THE BREEDER (I WILL ONLY BUY FROM A CARING BREEDER)?

 

4---That's a hard question to answer for a few reasons. Many people think it's a bit cruel to clip a bird's wings because they were meant to fly. Other people clip wings but I have to tell you that a proper wing clip won't prevent the bird from flying. A wing clipping won't allow a bird to fly vertically, only horozontly AND the wing clipping needs to be properly done to lessen injuries. If a clipped bird escapes, it can fly straight ahead, not upward and that alone can cause the bird injuries.

 

SEEMS TO ME THAT IT'S CRUEL TO CLIP THEN - WHAT DO YOU THINK?

 

5---As often as you can. As time goes on, a grey becomes very sedate and likes to perch alot--even on people ( you/hubby). It's not a constant flyer as when it was when young. That happens aroung 4 to 5 yrs old. Constant verbal contact is necessary as well as physical contact.

 

WOULD IT BE ENOUGH TO GIVE SUCH CONTACT SAY EVERY EVENING AFTER WORK?

 

THANKS!

 

 

PS-------There are other handicapped people on this board who have greys and have had success but it's important to keep in contact with experienced grey owners like who's on this bioard to help you deal with unknown situations and believe me, there's gonna be situations.

 

THANK YOU - WILL DO. LOVING THIS FORUM!

[Dave007]

Dave, thank you so much for such a comprehensive response. You have helped considerably and I shall share this response with husbands and friends. If you have time, just a couple of supp. questions:

 

1---greys can be ok with 2 to 3 hrs out of the cage. Of course, the more, the better but many people here go to work full time and the bird is left in a cage during the whole day.

 

SO PEOPLE GO TO WORK ALL DAY AND LEAVE AG ON THEIR OWN WITH NO PROBLEMS?

 

2---Many people put the radio or Tv on when the bird is alone but if it's done as a regular routine everyday, the grey will slowly dismiss it and not pay as much attention to it but using a TV with cartoons is a good idea.

 

CARTOONS ARE A GREAT IDEA - THANKS!

 

3---No, baby parrots can only be potty trained in the home as the bird gets older and it does take quite a bit of work to do that especially if the owner is a novice at owning a grey. Even potty trained birds will defecate in other places. You would need good mobility to catch the bird doing that and putting him in an area where you want him to go. In your situation, letting the bird go in the cage is the best thing. Easy to clean up that way.

 

THIS IS PROBABLY MY HESITATION POINT: IF I LET THE BIRD DEFECATE IN ITS CAGE WON'T I STILL NEED TO POTTY TRAIN IT TO GO IN A SPECIFIC PART OF THE CAGE? DO YOU THINK THAT IT WOULD BE EASIER FOR ME TO GO FOR AN OLDER BIRD THAT HAS BEEN POTTY TRAINED (PERHAPS AT MY REQUEST BY THE BREEDER (I WILL ONLY BUY FROM A CARING BREEDER)?

 

4---That's a hard question to answer for a few reasons. Many people think it's a bit cruel to clip a bird's wings because they were meant to fly. Other people clip wings but I have to tell you that a proper wing clip won't prevent the bird from flying. A wing clipping won't allow a bird to fly vertically, only horozontly AND the wing clipping needs to be properly done to lessen injuries. If a clipped bird escapes, it can fly straight ahead, not upward and that alone can cause the bird injuries.

 

SEEMS TO ME THAT IT'S CRUEL TO CLIP THEN - WHAT DO YOU THINK?

 

5---As often as you can. As time goes on, a grey becomes very sedate and likes to perch alot--even on people ( you/hubby). It's not a constant flyer as when it was when young. That happens aroung 4 to 5 yrs old. Constant verbal contact is necessary as well as physical contact.

 

WOULD IT BE ENOUGH TO GIVE SUCH CONTACT SAY EVERY EVENING AFTER WORK?

 

THANKS!

 

 

PS-------There are other handicapped people on this board who have greys and have had success but it's important to keep in contact with experienced grey owners like who's on this bioard to help you deal with unknown situations and believe me, there's gonna be situations.

 

THANK YOU - WILL DO. LOVING THIS FORUM!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

 

1------Yes people do work all day and try to spend lots of time with the bird when they get home. Greys need attention. A baby bird can get used to the amount of attention given--an adult grey who's been pre owned and has habits that have been devoloped can't change their habits, likes, dislikes etc.

 

 

*****THIS IS PROBABLY MY HESITATION POINT: IF I LET THE BIRD DEFECATE IN ITS CAGE WON'T I STILL NEED TO POTTY TRAIN IT TO GO IN A SPECIFIC PART OF THE CAGE? DO YOU THINK THAT IT WOULD BE EASIER FOR ME TO GO FOR AN OLDER BIRD THAT HAS BEEN POTTY TRAINED (PERHAPS AT MY REQUEST BY THE BREEDER (I WILL ONLY BUY FROM A CARING BREEDER)?****

 

I'm gonna be blunt here--no insult meant but in your situation getting a pre owned bird is a bad idea because you have no idea what you're bringing home. A pre owned bird comes with baggage that can't be gotten rid of. That baggage is simply passed on to you. It can't be changed. Greys as well as all other parrots are wild animals and will remain so until the day they die be they pets or live in the wild. The person may be a caring breeder but that breeder doesn't sell customized birds. AND breeders usually don't sell adult birds.

The potty training in a cage---a bird defecates when it wants to, where it wants to. Potty training only has to do with the bird who's outside of the cage all the time and has been trained to come back to a certain area to defecate. Unlike a dog, the bird won't hold it if he can't get back. A certain area of a cage can't be singled out because the whole cage belongs to the bird and when in the cage as well as out of the cage, nature is at work. Domestic animals can be trained to go out.As a matter of fact, domestic animals actually find it hard to defecate/urinate in a house after being totally house broken.

 

****SEEMS TO ME THAT IT'S CRUEL TO CLIP THEN - WHAT DO YOU THINK?*****

 

Cruel?? Well, it could affect a bird mentally. It could interfere with confidence in him/herself. It may create an introverted bird but on the other hand maybe not.

You should also understand that one of the cruelest things a person can do is get the bird clipped before coordination, muscle and wing strength is developed. That usually takes up to 7 or 8 mts of the bird's begginning life. Many people here bought birds that were already clipped when they're just being sold and the birds have big problems. I can't tell you how many people here are seriously pissed off that their bird was clipped. Most of these people are just waiting for the feathers to grow in but they do remain angry. It was just unforseen ignorance about clipping that existed at the time of sale.

 

*****WOULD IT BE ENOUGH TO GIVE SUCH CONTACT SAY EVERY EVENING AFTER WORK?****

 

I answered that in the begiining of this reply.

 

 

*****Both myself and my husband work from home but we also go into the office a few days a week. Our housekeeper is around mostly - unless she is out shopping for food etc**.

 

That's very much in your favor since you say it's only for a few days a week. Your housekeeper being around is also very much in your favor.

Edited March 23, 2011 by Dave007

[Inky]

Thank you, dave, this is really appreciated. Now trying to find a breeder near me.

 

Inky

[judygram]

Welcome Inky and Dave has given you some excellent advice and so glad you want to bring a grey into your life, you will find you will wonder how you lived without one.

I work full time myself and have 3 birds who share the same room in separate cages, they are company for each other while I am gone and I leave the radio on for background noise, they are allowed out as soon as I come home and are out until they go to bed.

My grey is bonded to me but tolerates my hubby, most will usually chose a favorite person but if well socialized will get along with everyone in the family so be sure to start that early on.

Please keep us informed of your progression with finding a grey.

[Eshana]

I have a disease called Myasthenia Gravis. While I am not wheelchair-bound, there are days where I am bed-bound. This might sound crazy but it seems that whenever I get a pet, they are understanding of what is going on with me, and don't try too much to makeme be extremely active. I wonder if the same will happen when I get a Grey.

 

For example, Shelby, my cockatiel, will be really hyper when I'm up and active. Even if I'm typing at the computer he'll take my keys and fly away and play games with me. There will be other times, however, where I am typing at the computer and he can tell I'm having a bad day physically (I know it sounds crazy...) he'll just sit on my shoulder or knee and let me pet him.

[Inky]

Eshana,

 

Thanks for your email. I've heard that pets can become quite in tune with their owner's needs and health and I'm glad this works for you. Does your cockatiel talk?

 

Natasha

[Inky]

Hi Judigram,

 

Thanks for your welcome. I've been told that I should only get 1 bird rather than a pair because there is no guarantee that they will get along. Did you get all your birds at the same time?

 

I'm struggling to find hand-reared grey's in London but shall keep searching. I now can't wait to get my bird because I'm now convinced that it will improve my mood since I'm still getting used to being disabled.

[Eshana]

Eshana,

 

Thanks for your email. I've heard that pets can become quite in tune with their owner's needs and health and I'm glad this works for you. Does your cockatiel talk?

 

Natasha

 

Shelby is turning 5 months on the 1st, so he's still young, but right now he can whistle a few tunes, wolf whistle, and he says 'Pretty Bird' in a gravely voice. Oh, and he heard Charlie Sheen laugh on TV one day and liked it so much he repeats it whenever he can. Other than that one exception, he usually only copies what females say to him in a high pitched voice.

[judygram]

You should only get one bird at a time, that way you can allow it enough time to settle into his/her new home and get used to everyone, it is important to make that pet feel at home and learn their likes and dislikes and be very comfortable with that new bird before you get another one. No I got all 3 of mine at different times, I started with the sun conure who only whetted my appetite for more then I got my grey, I had not planned on another bird but a cockatiel landed in my backyard last summer and she stayed since I couldn't find her owner. I would love to have more but I don't want to spread myself too thin so 3 is my limit.

Greys can be very empathetic and I have no doubt that Eshana's Shelby knows when she doesn't feel very well, we have had many members comment on their grey's tuning into their emotions, it can be very touching to hear the stories of those.

[thenabrd]

inky, welcome! you have found a wonderful place with tons and tons of information and advice! i have fibromyalgia, so i have good days and bad days. we have a dog named hermes, a peach front conure named athena and our newest addition is our cag, kalliope. she's been with us about 6 weeks now and she's a rehomed bird. we were lucky, her previous owner was a good person and loved her birds very much, so kallie at this point seems to have little to no "baggage".

 

we both work full time. so our "zoo" is at home without us during the day. we leave the tv on, using various channels and sometimes even the radio in the kitchen. if for some reason we'd lose electricity during the day, the tv wouldn't come back on, but the radio will. our "zoo" hangs out in our living room, so they have each other for company.

 

as far as my health, athena and hermes seem to know when i'm in more pain than usual. kallie is too new yet, but she'll learn i'm sure. they tend to be quieter, more gentle, and more content to just "hang out" instead of doing their usual activities. i'd be lost without them, especially when i'm not able to work for whatever reason. we had no pets at the time i was diagnosed, and i felt so alone during the day. getting hermes at that point was a blessing even though he was a puppy and needed training. but it was the training and attention he needed that got me to "remove" myself from what i was going through and to start "living" again.

[Butttaxi]

It is pretty cool how our pets are in tuned with our health. I threw out my back in February and had been stuck in bed for almost 2 weeks. On day 2 of the pain I was stuck on the floor for almost 6 hours trying to get up to the bathroom and poor Rorschach sat in his cage and watched. He didn't say a word the entire time you could tell he was concerned. While I was in bed the bf would bring him in the room to visit so we could have a snuggle.

 

I get the feeling you are very concerned with poop around your house, if you decide to get any bird that will be let out of his/her cage it is something you will need learn to live with. They poop about once every 20 minutes and like Dave said they will go when they gotta. They are also VERY messy, you will expect food or toys tossed and thrown all over the place. Your clothing may be chewed apart be sure to put on old clothing if you plan on having them rest on you, don't wear anything nice especially if it has anything they can pick off like rinstones lol OH and be prepared to never enjoy your meal by yourself, you will have the cutest feathered head in your food tossing what they don't like and munching on what they do. If you can live with this mess and to never have anything nice again lol you will be a very VERY happy person! These little fids are like toddlers and are just as bratty, manipulative, destructive and messy and we love them all the same. You should expect this with your new fid and also be prepared to fall completely head over heels because they have a way of getting to you like no other.

[Inky]

Thanks, on this basis I shall stick with the African Grey. Do you manage to take your bird outside?

[Butttaxi]

You can take them outside but please avoid what had happened to us... We were told Rorschach wouldn't be able to fly up and the previous owner always had him outside without being in a carrier or on a harness so we didn't think anything of it. One day David had him outside talking to his dad and when he was coming in Davids dad started the truck and Rorschach got startled and flew away. After hours of searching and luckily someone had found him (eventually admitting he had him) and gave him back. We were very lucky but we will never be taking him outside without a harness or in a carrier once the weather warms up. So research harness' and carriers or outdoor aviaries and keep them safe.

[thenabrd]

inky, absolutely! now remember we've only had kallie for about a month and a half and here in ohio it's too cold to take the birds outside. however our conure, athena is an old pro. we have a back porch that has windows on the "front" side and screens on the sides. we have a perch set up so she can run back and forth across the windows and see and talk to the birdies.

 

when we want to take her completely outside as we're working in the garden and such, we use her smaller travel cage. we have hawks that patrol our neighborhood, so unless athena is on the porch, she's in her "mobile home". she loves it and has a blast trying to get the birdies to talk to her (but no one talks athena except athena, lol) we have a couple of small toys in the cage as well as small food and water containers. kallie will also start going outside this year. she has her own "mobile home" similarly equipped. we'll go at kallie's pace, since this will be something totally new for her. on a side note, athena also enjoys riding in the car in her this small cage, that is until we get to the vets, lol!

[Inky]

Don't worry, one bird is all I can manage at this stage. I have found a breeder and he seems to really care about the birds (which for me is a good indicator) and offers free after care advice when needed. He also brings the birds up with his family so they are used to young children and having different people around. He has one bird left at 15 weeks old. However, he does not have his bird's sexed - do you think this is a problem? I was told that males are more likely to bond with girls (does that include gay men as well)?

 

Having read all the info, I'm more convinced than ever that an African Grey would make a great addition to the household so I'm now trying to ensure that I buy everything that the parrot needs (there should be some sort of parrot starter kit!).

 

Inky

[Inky]

Will do thanks for the tip. Have you ever tried to use a flight lead (so bird can fly around on the lead but return to you as you pull the lead in)?

[judygram]

I was told that males are more likely to bond with girls (does that include gay men as well)?

That is just a myth and there are plenty of members here who will refute that including me for I have a female who is bonded to me, I wouldn't worry about it and if you want that one the breeder has left then go for it.

As far as a parrot starter kit, why don't you browse around the nursery room for some threads that may contain all those things you will need but some are obvious, cage, food, toys and such.

[Inky]

thenabrd, I'm glad to hear that the birds can be happy to ride in the car. That would make our lives easier since we could take with us when we go out for the day. I live in London so I was thinking that I could sit my African Grey at the front of the house over looking the road. That way he can watch people going by and the traffic etc whilst we are away. The back of the house overlooks the garden but it is South Facing and right in the sun, which I understand is not very good for the birds.

[Inky]

Thanks. I will indeed spend the £1000 (is this the same cost in the USA) and reserve mine today. I agree with the obvious it's more the less obvious - you know something really useful that I might have forgotten. Thanks I will browse around the nursery just in case there are any useful tips.

 

I'm very excited - the breeder has warned us though that if he doesn't think the bird will be happy (he will visit our home) or doesn't take to us he will refuse to sell. I like him already - how caring!

[Inky]

Butttaxi, I'm absolutely going to avoid what happened to you if I can. The breeder said that his birds are really tame so they will go off with anybody so chances are that I would not get the bird back living in London.

[thenabrd]

our birds have their cages in our living room. we live across the street from a school, so they get to watch the people and traffic during the day and really enjoy it. the roof of our front porch provides them protection from the sun, as that is a south facing window as well. i don't think the south facing garden window you describe wouldn't be too bad, unless it got really hot there. it's still an area where you might put a play stand so the bird can still enjoy watching the goings on in the garden during the afternoon or morning, before the midday sun blazes through.

[Eshana]

Thanks. I will indeed spend the £1000 (is this the same cost in the USA) and reserve mine today. I agree with the obvious it's more the less obvious - you know something really useful that I might have forgotten. Thanks I will browse around the nursery just in case there are any useful tips.

 

I'm very excited - the breeder has warned us though that if he doesn't think the bird will be happy (he will visit our home) or doesn't take to us he will refuse to sell. I like him already - how caring!

 

Most prices I've seen here in the USA (granted I live in a city, so prices in the city and surrounding areas tend to be higher than rural areas) are around 1200-1400 dollars.

 

As for the house visit, I've heard of dog breeders doing this, and sometimes dog rescues, but never a bird breeder. Does he want to see the cage specifically?

[Inky]

Most prices I've seen here in the USA (granted I live in a city, so prices in the city and surrounding areas tend to be higher than rural areas) are around 1200-1400 dollars.

 

As for the house visit, I've heard of dog breeders doing this, and sometimes dog rescues, but never a bird breeder. Does he want to see the cage specifically?

 

No I'm actually going to buy the cage off him as well. It's more that he's happy with us and where we live and that the bird takes to us. He says that all his birds are so tame they should take to you straight away but if not then he will spend the day with us to see what the problem is and whether we can sort it out - he just seems to care a lot about the birds which is wonderful. So price is almost the same in the USA (given the exchange rates).