Who "loves" their grey?

[SchroedersJen]

Forgive me if this is an offensive question, but as Schroeder is nearly 2 1/2, I'd like to start my research on grey lovin before it is an issue, espescially since there doesnt seem to be much information online. I expect Dave will come to the rescue here.

 

Sexually mature greys: what do you guys do when your grey is in the mood?.....I know that people tend to redirect their fids attention to another activity, but why? Is it because we are conservative and sex is bad? Is there anything wrong with letting your bird finish with your hand/foot/toy? Would our birds be happier and healthier if we helped them out so to speak? What do you guys do for your fids to help them get their rocks off? I can't inagine never getting any release is good for them. Any thoughts?<br><br>Post edited by: SchroedersJen, at: 2009/09/21 05:07

[jessdecutie18]

That gave me a laugh

But hey, it's a good question!

[SchroedersJen]

Yeah, Schroeder has been a bit droopy winged this week.....It won't be long before he wants to know about the birds and the bees and where eggs come from...

[ranaz]

Nice question

Kookie does the mating dance sometimes, droops his wings and pants or breathes in a funny way, some times he does this when he is near a mirror. It lasts fr a few minutes and he goes back to normal.

what do u guys do when your greys do this, and what is the best thing to do, ignore it or try to divert their attention to something else?

{Nature-00020095}{Nature-00020095}

[she]

I dont allow Charlie to get amarous with me,I handle him in ways that are not stimulating to him,ie, I dont pet him under the wings,on the back,or rub his beak.If I notice any advances from him in this direction he is returned to a perch or cage to calm down.In my eyes a bird is a bird is a bird.

[Char]

Oh Jen you are toooo much. Thanks for the chuckle today.

 

I divert Whisper when she starts acting too lovey dovey. I also don't do anything to encourage it. It is very, very confusing for a bird to think of you in terms of their "play toy" and to encourage will only lead to frustration and behaviour problems.

 

On the other hand I know someone who has an Amazon 13 yrs old. He says that when she gets too worked up that his avian vet masterbates her and it calms her down. I have the same vet but he has not offered this service to young Whisper yet.:laugh:<br><br>Post edited by: Char, at: 2009/09/21 14:59

[Jane08]

Oh god Char that is so funny, imagine taking your bird to the vet for masterbation, lol.

 

I was always told that you should not encourage it as you would be giving them foreplay so to speak and then no folllow through and that they become sexually frustrated by this.

 

I guess I won't have this problem as we have a male and a female, although I have already had a talk with her about babies and that if she has one she won't be keeping it, hehe.

[judygram]

Exactly Jane, not one of us would like to engage in foreplay just to be denied what our body wants in return, imagine how we would feel to get worked up and then nothing, I would not want my parrot to get so frustrated because of it so I try to direct attention elsewhere. Of course Josey has not really been showing any signs of sexual excitement yet but my sun conure has and I ignore it and interest her in something else.

 

Thanks Jen for bringing this subject up, one that is on our minds a lot:whistle: :blush: :dry: :huh: :laugh:

[Luvparrots]

I am going through this with my Ekkie right now and believe me I have no intention of "encouraging" him. The first time he dropped his head onto my arm and ran his tongue over my arm and firmly locked his 2" beak onto my arm he truly scared me. I don't believe encouraging him will help. I am not a female Ekkie and any interacting with me will only frustrate him more.

[SchroedersJen]

I dnt encourage Schroeder, but I think, if I let him, he would finish up on my foot or one of his toys (his pinata toy is really sexy). Im not too keen on having bird spunk on my toes, but i am more concerned about his overall well being. I get that many of us distract them, but why? If they can finish on their own accord, is it more harmful to stop them mid you-know-what or let them finish? I don't make sweet birdy love to Schroeder, but if its in his best interest that my foot give in to the mojo, I can look the other way.

 

And thanks for the responses. Im glad to see that this thread didnt turn into a frat party, I was kinda apprehensive about bringing it up.

[Luvparrots]

Jen have you read the book "The Parrot Who Owns Me" written by Joanna Burger. It is a story of the relationship between a well-known ornithologist and her parrot Tiko. You would probably enjoy it and it might answer some of your questions as Tiko "courted" her during mating season.

[cf737]

Okay here's a question, what exactly are the symptoms of such sexual behaviour?

[Janfromboone]

Tobie kind of pants, drops his wings and moves them away from his body and rocks his head like he is going to upchuck, but hasn't. I guess this is what we are talking about. I usually just walk away from him when he does this because I don't want to encourage it, but frankly jen has a point. I had cockateils once and the females would masterbate on a perticular branch in the cage - and seem to satisfy themselves. The male I had always had the female (who sometimes preferred the branch).

[SamsDad]

Jen GREAT question! Good for you for having the nerve to post it.

 

The Amazon "Frankey" I had years ago would just pump his neck, pin his eyes, make this low gurrrr noise and cough up a nice gooey mess for me when he was in "heat." I'd just say "Thanks Frankey what a nice gift" and I'd set him down on his cage. When he wanted "more" he'd "Hump" one of his toys making some pretty disgusting noises. I was worried what the neighbors were thinking! I'd pretty much Give Frankey some more space, handling him a little less and I was careful not to do anything to get him worked up. He handled it pretty well.

 

Nelson my late Timneh never got worked up like Frankey did. He'd just try to feeding me by barfing up dinner to me.

 

Sam is still too young but I'll be curious how he's going to be. He's REALLY like to be tickled and its a part of our evening playtime when we are watching TV together. Since he loves to be tickled under his wings down his back and on his chest I'll have to - and do - keep an eye out for his coming-of-age-cause-the-hormones-rage time.

 

Back to the wing droop/dance/grunting/sneezing. This is how Nelson begged for something he really wanted. Sometimes it was just to be picked up, other times it was for a peanut or other treat. I called it his baby bird routine. It never seemd to be related to his desire to mate. He pretty much just became "barfy" during mating times.

[SchroedersJen]

luvparrots wrote:

Jen have you read the book "The Parrot Who Owns Me" written by Joanna Burger. It is a story of the relationship between a well-known ornithologist and her parrot Tiko. You would probably enjoy it and it might answer some of your questions as Tiko "courted" her during mating season.

 

Thanks for the suggestion, I have ordered it and will let you know what I think when it arrives

[Dave007]

""Sexually mature greys: what do you guys do when your grey is in the mood?....."""

 

I immediately stop whatever I might be doing to cause it such as petting sensitive areas. I don't change that petting to another non sexual part of the body. I just don't pet. Any touch to anywhere else after a bird has been stimulated will cause the bird to start all over again.

Allow all of the rubbing a few times and that bird will expect it everytime he's being held and it's simply cruel to the bird and potentially dangerous to the person doing it. The more the rubbing by the person continues, the more agile and bendable the bird becomes. It's able to wrap itself around your hand or arm and sink his claws in deeply to hold on. Eventually, the person finds what the bird is doing is becoming annoying because your hand or arm is becoming immobile. So you decide *well, enough is enough, let me remove my hand* and all of a sudden the bird inflicts a serious bite because he/she is in seventh heaven and doesn't want it to stop. Think that's fair to do to a bird? Why doesn't the male or female bite each other when they mate? Cause they intend and wanna go all the way.

 

""""Is it because we are conservative and sex is bad?"""

 

It is bad if a person and a bird are involved and I guarantee you that that ain't conservative.

[Janfromboone]

Dave, I know I'm dense sometimes and have to have it spelled out. Exactly what kind of behavior is sexual on the birds part? Samsdad sais that what I described that Tobie does is simply begging, (also Tobie is only 2yrs old) so maybe I don't understand. You said they would become flexable and wrap themselves around your hand? The only thing close to that that I have seen is Tobie swinging his head around and it ends up between his legs all in a twist lying over onto my neck almost upside down. Is this sexual behaviour? I thought he was just being playful. I guess I need some graphic descriptions. Anyone got a youtube video?

[Dave007]

Maybe I'm dragging this out but I was asked another question so I'll respond.

 

A person sits down on a couch or chair, maybe watching TV. A grey ( especially one that's under 3 yrs old) is sitting on the person's knee. The bird is petted on the head and neck. The bird moves closer to the person's body ( like the arm) and the person decides to pet the bird's back. The bird likes it and slightly spreads it's wings. The person starts petting the wings and then under the wings. It looks very cute so the person starts rubbing the breast upper and lower. The vent becomes more visible so the person rubs in that general area. The bird likes it so it speads it's wings even wider including it's tail feathers. The person continues the same thing and eventually, the bird starts to flatten out it's body on the person's arm. The bird starts to wrap it's wings around that arm. The person continues the petting and then the bird starts making small huffing sounds. The bird holds on very securely. The bird starts to move it's head in different positions especially to the side and aims the face at the person. The bird starts pushing the prson's hand towards certain areas of the person's hand. The huffing continues. The feathers on the head stand up straight as well as other parts of the body. The huffing becomes slightly more rapid. The bird is now in a position where removing the bird is a little difficult because he's holding on. All of this applies to a female too. The person tires of this behavior and starts to stop all of this petting. The bird senses this and starts to bite on the hand a little harder so the person won't stop. The person continues to remove hand and the bird seriously bites. Now comes the time to either push the bird back up to the knee or put the bird back to it's cage. If the bird is left on the knee, it immediately moves closer to the person all over again. SO, the bird is put into a sexual situation and is left like that and it's very uncomfortable. Basically, the bird is hung up. Is that fair? My opinion is NO!

Ever see 2 breeder greys going through the act of copulation? It's a long drawn out love affair with total mutual desires to finish. They breed over and over until it's time for the female goes to the nest box. Even then, they continue to breed periodically. They touch each other in different places. The males nibbles on the females neck and head She puts her head up to accept the nibbling. Breeder birds are known as * sexually mature*, Birds who are much younger are known as *sexually aware* and most person who are doing this are doing it to *sexuaally aware*.

Compare it to a 9 yr old boy who finds out that his thingy can do more things than pea with it. It just doesn't know what to do with that thingy.

Toys and masturbation has been brought up. One of the most prolific birds that do this is the quaker. I've seen it many times with many quakers but I'll use my own as examples--my male loves to rub himself against the pole that holds the swing in place. The female loves to rub herselg against a certain edge of a perch. Look at them from 3 feet away and you'll see thir eyes 1/2 closed, feathers up and slight huffing.The big difference is the quakers aren't being touched and they know when to stop. There's no reason to sexually stimulate birds of ant kind because it looks cute. To them it's serious business.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/09/22 19:15

[lovethatgrey]

Thanks Dave for the graphic and explicit explanation for those of us who weren't sure. I do not ever give scratchies below the neck or chin.<br><br>Post edited by: lovethatgrey, at: 2009/09/22 19:46

[judygram]

Thanks so much Dave for that response to the questions about our birds and our stimulating them sexually.

 

Am I to assume we shouldn't be petting our greys that are over the age of 3 years anywhere but their head and neck or are you saying we should just stop immediately when they start showing signs they are getting aroused?

[Joolesgreyuk]

Jan, I think this is what Dave is saying you don't allow...

 

:blush:

[judygram]

:blush: By Jove Julie I think you found it, yep thats it.:whistle: :laugh:

[JillyBeanz]

Eeew! I'm sorry, but all this is pretty awful - it's like letting a dog hump your leg or a blanket! Harvey will have to do this in private I'm afraid!

 

Julie - I absolutely dread to think what you found when looking for an example :blush:

[Dave007]

I think that those few videos pretty much describe what birds do to each other but with the ekkie, try to imagine the bird on the person's arm getting more and more and more stimulated. Obviously,that bird is getting more and more stimulated. The slight biting is starting. In one of the other videos, there's a bird masturbating with a soft teddy bear. It has it's eye on a particular area. The teddt bear isn't encouragingit. Eventually, the bird will stop but I guarantee that if the teddy bear is allowed to stay there, the bird will start all over again. Manybe later, maybe tomorrowormaybe next week. The bird resembles a quaker but quakers are more intense and heavy duty rubbing is involved. Once they wrap their wings around something the rubbing slows down but gets intense. The male aims the tail downward and the female aims the tail upward. They go through rituals. They react to each other in strange ways. I really don't believe that humans should be involved in setting off birds into a sexual feeling. Let the birds do it. As far as what age to stop doing it, I can only say don't do it ever no matter what the age.It's not fair to the birds. Those birds were each going through part of their rituals with each other. The ekkie is going it with a person. Put your fingers near those 2 macaws while they're doing that. I'll only say this--you'll never put your fingers there again.

 

Much more desciptive video and best of all, they're greys. Notice position of wings. Notice where each bird mouthes each other. Notice that each never stops the ritual.

Let the birds get the sexual excitement going. We can't finish the act. The birds can.

 

<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/09/22 20:43

[Char]

I also limit my pets to head and chin scratches. My vet warned me when I first got Whisper that to pet a bird anywhere else is confusing to them. Birds in the wild don't pet each other all over except for a mate. A parrot has a hard enough time trying to figure out who the heck we are and where we fit in to their lives without trying to make them into a bunny,cat,dog,or any other mammal.

 

Whisper will sit on my shoulder and I will scratch her head and neck but that is it.