Pi_1

Oh, and yes, I'd be happy to post a video. She's among the smartest Greys I've ever seen. We got really lucky - I was hoping for a Grey that talked a lot and she was just perfect. She said her first word well before 6 months of age. She now has a 200+ word vocab and does......geez......lets just say a whole catalog of animal noises on command. She can do the noise and tell you what it is, hear a noise and tell you what it is, or hear the name of an animal and then do the noise. You guys would probably get a kick out of seeing her in action. She picks up a new noise in about 10-15 minutes of working with her usually - the animal associated with it usually takes a bit longer. It's funny too because we teach her the noises by doing them ourselves - so some aren't all that similar to the real animal. But we'll be watching TV and an animal will make a noise and she'll exclaim "that's a .......". And she'll be right, too, but the real noise doesn't sound all that much like ours. I don't know how she recognizes it! I watch ESPN a lot and she does the ESPN jingle too, LoL. She also knows the names of all her food items and asks for what she wants at that particular moment. She's VERY fond of peanuts and cheese right now. Before that it was Cheeze-It crackers and before that Fruit Loops and the crust from my toast, LoL. I know she's feeling better because she's back to being a little chatterbox and begging for peanuts. But anyway, yes, I'll make a little video and post it in the next few days so you can see her and how she's doing.

Our vet told us that Greys needing baths is a myth (the real avian vet). The vet said people that bathe them usually overdo it and it removes needed oils from their skin. She said that as long as she preens herself and splashes around in her water dish now and then there is no additional bathing needed (unless a situation like this happens where they get filthy). The vet told us it was just causing her undue stress to try and get her to take a bath and not to bother - that feather plucking can result. So we've never made her take baths.......she splashes in her water once in awhile but that's the extent of it. Is this incorrect? She absolutely despises anything wet and screeches/flaps/twists/turns/falls down and acts like you're punishing her if you get her wet.......

Had her out for a few hours today and she played and played - bugging me to flip her upside down, going after my water bottle and playing with it......trying to get hold of my fiance's toes, LoL. She seems so happy! Boy is she filthy though. Dusty like never before - we had to vacuum the floor and furniture AGAIN after she went back to the cage. She despises water/baths so we never make her take them, but I just wanna drag her little butt into the sink or shower, LoL! Her feet are brown/green even after washing them off with soap and water.

I just vacuumed the carpet a few times thoroughly. The cleaner was a foam style that you spray on and vacuum off, so I wanted to run a vacuum over it a few more times just to be safe. No, I didn't spray it again - normally I just use the cleaner to spot clean any stains or spills - not to clean the whole thing. It is the living room carpet and not a rug so it cannot be thrown away without major renovations, LoL. I'm sure it will be fine - she has played on the carpet many times after using the stuff. I think my fiance probably sprayed too close to the cage and too high above the carpet, causing her to inhale some of the actual cleaner. The soonest any of the vets can get her in is Wednesday - and I'm not sure I like that one from speaking with them. I'll probably have to use the current non-avian vet until I can get an appointment at one that is around 3 hours drive......they said August 17 was the soonest they could get us in. In the meantime we're keeping a close eye on her. She was so excited to be in her own cage and with us tonight. She played and played and talked her head off. Then she got really tired and went back to sleep, LoL. She's dead to the world now! Sleeping on one foot (I think her legs are tired from the ordeal) with her little head down. It's funny - she rarely tucks her beak under her wing in back like most birds do. When she was a baby - when we first brought her home from the store - the only way she would go to sleep was if I let her lay on my chest and tuck her head under my chin. She would sleep like that every night while I watched TV. When I was going to bed I'd scoop her up and carry her to the cage like a sleeping child, LoL. She would then sleep on the floor of the cage. She was too little to sleep comfortably on the perches. She didn't even have all her feathers yet. The store had quite a few babies when we picked her out - and I had first choice - so they put a magic marker stripe on her head so they would know which one I had picked. In all her baby pictures she has the magic marker on her little head - it took months to go away. It's so funny! She has the most unique voice too - she sounds like a little girl when she talks and says things with such enthusiasm. She knows over 200 words and it just cracks me up some of the things she says. All I could think when I thought she wasn't going to make it was how much I would miss her little voice. Thanks to everyone here for the support - I passed the time sitting at the vet by reading your posts. They were very nice and thoughtful and were much appreciated. It seems too good to be true....the recovery she has made. She went from lying on her side gasping for air in the oxygen tank to talking, playing, eating, and drinking in less than 12 hours and now after 24 you couldn't even tell anything was wrong at all other than her seeming happier and more enthusiastic about small things than usual and sleeping more soundly than she usually does. Normally if I turn lights on during the night (I'm always up late) she scolds me and tells me it's time for her to go night night. Tonight she slept right through the lights. Anyway, sorry for talking your ears (or eyes) off. Just excited to have her back. Thanks again all!

Here's a recent one of her playing......

Here's one from when she was little......

I'll post a picture tomorrow so you can all see our Betsy........

Hi all, First I wanted to say thank you for all the support - it was really nice to read and we appreciate it. Betsy is doing great tonight and is back in her normal cage. The vet wants her to remain on antibiotics just in case, and also gave me a type of bacteria in a syringe to give her so she doesn't have problems with her crop. She was so excited to get out of the plexi box! When I got home this afternoon I checked on her, then proceeded to clean her cage top to bottom - every bar - with warm water to make sure no residue of the cleaner was left........just in case. I then mopped the kitchen floor with water, dusted everything in the living room, vacuumed the furniture, and then did the carpet. I cleaned all the surfaces in the living room and kitchen too. The area has been airing out with all the windows and doors open since the incident. I then took a shower and went to get her and she got so excited when she saw me! She immediately started saying "Come out, come out". Thje second I opened the top of the box she was in my hands saying "I love you" and making her little "hoo" affection noise. I had planned to let her sit on my shoulder all night, but when I put her up there I looked down at my hands and they were FILTHY from her dirty feet. I took her to the sink and at least got the worst of it off, but she wasn't having too much of it. I kept her out for a few minutes and she was playing and talking like crazy. I put her back in her cage and she started asking for peanuts and cheese. I gave them to her and she ate some. She has since been sitting on her swing cleaning herself. She looks so happy. My fiance just got home and she screeched "Mama!". She is SO excited to be back in the living room and she seems to be in perfect condition - you wouldn't know she was on death's doorstep last night. Amazing really. I had just about resigned myself to losing her. All I could think was that I couldn't believe I'd never hear her little voice again...... So now I'm sitting and relaxing, typing on the couch while watching her happily clean herself after a nightmare 48 hours. Thanks again to everyone. Regarding my fiance - I don't think she'll ever make this mistake again. She was crying her eyes out all last night at the vets. I think what must have happened is that while the stuff is technically "bird safe", she sprayed it too close to the cage and too far away from the carpet, causing Betsy to actually inhale some of the cleaner - not just the fumes which have never bothered her before. Regarding the "fungal infection" - they were thinking it was internal and said they'd need a blood sample to test for it. They said it can form on their bones with no open wound and no warning. I've never heard of anything like it - sounds far fetched to me. I think it was just a bad x-ray and want to avoid moving her again unless necessary. Regarding finding a vet - I certainly plan to. Like I said, our first vet stopped treating birds (at least they notified us) so we were referred to the second vet. We had no idea they had stopped treating birds until we needed them. They never notified us - we thought Betsy was still a patient there. We'd only been in a couple of times but still......they knew we planned on using them for her care. A courtesy call would have been nice or even a letter......I'll certainly take the advice and find a vet and get familiar with them in case of emergency now. The emergency vet is just a bunch of heartless scam artists. I had to go outside at one point - it was all I could do to keep from berating them all. I wasn't happy about being kicked out of the other vet with Betsy in critical condition - but I can't complain too much since they were the only ones out of countless calls that would even take her on short notice. At least they did that......and the treatment was a lot better than at the emergency vet. I'm going to do everything I can and talk to anyone that will listen to try and get that place in some sort of trouble. It's basically extortion. I'll update you all tomorrow. Gonna hang out with the fiance and Betsy now and watch some TV and relax finally........

Oh, I'd also be interested to hear the opinions of some of the experts here........about her recovery. Since she has resumed eating and drinking, talking, etc......and since the meds should have long since worn off by now.....do you think the problem is corrected? What do you think about the fungal theory? What do you think about bringing her back in? Stress her and do it or monitor and see how it goes? I don't know why a vet can't answer some simple questions unless I bring her in......they want the money I guess. I can't believe even Michigan State won't take birds - a friend brought an injured BAT there once and they treated it! They treat HORSES! Ludicrous. This vet is the only one, even hours away, that will see her before Wednesday. One place said they'd see her Wednesday - the soonest I could get her into any other was August 17 for a "new patient". Again, what kind of vet won't take an emergency if they're in the office? Again, ridiculous. I bet I called 50+ vets yesterday throughout the day - all the way down to Detroit, Indianapolis, and Ft. Wayne. I'd drive all day if I had to in order to get her proper care. My problem at this point is that they've gouged me for so much cash I don't have much left for treatment until I can withdraw some from a money market account or sell some investments Monday..... Anyhow, any experts around give me your best guess on my queries and how to proceed going forward. I wish I was more versed in bird anatomy. Never even dissected a bird. Humans, yes. Birds, no......

Sheesh, what a night.....first the questions...... The X-Ray showed no blockage but they didn't get the best angle. I have a hard time believing there is something stuck in her throat anyway - would be too much of a coincidence. They did, however, say her wing looked a bit funny. They were worried there was a fungal infection that was causing all this, and that a steroid would make it worse. I told them to go ahead with the steroid to improve her breathing. If she stops breathing......well......you know. I wanted to be as aggressive as possible. I can't imagine she has a fungal infection anyway - I think the blurry area in the X-Ray is just the bad angle and her squirming to get away. The vet had little experience reading bird X-Rays. We have lived at the same place since she was a baby - she never showed signs of illness before - we keep the place spotless (I'm a neat freak) - no one comes over (we go out) - and we never touch her when coming home until after washing our hands. Anyhow...... As far as the breeder, they're worthless. If you happened to read another thread of mine here, they're the ones that told us when she wouldn't eat her pellets to stop feeding her everything but pellets until she started eating them. They also told us it was ok to feed her McDonald's and other fast food - meat and all - and when I would go there their birds would be eating french fries, burgers, and tacos with them for lunch and lapping at their coke. They also almost killed our Betsy as a baby by giving her a marshmallow once when I went to visit before taking her home. It gummed up her beak and she almost choked to death. I spent 2 hours cleaning it off. So no, I have no confidence in anything they say.......unfortunately they're the only shop in the area that deals with parrots so everyone goes to them. They have a shop right on one of the busiest streets in the area and their new thing is that they put bird cages (with Greys and others inside) right out by the street to entice people to come in. The birds must be terrified. So after the IV she perked up[ quite a bit. I stopped the drip and left her in the plexi case we borrowed. It is large enough for her to turn around and has a fluffy pad on the bottom. She wanted out, but I kept her in overnight to avoid her using precious energy and so we could keep her next to our bed - plus the case gets quite warm so I figured that was best as it was getting cooler at night. I opened it to put her water and food inside, and she escaped, climbing up my arm to my shoulder. I let her sleep there for an hour or so, then put her back in. We awoke this morning to her drinking up a storm. We had to refill her water dish! She was also munching on her food - whatever her beak touched, LoL - stuff she normally won't even touch she was munching down. She ate a fair amount, drank like crazy, then went back to sleep. She must be exhausted. When she goes to the bathroom now it looks fairly normal and not clear as before. She is also talking a fair bit - saying "Hey you", "want out", "daddy's up!", and other such stuff. She wants out bad at this point, but I think I'll keep her in there at least until afternoon if not longer. She looks dead tired and her legs/feet look quite weak, but she was bobbing her head and asking for pets. I didn't want to open the tank, however, since I knew she would try to escape and that it would be significantly more difficult to get her back in than it was last night. Didn't want to stress her. I think she liked sleeping by our bed - she normally sleeps in the living room. She curled up on the side of the cage right next to me, LoL. At this point, going by what the vet told me (the real vet), the steroid and bronchodilator should have worn off. She is no longer wheezing at all as far as I can tell, so I hope the problem is corrected. The water helped like you wouldn't believe. It really was amazing. I cannot describe to you the condition she was in when they brought her back from X-Ray. She was just gasping for breath, so weak she could hardly stand, and bleeding slightly from under her tailfeathers (I think from pushing so hard to either use the bathroom or breathe). I prepared myself at that moment for her to crash at any second. Don't know what else to say other than I'll keep you updated. I put in a call to the vet 3 hours ago but they have yet to call me back. I'm supposed to go to an appointment for a couple of hours this afternoon and didn't want to leave her alone until I spoke with them, so I hope they call back. I'm quite disillusioned with vet care in general after this ordeal. You would think these people wouldn't be in it just for the money. I can understand wanting to make a good living, but the stuff I've experienced is ridiculous. 100+ dollars an hour for oxygen? 300 dollars to pop in and look at her every once in awhile? Just sad - and what kind of medical facility lets an animal die rather than treating it and working out a payment plan? At worst they would have had to wait until Friday for payment. Who has thousands of dollars in liquid cash at 1 AM on a Saturday morning? I thought about vet school but decided at the time the cost of school to earnings ratio and job availability was too poor - and thought I could do more good working on humans. I've come to wonder about the decision over the last couple of years, however......I pressed my fiance to become a vet since she loves animals so much - but she's too interested in forensics. A shame - she would be great. Anyway, I'll be back to update as soon as the vet calls. I just called again and they "haven't forgotten me"........but the receptionist said they would need me to bring her back in before they could answer any questions. I had really hoped to avoid the stress with her doing better......

So they just kicked us out when we ran out of money........sent her right home. I've now spent every cent I have - around $2200 - with nothing to show for it but a couple syringes of Metacam, one poor X-Ray, 3 hours on oxygen, and a bird worse off then when I brought her in. I don't know if I've mentioned but I'm a medical student at MSU (currently off for summer and living up north for work). So I decided the best I could do for her was to try to give her an IV of fluids. I got her home and did my best to give her an IV subcutaneously under her wing. I got it going and she is looking and acting much better at the moment but still has labored breathing. I have her in the small plexi box still since it is quite warm and so she an't hurt herself in a larger cage since she is so weak. She seems to be looking stronger now that she has some fluids. I guess I'm going to take her back to the vet that kicked us out in the AM - don't know where else to bring her. I can't find a darned vet in this half of the state that will treat her any time soon - even MSU won't take her. Ridiculous. After the IV I'm a little more optimistic about her chances but we need to get her breathing improved and if the steroid and bronchodilator didn't do it I don't know what will. Anyway, wanted to leave you an update......doing everything I can to keep her alive. What kind of vet won't treat a dying animal? I can see if I was just in off the street, but they've already taken me for a ridiculous amount of money for very little treatment. And I could pay when I get paid next Friday. Nope.........

Well I don't think she is going to survive the night. When the vet brought her back from X-Ray she could hardly breathe. She was doing fine before. Not sure what they did since they wouldn't let me come along to calm her. So they then gave her a steroid, benadryl, and a bronchodiliator. None worked. They then informed me that they were closing and had to go home and threw us out on the street with a dying bird, telling us to go to the emergency clinic. I proceeded to call all around - hours away - even calling Michigan State U's animal center but they wouldn't take birds. So we found ourselves back at the emergency clinic already $1760 spent. The emergency clinic now tells me they won't treat her and will just send her home if I can't come up with a $1500 additional deposit - and that that will only last until 6AM. I told them I don't have that much money, so they're now packing her up to send her home at only a charge of $500 for having her on oxygen for an hour. I don't think she'll last thru the night without oxygen. She is in far worse shape than when I got to the vet and I think I would have been better off staying home. Not sure what to do - I was so angry I walked out since they won't allow you to see your animal anyway. They suggested in the AM going thru their affiliated bank and applying for a 10,000 loan which should cover "a couple days care". Ridiculous. None of these places care a darn bit for anything but money. I'm done with animals if she doesn't make it......these people are the scum of the Earth. I wish my vet would have at least notified me they no longer treat birds so I could have found another in case of emergency such as this.

The problem isn't the distance - it's that no one will see her until next week at the earliest. So I have her at the vet in town now. They don't have an avian vet but say the vet has worked with birds before. They have her in a box giving her oxygen. They listened to her chest and say the wheezing is limited to the throat and not the lungs. They say it indicates either something is stuck in her throat or that she is having an allergic or asthmatic reaction. They're taking X-rays now to check for blockage. They say the Metacam probably caused the decreased appetite and lethargy. They say she should not have been given the Metacam. I don't think they're planning to keep her overnight but we'll see. And what is it with these vets not letting you be there for the exam? They all make you wait outside. Seems like it would be more stressful! I'm not a crazy person that won't stay out of their way - I could see them keeping me out then. Anyhow, I think it is good news that her lungs aren't effected. I'll keep you updated. Any thoughts on the new diagnosis?

I found a vet in the area that will see her. They say they aren't bird "experts" but that they have treated birds before and can at least look at her. Heading there now. I tried to give her water using a syringe - no luck - she's scared of it and doesn't want the water anyway, even off my fingers......

Geez, I'm calling these places and they have avian vets in the office but no one will even talk to me without money. I tell them I'm hours away and there are no vets in my area and they just tell me I can make an appointment if I want. SO frustrating.....

So I just called the darned emergency clinic again and they want me to bring her back. They say they'll need to keep her over the weekend and that we won't be allowed to see her during this time. What should I do? Leave her alone with these people? I have no idea how to proceed.........

And I called avian vets all the way into 2 states over this AM but none would give me any advice at all without seeing her........

She doesn't want to eat or drink anything now. It's tough because she has always hated anything wet other than water. I've been trying to give her water through an eyedropper, but not much luck, she just gets upset and starts breathing harder. As I said earlier, I took her in the bathroom last night and it seemed to make it harder for her to breathe. Her breathing got really labored so I discontinued. The Metacam doesn't seem to be doing much good. Just checked the avian vet website and no luck (other than the places I already was familiar with). At this point I don't know what to do. I don't see myself being able to get her to eat enough food and drink enough water by eyedropper to keep her alive for long. I have her in the bedroom as far away as possible from the area that got sprayed, but I think the stress of being in a different area might have been what started the whole not eating thing in the first place. I have all the windows open and it's 90+ degrees outside, so chills aren't too much of a worry. I didn't take her to the other vet (6+ hour drive) thinking it would do more harm than good and that I could get the same level of poor care at the emergency vet here in town........but neither will treat her without a large sum of money I don't have to give them.........

Thanks for the thoughts and advice by the way - much appreciated. Hoping someone with some specific knowledge of these things comes around too and can advise on the medical issues......

See I know Metacam is used for muscular/skeletal issues - my question is whether it is useful for respiratory inflammation...... The vet we normally use for her is 2 hours away. That's the closest one that will treat birds. But when I called this AM I was told their avian vet had left them and that they no longer treat birds, so the next closest is nearly 3 hours away. To find another I'd need to look even farther than that.......not sure what to do at this point about the vet - hopefully we won't need one again anytime soon since she's not even 3 years old.......I suppose if we do, however, I'll find a good one even if it takes a 3+ hour drive. This is the 2nd vet that stopped treating birds by the way. Our first was right around the corner. They stopped about a year ago and sent us to the one 2 hours away. Now they have stopped also so we've had to look even further. I was on the phone all morning calling every vet in the area with no luck. I have her in her portable cage (I used to take her with me on business travel). It is pretty big for a travel cage - I'd say 2.5 feet by maybe 2 feet. Anyway, I have her in our bedroom away from the living room. I think it is pretty well aired out though, anyway. The windows and sliding doors have been open all night - the air filter running, and 2 fans blowing. There is no longer any scent left........but just to be safe I moved her.

Just called the Emergency Vet back to ask about the medication and the loss of appetite.......they told me they can't answer questions over the phone and that I'll need to bring her in again at a cost of $500 if I want a "follow-up". Completely ridiculous. Basically at this point I'm just so tired I'm not thinking straight and hoping some of the bird experts here can give me their opinion on (obviously not real medical advice): 1) Is Metacam effective at treating respiratory inflammation in Greys? 2) Does the diagnosis and treatment plan seem reasonable? 3) How serious is wheezing/respiratory distress (after over 24 hours) caused by an "allergic reaction" to fumes such as those from Formula 409? 4) Do you think I should bring her to another scandalous-sounding vet for a second opinion or continue with prescribed treatment over the weekend and re-evaluate on Monday? 5) Should I begin to worry yet about her not eating for 12 or so hours? About the watery feces?

I've talked to every vet in the area - as I said the closest one that will see her is almost 3 hours away, which means 6 hours in the car. I don't have a problem spending the money, but their attitude does NOT inspire confidence. Not to mention that it will take the last of my cash to get her seen - then if she needs treatment I'll be out of luck. I asked what they would do in the case of an emergency - if they would treat her......they said no.......and asked if I had credit cards, saying they could split the charges on multiple cards. They also said they couldn't treat her, but they would keep her for awhile while we went to borrow money or sell things if we needed to! Talk about rude! And they're affiliated with the Emergency Vet that raped us for $500 last night. So anyhow, I'm not sure what to do.

Apparently the vet spelled it wrong on the label - the correct spelling is Metacam, FYI........ So the dose last night did nothing. I just gave her a double dose now and I think she got most of it down (hard to tell with a beak). She sounds significantly better now but I'm more worried about the long-term effects and the not eating....... What a night.......I'm exhausted and stressed......but scared to leave her to go to sleep........

So haven't been to sleep yet - the wheezing is a little worse this AM, she's now acting strange, she won't eat, and when she goes to the bathroom it is just like water. I also looked up Medicam and from what I can tell it isn't even useful as a respiratory anti-inflamatory. So I called our vet this AM and was told they no longer treat birds. They recommended a vet around 3 hours away. So I called them and was told it is a $200 "specialist" fee to have her sen, not including any treatments, and that they may need to keep her over the weekend at a cost of $90 per day. I asked if I could speak to the doctor about the medication the emergency vet gave us and was told not until we pay and bring her in. I'm not sure what to do at this point. They won't see her without payment up front and after spending $500 last night it will be everything I have for the entire next week. I'm starting to get increasingly worried about her, however, and have no idea what to do. Even if I bring her and pay the $200, however, if she needs treatment I won't have enough........these vets are ridiculous and obviously only care about the money. I really don't want to subject her to 6 hours in the car either, especially since when she gets scared she starts to breath very hard and the wheezing gets worse. Anyone have any advice? I could have killed my fiance this morning....... Oh, and I tried the nebulization treatment suggested by the emergency vet and she had difficulty breathing with the humid air and was in obvious distress so I discontinued it........gave her the Medicam - 10 units or .1 ccs. Anyone care to offer advice?

Well, her wheezing got worse tonight around midnight so I felt I had no choice but to bring her to the Emergency Vet Clinic. I could tell her breathing was labored since her poor tailfeathers would move every time she took a breath and she was breathing through her beak rather than her nostrils as she usually does. So we took her to the vet. I went to the door alone first and requested to speak to the vet on duty. They refused, saying I could not speak to her regarding anything until our credit card was charged $175 for a deposit. I obliged, and we were allowed in the door. After a 3.5 hour ordeal of sitting in a waiting room alone (we were the only ones there), the doctor finally saw us. I think they were angry since they wanted to take our Grey to a room without us but I refused - they took our rabbit to another room the last time we were there and I could literally hear her screaming - she passed away that night when we returned home. So we were allowed to sit in this time. The vet listened to her chest, then told us she probably had an allergic reaction to the fumes even though the cleaner is supposedly ok for birds. She prescribed Medicam to relieve the inflamation in her airway. She also prescribed an antibiotic. After waiting another hour to get the medication, they suggested a nebulizer treatment at a price of $175 more dollars. I told them I would bring her into the bathroom and mist it up with the shower instead. So we left 4.5 hours later and $500 lighter in the wallet. Hopefully the Medicam works......I'm going to bed......