birdhouse

Kikki may be starved for the contact but freaking out from too much stimulation. And believe it or not, he may be missing his last owners. It's a grey thing. It doesn't matter if it makes sense to us. I'd encourage you to ease up on the physical contact. Let him find his own pace. Let him start to come to you when he's ready. Making eye contact, talking, whistling are all forms of contact, too. I think that's more of Kikki's speed for the moment. Greys can tend to have a real problem w/new toys, too. Actually, greys tend to have a problem with "new" period. lol So again, I'd suggest you back up. Put all your "big" toys away, for now. Find bits of wood, buttons, plastic bottle caps, etc, foot toys for Kikki to play with. You can collect a cup full to leave in his cage. You can also use them as an excuse to make limited contact by handing him something several times a day. Sorry, but it just doesn't matter that you want to give Kikki a greyt life Right Now. Looks like he may be trying to tell you that it's all too much too fast. So just be patient & give him however much time he needs. TIME + PATIENCE = SUCCESS You'll see that a lot around here. It's our mantra. Another thing to put on the fridge. lol

Yep. I can see why he got tangled up in your heartstrings. Glad he's finally home!

Thought these might be a few more helpful links to add to your reading list. SAFE/TOXIC LIST (another fridge list lol) http://www.parrot-and-conure-world.com/non-toxic-for-birds.html DIY TOYS/FORAGING ACTIVITIES http://www.parrotenrichment.com/images/PEAB_V1.pdf ^^ you'll need Adobe Reader installed for that one. If you don't already have it, you can get it free here PC http://get.adobe.com/reader/ MAC http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/detail.jsp?ftpID=3807 JIM MCKENDRY'S BLOG http://parrotconsultations.blogspot.com/2011/12/parrot-feeding-strategies-part-1-free.html I'm a great big fan of Jim McKendry. This blog post just had a couple of relevant food tips. So I thought I'd share. Please keep in mind that he's feeding an aviary full of Aussie breeds, for the most part. So the food is much higher in fruit than is advisable for Greys. But anything else applies. The rest of his blog is full of little jewels, too. You can also find articles by him in many publications & all over the Web. I think he has a great approach to companion parrots. So I thought some of his articles might prove helpful.

Very cute. Don't feel bad. Phenix never cooperates whenever I have the camera out, either. He usually puts on his best bad attitude & disappears. At least Spencer's looking really happy & pretty darned handsome. You'd never know to watch him up there that he had any problems at all. Pretty impressive!!

... just call them the way I see them. Some of the plucking could be about having his whole world rocked. Even though it may be for the better, it's still scary! You can't overestimate how fragile a grey's psyche can be sometimes. Also, be careful what you use on/around Kikki. The aloe vera should be 100% pure preferably organic & not gel. Otherwise, it can cause it's own problems. Believe it or not, plain old vinegar is a very good disinfectant/antimicrobial for cleanups. It's cheap, safe & rinses well. Doesn't matter if it didn't. Vinegar is actually good for fids. Steamers are excellent for cleaning, too. No harmful fumes or chemicals. Heat's great to disinfect & lift most any mess. Quick, easy & very effective for floors & cages & useful through the whole house. Can you tell I love my steam cleaner & my microfiber cloths? lol

Hi TIMS & Kikki. Just read this thru & WOW! I'm so impressed w/how far Kikki has come in just 2 wks. That's a very, very short time even if he was younger & had a super life. He's doing way better than normal. Kikki's already far ahead of where he might be about stepping up. The fact that he offered you a foot & chickened out is huge. So respect that & celebrate the effort. He's come a long way in an incredibly short time. But he's got 25 yrs to overcome. That's a giant step(up). This is a very important part of your bonding process. So go painfully slowly & be very, very patient. If Kikki's lived in that cage for so long, he has very little balance & no muscle tone. It's probably going to take months to develop. He has long since forgotten what his wings are for because he hasn't even been able to spread them. So he doesn't really get how to use them for balance let alone flight. It's going to take time & practice. And he will likely crash many times once he starts to regain his confidence. So like others have said, keep him as safe as possible, especially from bouncing on the hard floor. Better to start w/lower, safer perching. The Tarzan rope is probably not going to be a good idea for many months. A Boing might be good safe fun. Maybe you could build him an orbit &/or a cargo net. There are a number of threads about DIY here. Once he logs some time climbing & swinging, he'll be able to relearn what those long forgotten muscles do. As far as food is concerned... pellets are over rated! You can forget about them completely if Kikki will learn to eat a fresh balanced diet. It might really pay off if you read, read, read on the "Bird Food" forum. A lot of the information/recipes are about ingredients that are available in other parts of the world. But you should still be able to get a very good start. Once you get the idea, you'll be able create your own mashes w/native ingredients. A lot cheaper than pellets, a lot more available, tastier & better for Kikki, anyway. Thought I'd recommend this thread to start. There was something for everyone in it. http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?194243-Mash-amp-Chop&p=241139#post241139 Food is also greyt bonding. Lots of fids like to eat w/their parronts. Foraging is good exercise for Kikki's body & mind. But watching how he thinks is another good way to really understand him. Did I mention that all parrots love to play w/their food? lol Lucky for you, you've got those lovely tile floors. Makes clean ups so much easier. But seriously, fresh food has so much advantage over tossing pellets in a dish. I'd really encourage you to look into it. I'm so glad that you came along & changed this poor guy's life. It sounds like you're off to a fabulous start already. I'm looking forward to your posts about all the little things that make parronthood so scary, rewarding, frustrating, exciting & awesome.

^^^^... Aawww! Poor Misty! Hi Susan! I think "What" was Phenix 2nd/3rd word & he used it surprisingly appropriately from the beginning. Call him & he'd answer, "What?" Call him out & it was, "What (no-o... not ME)???", etc. He's got every possible nuance of that single word down. A bit ago he came out with, "Wha-at (really don't want to hear it right now)." Reading this reminded me of something that happened just after he'd been doing it for just long enough for me to start to take it for granted. We'd been waiting in an examining room. Phenix was sitting on me, busily munching a tongue depressor I'd swiped for him. The vet finally came in & started casually observing from a distance while we talked. When he eventually walked over to w/in a few feet of us, Phenix finally stopped, looked over his shoulder & snapped, "WHAT (do...you...WANT)!?!" PERFECT tone of voice. PERFECT body language. ALL the attitude you could ever possibly imagine. The vet choked out, "He didn't just... HAHAHAHA ...did he... HAHAHA ...Oh HAHAHA ...Oh!! NO!! HAHAHA ...what I thought... he...!!??" before he finally wrapped his head around what he'd heard & collapsed against the wall in hysterics. It must have been a full 5 minutes before he could finally stop laughing. And Little Mr. Attitude...? He rattled his tail feathers & went right back to what he'd been doing. So classic. So Grey(t)!

For some people, the one kind of big drawback w/Conures & Quakers can be the noise. I love Charm (Quaker) to pieces. I think she has an outrageous personality & she's endless fun. I may be a little prejudice, but I think she's darn cute, too! However, she's one of the loudest birds ever. She also hits a particular pitch & volume that makes my teeth reverberate, on a pretty regular basis. I'm usually pretty oblivious to loud, happy bird noises. But sometimes, I actually have to put the noise canceling headphones on until she finally quiets back down. The other problem w/my particular cast of characters is that Charm thinks she's at least as big as anyone else around. She's very outgoing & has no fear. I'm always doing double time to keep her out of mischief w/my bigger birds, the dogs or whatever else she happens to find amusing. :eek: I have always been an ekkie fan. I certainly haven't been disappointed being an ekkie parront. Bonus points, my ekkie is the one bird that Phenix actually kinda likes. Although he may never admit it. lol Considering what an anti-social type he is, that was a real big surprise! So I thought maybe an ekkie could be a nice fit with Spencer & your flock? The one other ekkie that I know fairly well is a Vos male who's quite a character. Male ekkies do generally have a rep for being more outgoing than females. Compared to Kura, he's much more of an entertainer. This guy is definitely in his element whenever he's got an audience. He's just such a big clown that everyone falls for him immediately. Kura tends to be pretty quiet, for the most part. I think she actually has a beautiful voice. Of course, she also has some very jungle sounding parrot calls, too. But it's so rare that she always surprises me when she cuts loose. She's very social & loves meeting people. She's very often content to watch the show, rather than be the star. But everyone still falls for the beautiful little redhead because she's just such a little sweetheart.

Hahaha Just one of the many reasons why they think they should rule the roost. Me too, btw. I'm dyslexic & it just makes things like quick links a little more frustrating sometimes. Gracie might enjoy it if you make a chain of quick links for her to dismantle. Have you tried that, yet? Phenix' new trick is unscrewing the door behind his cups. I've got the nuts & screw in a different order now & it's making him so-o-o mad that he can't take it apart anymore (she said, keeping her fingers crossed!). He keeps smashing it up & down in place. The door is a solid metal plate that makes a heck of a racket & is making a real mess out of his beak. Really, really hoping he gets tired of this game ver-ry soon.

Near as I can tell, watching things hit the floor is just endless fun for a grey. Things that crash when they land get extra points. Watching parronts pick things up off the floor gets extra points. Full marks for anything that hits the floor & crashes, causing everyone (else) to jump out of their skin before having to pick up A mess! ...and it just never gets old! Alas, being the grumpy old lady that I am, I'm just not that amused by this particular game. So, any of the fids who like to fling their cups get locking food cups. Any toy that has to be picked up m/t twice, gets put away, away, until the next time I rotate the toys. But just because Phenix, particularly loves to throw things so much, I do play catch w/the fids. They get so excited when they see the baseball sized cat ball w/the bell inside. Much too funny to watch my Quaker trying to manhandle that thing! lol It used to tick me off. But eventually I found a way to turn a bad habit into a pretty fun thing for everyone.

I took a class where it wasn't possible to do this week's homework until you successfully completed every part of every prior week's. The only way I could keep up w/this monstrous project was to keep an active copy on a USB stick so that I could steal time to work on it where ever possible. One week, I'd gotten a huge junk done on the school's computers & was about to back it all up & finish the last of that section on my PC at home. I left the thumb drive on the table long enough to grab a cup of coffee & a snack. When I came back ready to settle down to work, it was gone. Sure enough, Kura had zeroed in on this bright, shiny new toy & carried it off. By the time I finally managed to get it back, she'd ripped the little slider part off & destroyed the drive. Of course the foolish assignment was due the next day. Of course there wasn't time to redo all my work & get it in on time. So, of course I had to go to school empty handed & the grown adult had to explain (in front of a classroom full of "kids") how my ̶d̶o̶g̶ parrot ate my homework. ...that was fun.

So very sad to read that it was Anya's time to go. Almost everyone who's read your thread(s) knows what a wonderful parront you are & how well treated she was. Certainly anyone with a beating heart knows how loved. I'm so sorry you lost the battle for your beautiful little girl. I know how much she will be missed.

It sounds like Simon's almost there! If you leave the room & there's just a little noise, like the TV or radio on low, you might catch him practicing. :cool: Probably won't hear anything other than almost-words, but it might help keep you happy for however long until he pops out with his first real human speech. Phenix was a very grown adult before he ever learned to talk. After I started reading on GF, I was surprised that he'd only imitated water sounds before he called the dog for the first time (loved that dog! lol).

All the rain is making for an insane ant population this year. My solution is Boric acid. But please be warned that it takes about 1-2 weeks for the colony to eat enough & to kill the queen. Also, they really like it, which is why it's so successful. But, you will have a noticeable upsurge in the infestation for a short while. There's a commercially prepared mixture call Terro. But the DIY is to use 1 part either Boric acid or Borax detergent mixed into 5 parts of something sweet or some greasy cooked meat. I don't like the idea of the meat going bad for that long or driving the dogs crazy in the meantime. But it is an option. I'd use Karo syrup but you can use honey, real fruit juice or molasses for instance. Get Styrofoam cups or plastic containers w/covers. Punch holes 1/2" or so from bottom. Put a teaspoon'ish in the cup then cover. Whatever you use, do not put it near food. The ants are going to swarm it & anything else will become collateral damage. This isn't a repellant. All you want is to put it someplace where they can get to it & take it back to the colony. Since ants are drawn to water, I like to put it in the bathroom, somewhere my critters can't reach. The ants seem to have no problem finding it in the cabinet under the sink or behind the washer. And I have less problems watching them while I'm waiting for it to work. I've also used it outside & in the crawlspace. But it attracts ants that may not have come, otherwise. It still does a fine job, but the initial swarm is kinda grim. So I usually limit it to inside the house. Good luck!

NEVER knowingly do anything that may cause a parrot physical or emotional harm. Dropping a fid, particularly a flightless fid can result in broken blood feathers or even bones. NEVER respond to a fid's aggression with aggression. This method is deliberately intended to shock the bird & put him in a position where he feels defenseless. He may well allow himself to be handled in the moment, but it will have repercussions later. There is no "one size fits all" method to deal w/biting. But all behavioral problems should be met w/positive correction & this is negative & potentially dangerous.

If I posted something about Phenix & most of the members responded w/much more about the wild bird trade than any issue I'd hoped to address, I'd really feel badly. But I would like to think that I could see their need to initially make a point about something that they felt so passionate about & accept it. If many of the same members continued to address the wild bird trade vs my individual reasons for posting, then I think I would eventually feel alienated. Assuming that I had the intestinal fortitude to continue as an active member, it would probably be because I was hoping that at some point, I would have become an individual & member of the GF family that I've read about. But if this many months had gone by & members couldn't accept my situation, I'd be hurt & frustrated enough to have been driven off. I feel very strongly about the wild bird trade & I will continue to do whatever I can to help save these birds. I also feel very strongly that once these greys reach captivity & have no chance of being returned to the wild, we continue to have a responsibility to do everything possible to save them. If they have any chance to transition to a healthy life, they need special handling to keep them from being added to the already appalling statistics. Keeping many hundreds of wild birds from living miserably until they die in captivity is not promoting the wild trade. The way I see it, it's the only humane thing to do until we can stop the carnage all together. Leaving owners, who for whatever reason have acquired these birds, to fend for themselves is sad & certain death for most of these birds. If members could make that the priority & focus, more information would become available & more birds would be saved.

I lurked on this forum for years before I posted anything because I was so afraid to admit that I had a wild caught grey. Knowing the majority sentiment, I expected to be received exactly like Joe has been. I could never have continued to be an active member of this or any forum if I had been on the receiving end of half of what Joe has. No one has ever said anything to me about Phenix being wild caught. I would have said that it's because I learned the error of my ways & became an advocate. But no one is climbing all over Shanlung for waxing poetic about Libai, Jackie, Yingshiong & the legendary Riamfada. Nor should they. But that's confusing to me because he very obviously has the choice, seems to prefer to keep wild caughts & is a very true believer that stopping the wild bird trade is very, very bad. Joe can't start a breeding program & single handedly affect the bird trade in Africa & the Middle East, let alone change it. The point is that some members continue to react to his posts as though he can & should. Not as if he were a school kid who's trying to do the best he can w/a less than perfect situation. What he can & has done is openly discussed a situation that who knows how many silent GF readers are facing. His insights could potentially help transition who knows how many wild greys. If members could focus on that, they could help save so many greys who might never become adapted otherwise. Joe & Mikko represent a huge (much needed) opportunity to save countless more wild greys who would be lost simply from lack of available information. What's done is done. Nothing's going to change what has already happened. At what point has Joe earned the right to be comfortable to post openly about his & Mikko's progress & be given the same support as any other member w/a "special" bird?? People have said what they felt they needed to say about Mikko's being wild caught. Each thread may be an opportunity to make a statement to other members going forward. But the important thing now is the dedication & love that Joe so obviously has for Mikko. I think it's in the least unfair to Joe, or any other reader who has a wild caught fid, to continue to focus on the wild caught issue instead of individual concerns & progress. Joe's obviously learned a lot since he's gotten Mikko. He's also beaten some pretty big odds to achieve what he has so far. Even though he continues to face so much criticism from this community, he continues here to learn more for Mikko's benefit. He obviously cares a great deal about his fid. Joe has earned legitimacy as a grey parront so it should be the focus of the response to his posts.

Thanks guys. Sorry I haven't had a chance to get back before this. Thanks, Wingy. I've seen where Goldenfeast has Chamomile in a few of their mixes, too. I have no idea how much or anything. But it did make me feel a little more comfortable about using it. Thanks, Greywings. I was surprised when I had no problem finding it in the first grocery store I checked. I just wish I could find some more specifics about what makes it work or if there's a suggested potency or frequency or anything. Kind of funny... Kura decided to help herself to the bottle. She barely got the first bud & I was right behind her. But she really liked it & got kind of pushy about getting me to give her some more. For some reason, all I could think about the way she reacted was "catnip". I still can't decide if it's a good thing. lol But I went ahead & let her have a couple. Nothing bad seems to have happened, so I've let her have a little since, too. At the moment, I'm using it as a spray twice a week, w/a clear water spray in between. It doesn't seem to have caused any problems. It seems to make her more comfortable than aloe. She does have a lovely herby apple scent, now. Seems like it makes her mellow, whether she gets to eat it or gets sprayed. At most she doesn't seem to be any more sedated than after a human has a small glass of wine. Other than that, I can't really say much one way or the other. She's still at her feathers, but a little less often for a while after the chamomile. I'd like to let her have it as a bedtime treat because she's destructive at night when I can't stop her. But I'm pretty conflicted about that because I still can't find any solid facts. Until I do, I guess I'm just going to have to take it very slowly & keep trying to find more information.

I think that sounds like a lot of progress. Although I know it's easy for me to say because I'm not living in your time warp. Things always seem to go so-o-o s-lo-o-w-w-l-y when you're living it. lol

It breaks my heart that you lost Twix. I was so sorry to read that. I think I understand how very much you want to find another grey. But it may be even more important now that you do it under the best possible circumstances. Please, don't consider buying a wild caught grey. There are so many reasons starting w/the humanitarian aspects http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?190930-1000-greys-confiscated I have kept a wild caught grey for over 20 yrs. In those days, the world knew little about the trade & they were still legal in the US. I also had no way to read his band & originally believed he'd been re-banded. Although I admit knowing wouldn't have changed my decision under the circumstances because he would have been destroyed, otherwise. It was a long, long, painful road for both of us, but strictly speaking he is tame, for the most part. He's not so much a pet. It's more like he eventually accepted that he would never be free again. I have no way to know, but I think age finally played a hand in it as well. He'll never be tame by the standards of most fids posted about here, though. Although he has come so very far, he will always be wild at heart. And I never realized that until I joined this forum & got the chance to read so much about the "normal" reactions of domestically raised greys. One of my big regrets is that Phenix can't or won't accept the wonderful life of a caged bird. I want to give him tons of affection, new toys all the time, lots of social interaction & maybe even travel. But after decades, his first reaction to everything is fear. So, being a grey, his first response is to defend himself. He can't be trusted around adults, let alone children. In Phenix case, there's no attempt to threaten or warn. His immediate reaction is to strike out, doing the most possible damage he can to drive off any potential "danger". He's also done everything possible to prove that he wants little or nothing to do w/most humans. Anyone who isn't sufficiently threatened by his growling will be attacked as soon as they get w/in reach. Only a few of my friends (who are the very best w/animals) have ever managed to get anywhere at all w/him. And they pretty much get to start a shortened form of the process all over, each time they visit. No guarantee about the outcome on any given day, either. Needless to say, I worry about what would happen if I stopped being able to take care of him. It ranks right up there w/fear of escape & disease. I certainly admit that there are greys who were domestically bred & still fit this description because there's never any guarantees about a grey's temperament. But it's just logical that there are much better odds that a fid who has been hand fed & reared by humans has a far better chance of bonding w/them than one who spent 2? 8? 17? 25? years as a truly wild parrot before living thru capture & (hopefully) quarantine. I am usually the first to advocate for rescuing a fid & a long time owner of a wild caught grey. I love & respect Phenix in a way that's utterly senseless to many. Still, I could never in good conscience advise anyone to knowingly adopt a wild grey to keep as a pet.

More proof that Isaac is a very special boy... My guys delight in knocking cups over whenever they get the chance. Noise is good! Splash EveryWhere is better!! lol

Thanks for posting the adorable video, Judy. The stove part made me cringe a little, but otherwise this brought back a flood of sweet memories.

Don't think you can mess up that much cuteness. jmho