Jane08

I have been doing this online course LLP (Living and learning with parrots) which is run by Susan Friedman and I really recommend it. It is about reinforcement and how to change unwanted behaviours effectively and humanely. So it helps to build a better relationship and make our birds lives better. I have found it really helpful as it is very inetractive and you actually analyse behaviours that you have with your own birds and come up with plans to change them. There is a waiting list for the course, but if you can get on it then I really suggest you do it. You will learn a lot about yourself and about your birds.

Ours are Rangi and Kea. We named them before we got them and I must say Kea's name is very fitting. She steals everything from everyone, she actually waits for Rangi to climb to the bottom of the cage and bring food back up and then she runs over and snatches it. Stealing things is a major thing that the real kea parrot species does, not to mention destroying things which she is great at. I also wanted names from my home country which is where Rangi came in and it also means god of the sky which I thought was nice.

What I did at the start was get up a few times and praise them for staying on the perch and give them something to eat. They learnt after sometime that flying to me meant in the cage and staying on the perch meant food that I was eating....not a hard choice for them to make. I then just cut down on the getting up until gradually I didn't have to do it anymore they just stayed there.

They never did it again because they were never there in the first place.

Yes you would be able to pick them out by their unique body language. We took both of ours to a bird get together and there were loads of greys flying around together and it took me no time to locate our two. I just looked for distinct ways that they moved. Also yes they know who you are as well, so many times I would just be standing there and they would come and land on me or I would suddenly see this grey following me with his eyes and waiting for me to call him and I knew that was my Rangi.

What a great story you are really an inspiration for others who have problems with their greys and think it will never get better or can't improve.

If you hate what she is doing so much then why do you own a grey. You do exactly the same thing with your grey in your home. You force it to live it's life in your home, you have it in a cage, you teach it to do things that you want it to do, you teach it words, tricks, to know what ceratin objects are. So basically you are doing the same thing that she is doing, so stop with this nonsense.

Yay for Apollo with his flight. You wait until he really learns to fly and then he will take off from anywhere, fly through small gaps in the door, whizz around corners. You will be amazed and in awe. Yes they can be afraid of new toys and you will see that by his reaction. It can help to play with the toy first to show him it's ok. If he is scared of it wait until he is used to it before you put it in the cage. That is great he isn't afriad so far. I also have many perches in the cage ones that are at angles others horizontal, different width, different surfaces. They love to climb from perch to perch. I then also go out and pick fresh branches and place them in the bars of the cage for them to chew on. They love to pick the leaves off and de bark the branch. Toys are a necessity and one toy is definitly not enough and yes this guy is giving you bad advice it's not because your grey is only 14 weeks old.<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/07/10 14:10

Our 2 also do this when they are preening each other. I always see them with each others feathers in their beaks and I never worry about it as I can tell they are not bothered by it and it has never turned into a problem. Mainly they are the down feathers and small feathers, never has it been any tail, flight or larger feathers. For them they do it right the way around the neck area including under the beak.

We also have a thrower. He throws his food bowls, flies to the kitchen sink and throws anything he can get his beak on to the floor. He even opens the cupboard door and grabs the wine glasses out and throws them on the ground. He must think it is so funny grabbing those glasses and watching me realise what is going to happen and then rushing to catch the glass before it hits the ground. He then stands there all proud with his chest out.

Both of ours love their toys and when we come home the cage looks like a tornado has gone though it. We had to try lots of toys though to find their favourite. They like the ones with things hidden in paper.They are big on foraging so we have all the foraging toys. Another favourite is strings of leather with small beads attached. The ones they like the most are the everyday ones that I make. I wrap things (food, nuts, bottle top, dried fruit etc) in paper, paper towel or a coffee filter and hide them in the cage. They are like little parcels and I also hang them from string so that they have to figure out how to pull the string up to get to it. Both of them get into the cage and are like demons racing around the cage to hunt out everything.

The only problem with this is that you would have to do it every year and some people would either forget, not be bothered or keep delaying it as they are busy. Also many people would have problems doing it themsleves as it is a 2 person job and the bird might not react well to being handled in this manner. I mean it is good because the stamp could have your telephone number, name etc. I think as a back up to chipping or the ring it is a good idea if you could manage it and it didn't traumatise the bird. Personally I wouldn't do it as here if your bird is lost and someone takes it to the vet or police they have a register of all bird breeders who they contact in these cases and all breeders have records of the owners.

We also have the heat wave 33 degrees and that is hot for Sweden. The thing is we build our houses to keep in the heat for winter with triple glazing on the windows and insulated walls. So you can imagine how hot it is in our place probably about 60 degrees.

Misslea I know what you mean I can't take ours to the vet either as I get too upset, my boyfriend has to do it. If I went and felt stressed I know it would stress them out as well. I stay at home and am the welcome party when they get home with all the treats ready to go.

We got them in Sweden, so for me it is impossible to take them back to my homeland as they would be refused entry.

One thing you have to think about is that greys are an endangered species so moving them from one country to another is not easy and sometimes impossible because of this reason. Also please see below. As a consequense of the avian influenza situation, import all species of birds, apart from poultry, which are kept as pets and are accompanying their owner, are not permitted. However, it is permitted to import less than 6 live birds, if the birds fulfill certain conditions. More information about import of birds can be found on this homepage of the Danish Veterinary and Food Administration

Rangi flies down the hallway to greet me when I get home and he likes to sit on my shoulder with his butt towards my face and he likes me to stroke his back and then turns his head and gently holds on to my nose with his beak and closes his eyes for a head scratch. He faithfully perches on the back of the soffa next to me every night and when he gets the urge he creeps up the soffa sideways and when he reaches my head he sticks his butt in my face and this is my cue to start with cuddles. He has me well trained. Kea doesn't really show that she loves me in those ways, but many times she will happily sit on my hand as we look out the window at all the action going on and she will turn her head and look at me and this is when I get this warm feeling in my body that she loves me.<br><br>Post edited by: Jane08, at: 2009/07/01 16:03

We also have one that is darker than the other and I have heard (don't know if it is true) that it means they come from different parts of their native country, so one is an inland bird and the other is a coastal bird.

The only thing we do is lock the cage door. I know the breeder we got our birds from had a break in but thank god they didn't touch the birds just opened the door to the bird room and the birds screamed blue murder. They ended up getting an alarm so that when they are in bed it is activated in the other parts of the house (obvioulsy not the birds room). They also have a panic button so if they press it the security company comes out straight away. The alarm is also connected to the fire alarm.

Here here, totally agree with you. This also includes myself who had no clue. I read all the books I could but nothing prepared me for what it was really like. I am not even sure now that I have adjusted to it.

I have also taught our 2 to eat at their perch when we are also eating. Now this isn't to say that they don't have lapses but they are very rare. At first I did watch them closely and when I would see that they were getting restless I would get up and give them a treat. Had to do it many many times but they did learn if I stay on the perch good things happen. I also don't feed them from the same plate as mine so they know it isn't theirs.

What you probably need to do is when you ask her to step up is to reinforce it with something good that she thinks is worth it. Like a treat or praise. Also ask her to step up and take her to places which she loves. It seems like she thinks of stepping up as a bad thing as she is taken to poop or to her cage, which is not fun for her. If you increase the good times that come with stepping up she will step up more. With the biting you could also give her something (food treat) before she flies and bites. You will need to do this many times and be consistent, but finally she will learn that she gets treats for staying where she is and not flying over.

yes this is a common noise they make in these situations. It's best to avoid a situation that makes them feel that they need to make that noise. Or as you did, remove him from the situation as soon as you see him making it. Then introduce him slowly and talk to him and reassure him everything is ok.

Oh great picture of Ecko and his bathing. Good to see he enjoyed it. I also took our 2 out in their cage for a bath this weekend. Kea hates it as soon as I start misting her the little legs go into overdrive and she races from one end of the cage to the other. I stopped after I saw her getting stressed. Rangi loved it and was drenched. dhorje yes I bath them under their wings. With Rangi I touch his wing and ask him to lift it and then I mist him under it when he lifts it. With kea it's a bit harder and I have to get her when she is in the bird bath with her wings lifted.

I also like this topic and Dan I had the same problem with the playing and biting and got so upset that he would bite until I realised it was me not him. Yes this is what I mean we create the problem like biting and then go why does he do that what a mean bird. Instead we should be asking what purpose did that behaviour serve and what am I doing to reinforce it. I think we need to classify what is meant by biting, for me preening, foraging, feeling, eating is not biting. Yes it is using the beak but I don’t classify it as biting. I don’t think there is any difference in the context of the bite, i.e. biting in response to something that you ask them to do but they don’t want to do. The first thing they will do is give you the body language to tell you this is not ok for me. You then ignore or don’t see the body language because you really need your bird to step up and then bam you get bit. So next time you ask your bird to step up he will bite again if he doesn’t want to step up because he learned from past experience that this is normal behaviour. It would be dealt with exactly the same way in the wild, body language or vocal first which all birds understand better than we do so it would not escalate into a bite as it often does in captivity. This is why I feel it is a captivity issue which is learned. Every time I have an issue with Kea or Rangi I always ask myself is this a natural instinct (by natural instinct for example if I blow in your eyes your natural instinct is to close them) and if not then what are they getting out of this behaviour and what is it that I am doing to reinforce this and what can I change. I always look at myself first or environment factors.