carlylu

Hi! Yeah, I've been kind of awol from most everything this fall, but I'm crawling out from under my piles of work! Here are some photos of that particular harness, with a more cooperative model. http://likambo.com/flyblog/zenphoto/harnesses/ I've gone through many iterations of harness designs. I'll be posting info & instructions for my two current favorites -- one with an over-the-head loop, and one with an around-the-head clasp. These are not for flying like Shanlung does with Tinkerbell. Suitable for jaunts about town and recall training outside on fairly short leash (5-15 ft). raz Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/12/18 01:45<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/12/18 01:46

From my newest boy, Piper, trying out his harness and doing recall practice in the festive pine tree in our park. Happy Holidays all! Raz, Carly Lu & Piper Carly Lu's Flight Blog p.s. this is one of my custom-made harnesses that I'll be posting instructions for.

Some of you may have heard of rather poor training materials being marketed on the internet. Sid Price is one of the most reputable trainers out there, and he has a blog with lots of useful information and discussion of training topics. Most recently he addresses the hard-sell bird training marketers ("marketers" being the operative word) as well as some of the harmful training advice given. It's well worth reading or subscribing to if your interested in parrot behavior and training. Bird Training Blog His post "The Real Secrets of Training Success and Where to Find Them" is a very good article on some of the less useful information being marketed on the internet. I talk about some of these issues on Carly Lu's Flight Blog as well, particularly the use of flooding (forcing) to train a bird: How Not to Tame a Bird. Sid Price is the president-elect of the International Association of Avian Trainers and Educators (IAATE). They also have a web site with a great resource section for members (http://www.iaate.org). raz

Be very, very careful flying outdoors with a harness. It's critical that the leash be attached to you -- not holding it or looping it around your wrist. Biggest cause of harness accidents is that it comes loose from the person. Some links on harnesses & harness training here too: http://likambo.com/flyblog/2008/11/early-training-on-a-harness/ I will also be posting detailed pictures and instructions for making custom harnesses on my blog in the next few days or so. raz

Yes, I agree, I'm not saying this to be anti-clipping and certainly not to push outdoor flying. I just hate to see misconceptions about what is and isn't safe. There may be good reasons to keep a bird clipped, but from what I've seen, being safer in the event of an escape is not one of them. The safest thing is to have a bird who is trained to come when called, clipped or unclipped. raz

Trustdace wrote: No one should have a flighted bird outdoors at all without it being solidly recall trained. That includes taking it outside on a harness. If someone wants to freefly, that training should be done with the assistance of someone with experience, and only after learning fundamental training principles. But from a safety standpoint, it's just as important to have good recall with a clipped bird that is taken outside (or who escapes outside). Who has a dog that doesn't know "come here"? Parrots are a lot smarter than dogs. If a clipped bird is up in a tree it is more likely to keep flying from treetop to treetop than to come down because it will not know HOW to fly down. (Same for an indoor flighted bird actually.) Flying down from a height is a skill that's learned, not innate, and it is how many, many birds are lost. No matter whether your bird is clipped or flighted, training is needed to provide the most safety outside possible. One of the most useful skills I trained with Carly was climbing down out of a tree. Before she had good skills to fly down all the way she could scale down a 50 ft tree just like a monkey. It's something I highly recommend for people with clipped or flighted birds with no outdoor flying experience. Camping out at the bottom of a tree is a very inefficient way to retrieve a bird! ("Treecrawls" are taught using target training -- training the bird to come and touch your hand or a target stick. Easy to train, and greys love swinging through branches. I taught it using only the lower 6 ft on a thick pine tree.) The model Tui's owner was following was someone who was not a professional free-flight trainer and whose method is not endorsed by any professional trainers I know. There are no shortcuts. None. Flighted or not. It takes a lot of dedication to train for outdoor flight, and it is a never-ending process that's definitely not for everyone. But if you want a bird to be retrievable from an escape, it's a delusion to think that clipping alone is the answer. I've seen too many lost and/or dead birds without flight feathers. Andrew (Tui's owner) has a great article in the current issue of Good Bird Magazine by the way, on both preventing and dealing with lost birds. Links here: http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=62 . He has done a very good job of helping make Tui's loss a learning experience for everyone. raz<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/08/07 03:44

kittykittykitty wrote: Ummm.... yeah, that's how birds generally get around. They can also fly back to you, which is the point of flight and recall training. Clipped birds can and do fly away too by the way. Check out one of the parrot lost and found sites and see how many are clipped. Carly could easily fly a couple hundred yards when she had a severe clip -- very fast, and with absolutely no control over direction, turning or landing. Personally, I am more secure having a bird flighted and trained rather than clipped and handicapped outdoors. At least a flighted bird isn't sitting prey for cats or dogs which would normally be the fate of a clipped bird if it isn't recovered.<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/08/07 00:47

Her RHG wanted to keep her. The condo manager intervened and insisted they look for the owner. She's the one who did all the calling, and actually drove Carly out to the veterinarian couple's house. I'm terribly grateful to her!

or... "The Mystery of the Red-headed Man" Carly and I had one of those instant-aging experiences this weekend, all starting with her obsession with Red-headed guys (RHGs). Carly went into full-force femalehood this spring and became obsessed with red-headed guys when we were out. She would want to sit on them (sometimes half an hour before I pulled her away) and literally gazed up into their eyes, nibbled on their ears, wanted head scratches. Then when we would walk away she would often fly right back relentlessly. I had to be careful to keep an eye out for them, and really watch her behavior carefully when she was out flying to see if she was getting into that “mood shift” because it was a hard pattern to break once it got started. I also kept her doing shorter flyabouts and treated frequently for just staying with me and doing little tricks. We also did lots of short A-B recalls with the RHGs that she found, so she could interact with them in a more healthy way. And it had subsided a lot over the last month…. until Friday. The short version is: Carly fell in love with a red-headed guy that she spotted while flying over a condo pool area by the beach this weekend, flew down and glommed onto him, and within half an hour she was en route to some veterinarians' house 20 miles away while I searched and called and put up posters for the next 6 hours. Details and discussion of training challenge! http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=64 Anyone else have a Grey who gets infatuated with certain kinds of people? I deliberately exposed Carly to many different people at a very young age so that she wouldn't become the infamous 1-Person Bird. Now I'm almost envious when I hear someone tell me about a bird they know who "will only go to one person." Her friendliness is endearing, but also a danger we will have to deal with in training.<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/08/06 00:09

Be sure to do the training right and not rush the process. It's much harder to undo fear of a something like a harness or crate once they've been forced to use one. There's a link to a good article on harness training here: http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=60 raz

It is nothing to do with bravery, believe me. If I had any fears that she would fly away I would not do this at all. It's all about lots and lots of training, preparation, and practice. If it was a matter of bravely facing fears of a flyoff, that would be a sure sign that the training is not in place as good as it should be. And it's not a casual type of training either -- it's borderline obsession! That's why I would never recommend it for everyone. This is from Sid Price's training blog: http://avianambassadors.com/BirdTraining But even with an outdoor flighted bird, you know what my biggest fear with her is? That she will suddenly fall ill like so many captive birds do. I just don't want anyone to think it's about bravery -- then someone will come along who IS brave (and/or foolish), decide to try it without the proper training, and be at huge risk of losing a bird.<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/06/16 20:33

danmcq wrote: That's interesting; I hadn't seen that before. There is some good advice in there. It's dated 2004 however, and there are a few things I'd like to point out that are normally done differently by professional trainers. [ol] [li]Never, ever, toss a bird to get it to fly. Positive reinforcement training is all about gaining a bird's trust and empowering him to make his own decisions. It's different if the bird has been trained for this like a game, and clearly "allows" himself to be put in a position to be tossed, and returns for more. But it's a bad way to encourage confidence when a bird is unwilling. [/li] [li]Training a really reliable recall will usually require some food management. This can be as little as reserving a favorite treat only for training sessions, but more typically will require timing the sessions so they are right before meals (which means no free-feeding in between. In my experience this is a much healthier way to feed and maintain a healthy appetite for a broad, balanced diet also.)[/li] [li]The owner of the mailing list mentioned in the article actively discourages training anything but baby birds now. They are focused on training very young, unweaned birds and relying partly on the so-called "baby bond." It's an unecessarily dangerous way to train (there are so many factors one needs to be skilled at for hand-feeding and proper weaning and socialization) and of course does nothing for the birds you already own. Good training is good training; you don't need to risk a young bird's physical and mental health by attempting to hand feed and wean him yourself. [/li] [/ol] There's a guest post on my blog about this last subject by Barbara Heidenreich (well-known zoo trainer and educator): Barbara Heidenreich on Weaning & the Baby Bond (http://http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=49) and also one by one of the best breeders of greys and macaws in the country, Wendy Craig: So You Want to Buy an Unweaned Baby Bird? (http://http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=47) rz<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/06/12 02:54

danmcq wrote: You will be amazed at how much regular training helps improve both flight skills and confidence. The training routine itself becomes a kind of security. And if you progress gradually to increasing levels of difficulty they just get more and more confident. Flying down from heights is always going to be a difficult one. It's the one big sticking point when it comes to safety for birds that are not outdoor fliers, if they escape. If you can do it safely, I found doing recalls (or targeting to a stick) in small trees to be very helpful. Especially so for greys I think, as many like to crawl around and hang on twigs. It certainly gave Carly a lot more confidence when she landed in a tall tree for the first time. She just started crawling down. We only practiced in a small pine on branches 4-6 ft off the ground, but she knew exactly what to do when she was 50 ft up a eucalyptus tree. Be sure to do this on a harness however, and make sure it's clipped securely to your belt!

Thanks -- not sure what happened to the link text. I've corrected it in the original post.

Yet another of the many marketing scams on the internet these days targeting the companion parrot audience. This one claims to be a review of several parrot training courses. http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=50 [link corrected]<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/06/11 01:12

Some of you might find this interesting as well, a certain person talking about the advantages of marketing to a small, naive, niche market like parrot owners: http://productlaunchformula.com/case3/ No professional trainer I know would even have time for something like this. They are too busy teaching and training. rz

lovemyGreys wrote: A professional trainer and educator I know, who has worked for zoos for almost 20 years, says that their claim to have been educated by "zoos around the world" is utter b.s. No one in the zoo world has even heard of them. I have been training Carly for almost 2 years, and flying her outside for over a year. I am so proud of how well she does, even when she has to think fast "on the wing". But I would never put myself out there as an expert. I learn from experts, and I have documented how I did Carly's training -- including the sources of training information and advice I used -- but training one bird, even if done well, is a long way from broad experience. That's why I keep posting my list of training resources -- so people know there is REAL information out there, by seasoned pros and scientists. And it doesn't come with an advertisement saying "Easy Training Secrets!!" raz Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/05/28 01:01<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/05/28 01:03

This is the latest version of the Birdtricks "animal rights" press release, from PRWeb.com. This was released after the incident with Tui: Birdtricks.com has shown clipping causes severe emotional damage?? (Their new research division?) Guilt-tripping people into trying to freefly their bird, especially using the unweaned baby bird method, in my opinion borders on a disgusting disregard of ethics. Also, this part of their press release explicitly states that the Cressi videos Andrew watched are intended to teach people how to freefly their bird, contrary to claims that they are just posted to show what they have done: This all just makes me sick. I am all for keeping birds flighted, but it is unethical in the extreme to advocate outdoor flight for everyone on the grounds that not doing so is animal cruelty. Pushing people to do this whose birds are not ready for it, or who may not be up for it themselves, will result in losses -- THAT is animal cruelty. I wrote a bit on my blog about freeflying as enrichment( http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=36 ) I think word needs to get out there -- wherever these so-called press releases appear -- that freeflight is NOT the way for the vast majority of people to do this. raz<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/05/28 18:32

Here is a link to this weekend's photos of Carly at the beach: http://likambo.com/flyblog/?p=37 (There are also links there to many training resources, for recall, enrichment & behavior.) Here's a teaser :-)

I noticed someone mention the difficulty of training an adult parrot to accept a harness that goes over the head. I had the same problem with Carly -- that was the one sticking point. I eventually made my own harnesses that clip around the neck instead of going over the head. The one I like the most is simple to use but very hard to describe! I will try to get some photos of it and how it is put on. Quite easy to make from the nylon cord that is sold at places like REI by the yard. The Feather Tether also does not go over the head, but some don't like it because it's a bit heavier and clunky than the others. But it might be a good place to start with for training. raz p.s. I will reiterate the Shanlung Principle also: ALWAYS ATTACH THE LEASH TO YOU, don't just hold it or wrap it around your wrist. Once I tripped with Carly on my shoulder on a harness and I would definitely have let it loose as I fell forward.

Shanlung -- Yes, I respect that you were taking Tink to very different places. But I really I wouldn't have any hesitation taking Carly to the mountains, other than concerns about raptors (we have Coopers Hawks here that like wooded areas). We have been looking for some places nearby that are different terrain than the various beaches we frequent. I've seen her in many different spook situations and some scary chases (a few dozen ravens last time) and I've been impressed with how she reacts. She did some of her first big outdoor flights last year in a mountainous area of Wyoming with gorgeous green hillsides and steep valley dropoffs. That said, she's the only grey I've ever had, and I can't speak for others' experiences. Certainly the spook factor and how they react is something that people should take VERY seriously if they are considering outdoor flying. I wasn't in any way saying you should do this with Tinkerbell (especially now that you only see her periodically). I was just speculating that she may be more capable than you give her credit for. I realize she did have a fly-off when you were first starting, and I can totally understand you having no interest in either of you having to go through that again. BTW, for those of you who don't know the history, Tinkerbell was the original inspiration for me and Carly. Loving the outdoors as I do, seeing Tinkerbell in the hills of Taiwan I just had to find a way to let Carly experience those things too. :-) This does NOT mean that you can't enrich your Grey's life tremendously in other ways. Simply going on walks with your bird on a harness is something I can highly recommend; we did that a lot before her feathers grew back in, and I still use it when we're on outings around town. Just remember the Shanlung Principle: always ATTACH the leash to YOU with something secure like a caribiner! Do not just hold the end of the leash. Something that startles your bird could easily startle you too. As an example of how automatic that is for me when we leave the house in the morning, I have sometimes decided to leave her at home but when I get to my car I discover I have her leash caribinered to my belt anyway. It should become that automatic! There are some good harness training articles out there by the way, such as this one by Barbara Heidenreich: http://www.parrotchronicles.com/2005/features/harness/harness.htm If you're interested in using one be sure to start off right with this kind of training so it's not a battle to put it on every time. raz

Hi Shanlung! I can't say enough about the value of patience and practice, practice, practice. It even helps lessen the frequency and severity of spooks, and how they respond when they do. I think more than anything else, what has made the biggest impression on me from the training we did was how much composure she shows now, both in not spooking at many things, and in her response to fly right back when she does. You know, I really think there would have been no problem when Tinkerbell spooked back in December if she'd had more experience flying in, around, and down from tall trees. That's not something you want to do on a harness of course. But I bet if she was flying without one and was used to those environments, she would be just fine, at least when you were there working with her every day. You were so diligent with her training. So glad she is back home and doing fine! raz

Hi -- I have a grey, Carly, who has been flying outdoors for about a year now, and we live with three other macaws who have been freeflying for several years (Otis, Gizmo, and Annie.) PLEASE do not try this without learning a lot about training methodology first, and having an experienced trainer to guide you one-on-one. These videos are a very dangerous example to follow. In my opinion they proceed far too rapidly into new situations, rely far too much on the "baby bond" (which is temporary at best), and advocate getting pre-weaned babies which is dangerous for anyone inexperienced in hand-feeding and weaning. Here's a link to more info on flight training and general operant conditioning methods: http://likambo.com/flyblog/?page_id=30 There is also an article about Carly's flight training in the Spring 2008 issue of Barbara Heidenreich's Good Bird magazine http://www.goodbirdinc.com. It's a great source for learning about positive reinforcement training in general. These are not my personal ideas, but methods that have been developed by professionals over many decades. They are not "secret," and if anyone uses the words "easy" or "fast" in their advertising, beware. I heard a webcast of Chet Womach recently and I was astonished at the lack of depth of knowledge, as well as misinformation. Several leading trainers in the country expressed to me the same concerns. One bird on this list has already been lost as a result of YouTube videos. Freeflight is not something to be undertaken lightly, no matter how easy videos may make it look. Best wishes. Raz & Carly<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2008/05/24 00:47

I just wanted to express my deepest condolences for your loss of Tui. It's true though that birds are located often weeks after going missing, so it is still possible she will turn up especially given how tame she is. I wanted to ask you if I could post a link to your video on my web site. I have a free-flighted African Grey that I trained for many months and was fortunate to have the assistance of some good experienced trainers, both in person and over the internet. During this time I came to know several of the top trainers in the professional world who were invaluable resources. There is information about the kind of training I did on the site, along with many warnings to not make the transition outdoors without a very solid training plan and interaction with an experienced trainer. What you experienced is far too common -- flying down heights and flying in wind are two of the most critical skills that new outdoor flier have to contend with, and are probably the biggest causes of losses. I don't say this to reprimand at all. I have been especially dismayed by the appearance on YouTube of freeflight videos which in my opinion greatly underestimate the patience and practice necessary to train freeflight safely. They also assert that the "bond" your bird has with you in freeflying is the only criteria. While it is important, it is at most only HALF the equation. In addition, learning by video has to be the most risky of all methods because the videos show only the pretty stuff and there is no opportunity to learn interactively. If you would not mind, I would like to put a link to your last video on my site so that others can see how serious it is to not undertake this kind of thing without having an experienced trainer at hand who understands the process of solid recall training. Perhaps you can think of it as a gift from Tui to other parrots and parrot owners so they don't have to go through this. Again, so, so sorry for your loss. I hope it is only temporary and that you'll be reunited soon. Sincerly, Raz & Carly Lu Info about our training here: http://likambo.com/flyblog

Wendy Craig is one of the best breeders in the country, in how she handles, raises and fledges her birds. They are incredibly sociable and confident when they get to their new homes. She specializes in several of the very endangered macaw species, and also Greys! In fact she has a bumper crop of Timnehs this year. I live with two of her Red-fronted Macaws, and know several other people with birds from her and everyone thinks they are just awesome. She will also give you all the help in the world if you have questions going into getting a new bird. She's at http://www.wendysparrots.com raz p.s. She's in Texas, near Dallas, but I have friends all over the country with her babies, including Delaware, Minnesota, and the Virgin Islands.<br><br>Post edited by: carlylu, at: 2007/07/18 02:25