Acappella

Re: the first vet. Who does he think he is, the Wizard of Oz whom no one can speak to directly! I'm the first one to give somebody the benefit of the doubt, knowing everyone has a bad day that might spill over into their interations with the public, but the fact that it was the same tech both times suggests there's a bigger problem here. If she dropped the crate with Echo inside of it she should have been disciplined at the very least, if not fired or suspended. Our animals are traumatized enough just going into a vet's office. Being oblivious to a bird's well-being to protect her own ego is very nearly unforgiveable. I might not have been able to stop myself from going over, picking her up and dropping her! Good for you for keeping your temper and making Echo's immediate health and safety your first priority. Just as Dan said, I would be very tempted to go after that office for your expenses. Send him a registered letter, marked Private and Confidential, explaining everything that happened and giving him the benefit of the doubt that perhaps he wasn't fully informed about everything that happened. I might even give him a reasonable time frame during which you will wait to hear back from him, with a politely worded phrase like, If I don't hear from you (not his office staff or his techs) during this time, I may unfortunatly have to pursue other options ro resolve my situation. As for your little grey baby, I hope this is his last vet visit for a long time! I know you don't feel safe putting him on an open playstand, but what about a smaller enclosed cage on a stand that he could stay in just to be with you if you're going to be in a room other than the one where his normal cage is. I have such a cage, which I intended to use for a sleep cage, but right now it works well if I want to take Dorian outside with me or upstairs for a couple of hours. It's big enough for him to have a good stretch in, but small enough I can pick it up and move it with him in it (although that's not his favourite experience!) Anyway, cyber hugs from me to you, and cyber kisses to Echo. Hope you all have a very good weekend!

Well, this morning I was brushing my cat Jac's coat (long hair shedding nightmare). When I get to his back leg 'pants' and his tail, he always starts whining, like he's undergoing some slow torture. When he starts I tell him "oh stop!" This morning the whining began and from the peanut gallery I hear "oh stop" Now for the whole morning he's been stuck in an "oh stop, ooops, what cha doing?" loop!

I agree with the others, if it's for ID purposes look into micro chipping. The bands at this point will feel very strange to your birds, and there have been cases of the split rings getting caught and causing dangerous situations. Good luck with the new member of your flock!

Hello. Dorian is also in a carpeted room. My solution to the poop problem was to buy heavy clear vinyl (I got mine here in Canada at a fabric store) The vinyl makes clean-up easy, and because it's clear it doesn't really interfere with the rooms' look. Mind you, as he gets less and less cage bound we've had a few accidents, but your guy will probably not want to get too far away from his safe cage for a while, by which time you might have your own place.

Stacey, does Jackie get baths? It helps a great deal with itching and with their dust. Lots of great threads here with tips about bathing.

Even though we watched Dorian closely when he was in the pet store, we'd inevitably turn our back or go into the office for a second to come out and see someone poking something at/into his cage. I know that's a big reason he was so hand shy, and is still terrified of sticks. Maybe ask the maintenance people if anything they did seemed to scare him, explaining how easily greys can be startled. I hope he settles after a full nights sleep. btw Dorian loves the vacuum when it's in the same room with him. It's when someones' bumping it around on the floor above him, and he can't see what's happening, that he freaks out.

Just do everything normally, don't react to the growling in a way that he may see as getting extra attention, or he may persist for that reason. Other people should also not make a fuss, just walking by his cage saying hi to him and keep on going. Have your normal routine. If he's more fearful let him stay where he feels safe, like his cage, but with the freedom to come out if he wants. He'll soon figure out things are back to normal. I had to leave Dorian in the house with the cleaning lady yesterday, even though I know the sound of the vacuum upstairs still scares him. When I came home, about an hour after she left, he was shaking a bit but I just carried on normally and he calmed down.

I understand your point about being able to fly to keep her from drowning in the ocean, I really do. After all, if an open toilet is a hazard . . . I just ask you to consider this. Greys are not distance flyers and if she fatigues too far from the boat or loses her way and can't find you, she will surely drown. You will just be saved from possibly watching it happen. I do not mean this as an attack in any way. The concerned reaction to your post is only a reflection of the love we have for all these animals, even ones we'll never meet. It's natural, as a parent or parront, to think up the absolute worst case scenario because then we can take every possible step to stop it from happening. Every decision we make leads irrevocably to a certain outcome. Better to possibly re-consider a decision now, than suffer a possibly avoidable outcome later. You're clearly as in love with your bird as we all are and are trying to give her an interesting and enriching life as your companion. I'm glad to read her cut is healing. Be well.

I'm sorry for your worry and pain over this baby and the breeder you got it from. Others have given great advice, I can only add this. How big is the community you live in, how close and well-known is the breeder, do pet stores deal with this breeder? The reason I ask is: I live in a VERY small community where everyone knows everyone, and this comes in handy when looking for fair treatment. Before I posted anything about this breeder I would try once more to get them to cover some of your expenses, using your ability to 'spread the word' about them via all the sources others have mentioned to give you some leverage. As upset as I know you are, and have every right to be, try not to be confrontational or threatening, just state your position and the recourse you may have to take in a matter-of-fact manner. If you find you have no legally actionable leverage in your state, admit that up front and appeal to the breeders greed in terms of future sales and professional reputation. Once you 'blacklist' there's no going back and no hope of any kind of justice for your situation, and I would only do this in the spirit of warning others not to find themselves in the same situation you are experiencing. Sorry if this is too much along the lines of 'you catch more flies with honey than vinegar' line, but I've worked in customer service, and lived and worked and shopped in a small community most of my life. Only you know how unreasonable a person this breeder comes across as, and whether this strategy stands a chance. Good luck with this, and with seeing your baby through his health crisis. Please keep us updated on how the baby and you are doing.

I give Dorian the occasional peanut, but roasted, for people, and not in the shell. I shell them so I can see that the inside of the shell looks normal. I always pick out peanuts in the shell that come in his food mix. Some of them already look dodgy on the outside, I'm not letting my baby get to them. Ditto for almonds. The ones in the food mix don't look great to me. As for perches, I defer to other forum members. I'm getting him prepared for a change in perch position and material, as the one he spends most of his time on is a wood dowel and I know that's not good for his feet. Change comes very slowly in this house! Dorian's favourite treat is half a walnut, which I open to look at it before he gets it. I'm trying to interest him in Nutriberries because I want a treat I use only during training, but so for he's not interested! Ditto for pine nuts, but I keep trying. btw Congrats on the addition to your family. Enjoy.

"he has gone quiet and that does worry me as he never normally shuts up" Has he stopped eating? If the only option right now is junk food or no food he has to eat something. If he hasn't stopped eating and/or his behaviour continues to be unusual I would suggest a fast vet visit. Greys hide health problems so well that by the time we notice a change they can be very sick. Please update the situation as soon as you can.

Dorian is from the story by Oscar Wilde called "The Picture of Dorian Grey". I've always loved the story, and the idea behind it, so when my little monkey came with his name, luckily I liked it. I wonder what would happen if I had a portrait painted of him and put it in my attic? Then again, he's already getting away with evil behaviour, so what's the point?:silly: <br><br>Post edited by: Acappella, at: 2008/06/07 20:11

Thank goodness you were home. I've heard that scream once and it's horrible. When Dorian was still in the pet store I was working a shift and I heard him scream. He'd gotten a talon caught in some fringe from his swing. That's the day I knew he really trusted me 'cause even though he was in a panic he let me get in to free him. Glad your baby wasn't too traumatized. Now you just have to deal with your trauma from this experience!

Re: the dust, Dorian gets a spray bath every couple of days with aloe juice, and at night I turn on an air cleaner near his cage. I just cleaned the filters yesterday and from that very dusty experience I can say with confidence the air cleaner cuts down on the dust a great deal. If you have carpet both the dust and the poop (and the fact that they throw food everywhere) can be more of an issue. I find myself doing a good vacuum every day. Hardwood or tile flooring would make keeping things clean easier. Re: your partner, ever hear the saying "It's better to ask forgiveness than permission?" Mind you, this is coming from someone not currently in a relationship, so take it for what it's worth!

Man, the things that get started around here when I don't log on for a couple of days. Oh well. If I'd said 'shy' instead of closet, look at all the fun we would have missed. p.s. Dave, you are still a goofball, and you are totally to blame for this going off topic!!!:silly:

I don't work at a pet store and I still have talked at least two couples out of buying a grey! I was looking at a young female grey and overheard people talking about buying her and so I, of course, pipe in and tell them I own one (we all know he really owns me!) Anyway, the first question is, of course, does he talk? So I tell them he does, but explain how he's a secret talker, as many greys are from what I've learned here and from other reading. Then I cheerfully started describing how much work they are, how much mess they create, the money for toys, food, the trouble finding an avian vet. All said with humour, of course, but I got my point across. Just lucky there was no staff around! To be fair I've always found staff who deal with the birds at this particular store are really excellent and really do know their stuff. I wish there was some way to make every single person who is about to buy a pet bird first read the 'Bill of Rights' posted on this forum. I think it would weed out most impulse buyers with more disposable income than common sense. btw, I fell in love with Dorian before he ever said a word in front of me. He's a classic closet talker, the opposite of a performing bird, so he'd never say a word when people were in the store. Actually, one of the things I hear him say sometimes is "Does he talk?" because he heard it so often in the store.

Matt, I'm so sorry for your loss. Max was obviously very loved. You know that you were a loving and attentive friend to him and you did all within your power to make his life happy, so please don't expend any energy on any 'what if's' that may be going through your mind. Thank you for sharing your vets' findings with us. Sad as it is, it helps all of us grey owners to expand our understanding of these precious souls. When you're ready, there's another grey baby out there waiting for you to love it. Be well.

I found 100% aloe juice in a health food store, others have found it in a dept store like WalMart in the pharmacy section.

It sounds to me as if you've made a carefully considered decision thinking about what will be best for your birds, which is what all of us try to do. I don't have any insight about housing two birds together as I only have Dorian and don't intend to get another bird (hear that, me, no more birds, no more birds, no more birds, no more birds!!! :unsure: )

Madisimmons' advise works with Dorian, who has a terrible sense of balance when he's perched on me. He doesn't like me holding both feet with my thumb but will let me trap one at a time to keep him stable. I've heard this called the Egyption pose. Birds don't like to climb down and by keeping your upper arm tight against the body, bent straight up at the elbow and hand/fingers held parallel to the floor, down is the only way to go. I still have to walk around very slowly, but I hope as he feels more confidant I'll get back to walking like a normal human! Sounds like you're having a great time getting to know Bingo. Enjoy!

Nasy, I'm so sorry about your loss. It leaves such a hole in your life when a loved pet dies. Do you know what ultimately was the cause of death? I would want to know for sure that there was nothing toxic in the environment before I brought in a new bird, they are so sensitive. Even the most pampered and well cared for bird, as I'm sure your Cookie was, can get hold of something dangerous. Another member here almost lost their bird from metal poisoning which they think came from playing with the zipper on a pillow. Knowing the cause of death would help to ease your mind, I think. For sure you'd have to very thoroughly disinfect every cage and toy. Sorry if this is too much info too soon because I know your family is grieving. Again, I'm sorry for your loss. Marguerite and Dorian

If you have the time and the personality to take in a 'second hand' bird then I would encourage you to do it. Like others said, one of them may be out there just waiting for you specifically. Dorian definately choose me as his buddy long before his owners even decided to sell him. Phone the people advertising an adult parrot and ask if you can come over to meet it without committing to buy. Getting a bird with so-called issues is frustrating at time for sure, but it's also so rewarding to know that because of you an animal that could have had a tragic and lonely life will instead be loved and nurtured. I ordered a book recommended here called 'The Second Hand Parrot' When I read it I'll post and let everyone know what it's like.

Yes, that's a very good sign that she's getting more comfortable. Congrats! btw, (my) Dorian also trembles, don't worry.

As the others said, plucking is sometimes caused by physical problems, not always an emotional issue. If the vet gives him the all clear, then there are some great threads on this forum and lots of member support.

Nychsa, I know all of our birds are characters in their own way, but I'm starting to think Bella and Jiggy need their own show. Call it "Bella and Jiggy, UnRehearsed" with the humans in their proper place, as supporting cast. Does Animal Planet do reality tv?