Beak color in TAG

[SchroedersJen]

Before I post my question, I should mention that I am also looking forward to seeing what kind of entertaining comments Dan comes up with.

 

Ok So here goes boys and girls.....Schroeder is a TAG, and while his beak was never as lightly colored as most TAGS, is was definately a TAG beak. Lately, it seems to have been getting a lot darker. From across the room, It looks all black, up close it looks like a rich dark chocolate brown. To make sure I'm not going nuts, I looked at some old-newish pictures of him, and his beak is without a doubt much darker in the newer ones. He seems healthy and his diet has always been highly varied. He gets a lot of playtime outdoors and tons of exercise. Can anyone imagine what might be causing this? The avian vet didnt have a clue when I called. Said i should come in for a ton of expensive lab work. Before I shell out 500 bucks on a vet visit, I figured I should see if there is a reasonable explanation for this. Any ideas? Or do we think I just have a CAG in a TAGs body and tail?

[Eckobird]

Maybe Schroeder is a Timgo? Have you seen his parents before? I really can't answer your questions, hopefully someone can help. I know those vet bills are darn expensive, did the vet say the beak color changing could mean he is sick?

[SchroedersJen]

The vet had no clue what would be causing it, and while I have not seen Schroeder's parents, I do know the breeder and they arent shady. I did not know cags and tags would breed together, but it makes sense I gues.....if there are macaw hybrids, why not african greys too.....

[kittykittykitty]

Wish I knew about the beak color. I have seen reports of Timms and Congo mixes, but I have not seen one.:unsure:

[Eckobird]

Yea I didn't think they would breed together either but I have seen a couple of Timgos online. There is actually a member on here(Bikermol) that was talking about their Timgo the other day. Here is the intro of their Timgo.

http://www.greyforums.net/forums/welcome-&-introduction-room/109622-introducing-harry.html#109622

 

Maybe Bikermol will see this thread and tell you more about their bird.<br><br>Post edited by: caitb2007, at: 2009/06/04 17:47

[she]

Wow this is an interesting one. I do know cags and tags will bread resulting in timgos.I have no idea if this is what your bird is but why not talk to the breader and ask?

I cant think of anything that makes beaks change colour,You say he spends time outside,could he have a tan,sorry it sounds stupid but I cant think of anything else.:lol:

[SchroedersJen]

The breeder sold him as a timneh, i do work for them and have no reason to question their integrity. I did call the woman that has schroeders clutch mate this morning,she said that her bird looks like a normal timmy, so im doubting he is a mix.

[Dave007]

Only if the breeder you got the bird from says that he intentionally went through the trouble of mixing a CAG with a TAG, then theres no natural way that the two birds will naturally mate. It can be done artifically though. Very few breeders will try doing that because of the incubation timeline. TAGs mature at a faster rate than CAGs The breeder birds need to be allowed to bond with each other which isn't likely because of the great difference in personality, traits and habits. The incubation period plus the incubation time line is different. Mant CAGs can come out with darker feathers and also much lighter feathers. The same applies to TAGs. A TAG can have a very bright colored tail and lighter body feathers or a darker tail or no color at all. A CAG can have a very bright tail or a dull washed out colored tail and very dark feathering. It all hasto do with the genetics of the parents, grandparents and great grand parents.

 

You can compare that to amazons of which there's approx 15 types---a yellow naped amazon will not breed with a yellow crowned amazon even though they're almost identical other than the small amount of yellow coloring and placement of the yellow feathering. That applies to all amazons. Another example with amazons--a blue winged amazon wont breed with an orange winged amazon even though they're identical until the wing is partially lifted to see the slight blue and orange colors on the edge of the wings.

The reason that hardly any literature concerning greys isn't found is because it involves artifical incubation. Some eggs will hatch within 28 days. Other will hatch at 32 days and there's no way of telling what type of bird is in an egg.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/06/05 00:12

[judygram]

Its probably just an anomaly, I doubt the breeder went to all the trouble to cross a Tag with a Cag, my opinion of course, take it with a grain of salt but not the whole shaker.

[Char]

If your bird seems okay otherwise I would not worry about it. It is probably just an anomaly as Judy said. Look at all the red factor greys. They are not supposed to have red feathers but genetic things happen. I have learned that any little thing and the vets want to start running expensive tests even if your bird is fine. That is how they make their living. There is a reason why they call it "practicing" medicine.

[SchroedersJen]

Ok guys, thanks. At least now I know why other birds dont like Schroeder....He is freaky lookin j/k

[judygram]

It has nothing to do with his colors or that you think he is "freaky" looking, most greys do not like other birds, they don't even like most of their own species, that is a fact.

[danmcq]

Well Jen, I don't have any real entertaining comments for you ;-) .....other than to ask if there might be a can of black shoe polish near the cage.

 

The others have all given GreYt comments and thoughts. I follow the theory of others posts that it' just genetics with a vet visit not being require.

 

It would be interesting to see a photo of him with the lighter beak and now as it has become darker.

 

I will say in the many photos of TAGs I have seen, the beak varies greatly in how much of it is horn colored with some almost containing no black at all to others that only a small percentage of the beak is horn colored.

 

Here are a couple of examples:

 

 

<br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2009/06/05 15:49

[Luvparrots]

Hi Jen, if you look at Ana Grey's picture in my Avatar she has a very dark beak. Now it is more bone colored. If I didn't know better I would think they are two different greys. She has red on her tail. Her breeder said her great great grandfather/mother must have been a Congo. Who knows??? She is healthy and a great little lady and that is all that matters. Enjoy your handsome little anomaly!!!!! B)

[SchroedersJen]

Hey guys, thanks for the comments. I will take a new pic of SchroedE when he wakes up tomorrow. The dark ones I have are oldish and his beak has since gottewn darker. He does have a pretty vibrant tail. Not quite red, but much brighter than maroon. He is probably, as suggested, just a cute little anomaly So far as greys not liking other birds.....Schroeder LOVES other birds. Wants to gurge at first sight, snuggle and play.....other birds (even playful ones) want nothing to do with him. He must be a dork. Its ok, so is his papa......Not me though Nooooooooooooooooo. I will catch everyone tomorrow. thanks for the words of comfort. I'm sure my bank balance thanks everyone too.

[she]

Schroeder is one of a kind and a great bird he is gorgious.He also has a fantastic nature.

[TinyTimneh]

I would vote that it's just as difference like everyone else is saying.. especially if he's eating well and active and looks healthy.

Jacko for example has always had stunningly red tailfeathers, not the fire-engine red that you see on a CAG but like a crimson red. His beak is now getting darker as well. The only time his beak was really pale and his feathers were maroon coloured is when he was on a bad diet and didn't get a proper environment (usually).