Hi all Have a frustrating problem pls help

[cflanny]

Hey guys been awhile I have returned to work and my houshold has been crazy busy. Hope everyone is well

 

Let me start by saying ZZero is a angel 95% of the time, we have a great bond and he leads a very happy life. He is very cuddly a majority of his time and has started to purr everytime we are loving. He is usually very sweet with me and he tollerates my husband and son.

 

Heres my problem, ZZero is flighted and has started getting into everything which most of time is ok I have bird proofed and he has SEVERAL places to play and baskets everywhere that are his. There are a few places I do not want him to be and a couple things I do not want him to do. For example he has a play area on my coffee table, its basically became his lol. but he wants to bite the table so I ask nicely for him to stop. This starts a war of sorts he looks right at me and does it again and again and again. he becomes obsessed I have tried distracting him, being very patience and saying no many many many times finally when I go to pick him up and remove him he gets all big and trys to bite. I say No bite and it seems to make things worse he becomes a attack bird and in the last few days has flown at me with ill intentions.

 

This is just one example, it seems if I try to disipline him at all he changes and becomes very mean.The last 2 days when he gets like this I get very overwhelmed at how aggressive he becomes. Then the game starts where he flys away and I cant get him to step up. this is very frustrating What do I do when he flys away if I stay with him he just keeps running or getting more aggressive? How do I ask him not to do somthing??how do I react if he flys at me or bites me.I have read some things like no reaction at all but it seems like I cant just let him get away with these things?

 

I called my breeder for advice she has suggested cutting his wings just this once and have him depend on me more and "nock him down a few notches". This thought process makes sense to me but it just breaks my heart I never wanted to trim his wings, I want him to enjoy the one thing captivity didnt take away, flying was his god given right. I am very confused and need help. Thanks so much for any replys.<br><br>Post edited by: cflanny, at: 2009/02/26 04:05

[cflanny]

I should mention ZZero is 9 months old and in FULL molt has been for about a month.

 

Also the last 2 days he does this click with his beak sound like hes breaking somthing I have looked all in his mouth and see nothing abnormal wondering what this is?<br><br>Post edited by: cflanny, at: 2009/02/26 04:50

[rierie]

sounds to me like he is trying you just like a kid does..

 

the clicking is usually a way of them saying leave me alone or I will bite. a warning sign

 

I think I would try when he misbehaves to give him a time out in his cage..

 

I am sure someone with more experience will come along and give you some suggestions.

[cflanny]

We have done the time out in the cage but now I cant catch him he just runs.... only when he knows hes doing somthing I dont want him to do. Its like he knows and says "HAHAHA I control you and can do what I want!"

but most of the time step up and cage time are not problems just when I ask him not to do somthing ARRGHHH

 

Thank you for your reply

[jhhuhma]

My bird is actually doing somthing very similar, he is 6 months as well, When he has somthing in his beak he does not want me to take he runs back and forth on the back of the couch just out of my reach, I can tell you for me I don't give up I always end up getting it back no matter how long I have to chase him, he has acted with a little aggression as if he may bite me, I scold him and tell him very sternly NO BITE, the only thing I have going for me now is that even if he is across the room if I say NO,NO he looks at me and tries a few more times, I respond with the same NO,NO and sometimes he will get the hint and stop, and sometime I see the look of I'm gonna do it cuz I want to and then the chase is on. I think like with kids you just cannot let them win. I don't think clipping his wings is the answer especially since I can tell you really don't want to, he is just testing the boundries and you just have to as my breeder told me take the hit if it comes, show no reaction and continue being firm. He will soon learn you are the boss.

[Lyric]

They do go through phases like this as they are maturing and I know it can be frustrating. One thing I'd recommend is trying distraction techniques. When he begins to misbehave get something he finds irresistable and trick him by changing his focus to something else. Get a few toys and have them handy just for this purpose. Distract him with something as you have him step up, and while he is still looking at whatever you are holding, whisk him away to his cage. My 4 month old TAG absolutely hates going back inside her cage- I have found she is totally obsessed with pine nuts or other nuts. In order to get her back inside I distract her by feeding her pine nuts while I get her back into the cage.

When Lyric was going through one of his phases I discovered he was getting very territorial about the back of our sofa. He'd get there and be having so much fun that he'd get very aggressive whenever I had to get him back into his cage. I would have to wrap my hand in a towel and get him to step up on that- otherwise he'd bite hard enough to draw blood. I stopped letting him hang out there and kept him to places where I knew he'd be better behaved. After a time he eventually got better- they do mature and get better with time and patience. Hang in there and don't be a stranger on the forum, I was wondering where you'd been!

[SchroedersJen]

When Schroeder is bad, I start folding sheets. He is not fond of me doing anyting with sheets and will generally climb up on to my shoulder to cuddle and distract me from the evil sheets. If I am not holding him, he will fly to me and demand to go on the shoulder. Then he preens my hair, kisses me, rubs his head agains my cheek. Honestly, I think he's a bit slow, but it seems to be working out to my benefit. It is just unfortunate that your bird is not retarded like mine and has figured out how to play mind games. Good luck.

[Jane08]

I am not a fan of clipping a bird just because he has some issues that can be fixed other ways. We were given this advice when we got Rangi as he wouldn't bond with my boyfriend and would bite him. I am so glad we didn't clip. We worked on the problem instead which took a long time, but was well worth it and worked. I do feel sometimes people want a quick fix which clipping is, instead of taking months (yes months) to work on the problem.

 

Cflanny your bird is still young and this is exactly what they do at this age, test the boundaries, this is totally normal. Both of our greys have been through stages of testing us (ours are just over 1 and 2).

 

You are doing exactly the right thing when he bites the table take him off, if he tries to bite use a stick to move him off. Another option is to move the playstand to somewhere he can't bite the table. Always think about alternatives and moving things out of their reach is always a good option until they learn.

 

Do not run after him when he flies off, just ignore him, this is a huge game for greys, our male was master at it until he learnt we would not play it with him.

 

If he flies at you to bite, put your hand up for him to land on and immediately put him on a perch say don't bite and walk off/turn your back on him. Rangi also tried this one on and sometimes still does. He flies to me and lands, nips me and flies off. Now I am aware of the times he might try this so I make sure he lands on my hand and I put him back on the perch and explain to him he can only come and sit on me if he doesn't bite.

 

This will take time and patience but if you are consistent it will work.

 

You could even try some training which really worked for us. Just random training sessions with favourite treats. The training can be anything, step up, fetch a ball etc.

[daveyj]

well cflanny you read what my problem with Alfie was and what happend next Anyway if hes in a full molt i would clip him to calm him down and he will need your help more than before to get around plus if hes in a full molt he will be flighted well before Alfie and maybe he will have learnd to respect you more by then:)

[danmcq]

I agree with Jane08.

 

Clipping your Grey will not stop the natural phases of maturing, learning boundaries, becoming rebellious (wait till the 2's!) testing you and also just letting you know they have their own thoughts, wants and desires.

 

What this means is, if you clip his wings. The only thing that will change is he can not escape as readily and will be more dependant upon you for movement around the house to some extent.

 

I know it's a pain, but clipped or not, they all go through these personality changes as they grow, learn and mature. Even clipped there will be times they will bite the crap out of you. Such as, they have something they do not want to give up, they are somewhere they do not want to move from etc.

 

The only thing you can do is remain consistent, calm in your responses and do the same thing 20 times in one hour if you need to letting him know your mind and rules are not changing.

 

Remember that they feel your emotions. If you get upset and angry, they feel that an wil protect themselves from such a dangerous threatening emotion.

 

As stated by others. When you can use a distraction to get your Grey to do what you want it to, do do. If you must remove him from where he is, either use the back of your tightened hand to force a step up or a perch. Just don't give up and follow through everytime.<br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2009/02/27 18:57

[cflanny]

Thank you guys so much. I am still just alittle confused if he plays the get away game do I stay consistent and make him step up (i.e. Chase him) or do I wait for him to calm by turning my back then go back to the step up?

 

I truley do understand what you guys are saying and it makes so much sense somtimes its hard to impliment ( birds are definatly not dogs lol) but I am gonna take more breathers to calm myself, I do find myself getting upset and emotional when these things happen. I will not let him hurt my feelings and I feel much better knowing these are stages and everyone has gone thru them, I will not take it personal

 

Thanks again everyone )

[danmcq]

If he's good/angel 95% of the time. You have been doing great and so has he!

 

In regards trying to stop him from biting the coffee table, you probably can't. It just frustrates him that he is allowed there, therefore it is OK to do what ever he wishes there. There is no way to differentiate between the two. The only way you could try and stop that would be to make that coffee table off-limits and put him on a playstand close by instead. You will have to remove him a million times, but if thats what you wish to do, then do it. One thing to consider, to them wood is wood. If they can chew on all the wood toys, wood perches etc. then they can chew on any wood....

 

Same with paper, They chew on paper, magazines are paper, notepads, phonebooks, important documents, books etc. it is all fair game to them and allowed. Therefore they do not believe they are doing anything wrong if you get upset because it's just that piece of paper or wood they can not chew up.

 

Yes, chasing you Grey is a game to them, it's really BIG FUN, unless they are flying because they are frightened, then it's not a game and they are fleeing for safety sake and if that is the case, they wil eventually bite the crap out of you if you get them cornered and persist.

 

If they attack and bite as you are asking. Get them off of you and get them in a cage, close the door and walk away completely out of sight and leave them for a while. Do this over and over each time it happens.

 

Your right, you going through what the normal process has been for most of us and your bird is just being the intelligent glorious bird he was born to be. :-)