Hi...need help w/feather biting,PLZ

[SarahsFlock]

Hi, Just found your forum and have checked out a few sections and found it helpful. Thanks. We need help!

 

We have a 7 mo. old Congo African Grey female, Sarah. She's pretty sweet, very brave, plays well with toys, etc. Since the holidays, she has gone from normal preening to more aggressive feather biting. She's already cleared a patch on her breast, and messed up shoulder and tail feathers. We know it's urgent to try and figure this out before it's habit for life.

 

She had a vet check in Nov. and vet said she was healthy. We consulted with her breeder, who is very experienced and helpful. She checked her out and said she looked healthy. She suggested distracting her with noise/action when she bites feathers. Also, adding a branch of Eucalyptus for her to prune, more shred toys, and a daily bath (vs. 1-2 per week). She also suggested chamomille tea or even a tiny bit of Children's benadryl to calm her down if it seemed she was hyper. She said for us to give her more time -- we already have her out with us most of the day -- so we now take her with us on our walks. Nothing is helping!

 

On your forum, we read about spraying the bird with 100% aloe vera juice. So yesterday we bought some and started that too. If it's going to help, would it start helping right away? So far, nothing helps... actually after shower and spray she preens more and vigorously.

 

We've had birds/parrots previously but this is our first Grey. This problem is very frustrating to deal with because she's such a pretty bird and we can see where this is headed. Please... if you have a method that might work or if you can refer us to a good book/website, etc., it would be greatly appreciated.

 

Sincerely, Sarah's flock<br><br>Post edited by: SarahsFlock, at: 2009/01/18 22:00

[she]

Hi and welcome.

Has anything changed at all since the plucking started.I noticed it began over the holidays when most house holds are anything but normal.I dont put a tree up in the room where my grey is because I know it would upset him. Also People tend to have more visitors,stay up later, re decorate, any thing like this can be the cause .If you haven ot consuled an avian vetabout this problem I sugest it would be a good idea to rule out any sickness.Although most plucking is due to stress sometimes illness can be a cause.I also see that you have started taking the bird on walks, could this be stressing her. I would never give any medication to any animal without a vet prescribing it.I would not give benadryl

My advise is to think of any changes in routine or environment and consult an avian vet.

[LisaM]

Welcome - I'm glad you found this site. It has been super helpful so many times for me. When you get a chance drop a note in the Welcome Room and tell us a bit more about you and Sarah. And we always love pictures! And actually that may help with this situation also if we could see where she is doing the damage.

 

Did you get any new decorations for Christmas that are now displayed by her? Any burning of candles during the holidays or since? New pots/pans? Anything in the house that wasn't there before the holidays?

 

Is she just chewing on the feathers or is she plucking them out also? Does she bite/pluck only while in her cage or does she do it anywhere she happens to be?

 

Just trying to think through the questions I would be asking myself it it were happening with Kenya.

 

Is the vet a specialized avian vet? As your visit was before the holidays, I would bring her back in to see them. I would definitely NOT give the benadryl unless your vet agrees with that approach.

 

I'm sure someone with experience and knowledge will answer with some more ideas!

 

 

Lisa

[SarahsFlock]

Thanks for your reply. Let me see if I can fill in a few blanks. First-- we haven't used Benadryl, it was just one of many suggestions made. We have been using the 100% Aloe and a little Chamomille tea.

 

There were several likely stressors during the holiday. Here are a few: We had houseguests for about 11 days, including kids (but they stayed away from Sarah). On one of our overnight trips, Sarah spent the night in the house of elderly folks who kept the heat up. And, Sarah's main human was involved in a project that did cut into his one-on-one time with her (I tried to fill in but I don't think it satisfied her).

 

To answer your questions: We did not have decoration in or near her main space, and only minimal stuff anywhere. We don't burn candles, and don't have any new pots/pans. Nothing new in the house. She is biting the feathers, not pulling them out. She does it wherever she is (not just in her cage). She was a bit vigorous with preening from the time we got her about 4 months ago, but now she bites the feathers more than preens them.

 

Her diet is a combination of Zupreem pellets and fresh foods (a mix from the breeder and some added broccoli or other veggies). We give her a couple of peanuts and a walnut daily and a little popped corn. I made her toys to shred (cotton) and she has wood toys and plastic toys -- and she plays well. She really seems to enjoy the walks, she is inside of an acrylic cage, not outside, but she looks around at the scenery... and she willingly steps into the cage to go with us.

 

She seems to be getting worse, the more we try to figure this out. We found an avian vet, highly thought of, and that is where we had her initial exam. Since we (& the breeder) seem to think this is psychological vs. physical, we were trying to isolate the cause at home. But-- we will discuss the investment in another visit.

 

Thank you for caring enough to respond!

[LisaM]

With all that going on it very well be that she was stressed out and still dealing with that. That's difficult because we can't avoid those things sometimes. Has her favorite human pet been freed up from his project? I would have hoped with things getting back to normal that it would stop or taper off, but you said it's getting worse.

 

As far as the decorations by the cage, I was thinking of some sort of new picture or something. One of the folks here had a behavior change in her grey and realized it was because they had received some stuffed macaws and had them on a shelf by/above the grey's cage. That's what made me think of that.

 

I still think that it could possibly be some vitamin deficiency or something though. One thing I have seen recommended often is to cook a hard-boiled egg and crunch it up shell and all and give them some (maybe 1/4 of the mixture)? It's something that may help if there's a calcium issue, but certainly won't hurt if it's not.

 

Some common allergies for parrots are peanuts, corn and wheat. They can develop suddenly even for those who have been eating it. Try cutting those two things out for a week or so (something not harmful even if it doesn't work to correct problem). If you don't see any change you can add them back in. The first ingredient in Zupreem pellets is ground corn. You could try switching to a different brand of pellet without that as a main ingredient.

 

Yeah, deciding on a vet trip (and the associated expense) is hard. It's the fact that it's getting worse and you haven't been able to isolate anything different that would lead me to the vet I think. I'm glad it's a great avian vet too. Some people don't have one anywhere near them.

 

Here's an article about this topic written by Sally Blanchard (probably not anything new, but something might jump out at you):

 

http://www.funnyfarmexotics.com/IAS/Blanchfp.htm

 

Oh, and I almost forgot...if you haven't started giving her some Red Palm Oil, I'd definitely start that. If you search on the forums for it there is a ton of information on the benefits of it (and it's one of their primary foods in the wild).

 

She's probably too young to be starting hormonal issues or to start her first major molt.

 

I can't think of anything else. This one is a toughie because you don't want to do anything to effect the normal preening process. Yikes. I sure wish I could be more helpful but please know that I am hoping so badly that you find a resolution to this!

 

Lisa

[danmcq]

Welcome Sarahsflock!!

 

I am sorry to hear you Grey is biting off feathers, not plucking. Either is not good.

 

You starting with the Aloe spraying is great and a step in the right direction. It will not instantly stop the feather biting right away and may not at all. It just depends. However, this entire episode seems to be linked to the Christmas holidays and all the things going on around and to your Grey.

 

Since things have settled down back to normal, does it seems as if his feather biting has slowed down a little?

 

When does he do this, while in the room with you out of his cage or only when returned to the cage?

 

Has anything else in his personality changed also that you have noticed?

 

Looking forward to hearing more from you and hoping this slows down and goes away quickly for you. :-)

[SarahsFlock]

Thanks to each of you for your welcome and advice. Just a quick summary and update:

 

Sarah bites her feathers whether in or out of her cage (36" cage with seemingly lots of room). The feather biting has not slowed down even though our routine is totally back to normal the last 2 weeks. We continue to do daily showers and spray with 100% Aloe juice, but if anything she preens harder and bites more feathers after the bath and spray (is this normal?).

 

The only personality change we've noticed, other than feather biting, is that she seems friendlier and more trusting as time goes by. She plays with her toys and loves pruning the fresh Eucalyptus branch in her cage. She truly seems to enjoy joining our walks (in her acrylic backpack) rather than being home while we are gone. We stopped giving her peanuts and corn for this week...but have no idea how long it would take to notice a difference if it was a factor (any hints?).

 

We have scheduled an appointment with our Avian Vet for Thursday. We don't expect her to find anything...but as has been pointed out, it is a recommended step in trying to solve this.

 

I'll try to post an update after the vet results. Thanks again.

 

Post edited by: SarahsFlock, at: 2009/01/20 00:48<br><br>Post edited by: SarahsFlock, at: 2009/01/20 00:51

[LisaM]

Mine don't preen immediately after the shower, but about two hours later they do some pretty vigorous preening (more vigorous than normal). But they're not barbing the feathers or plucking them, just getting them in good order. I have a boy ekkie that barbs one side of some of his feathers but he doesn't do that as part of his post-shower preening.

 

I think it can take at least a week to see a dietary change impact, but your vet can probably give you a better answer on that. I'm glad you're getting in on Thursday even if it's "just in case".

 

Actually, it would kind of be nice if it is something physical that can be easily treated! These behavioral things are so hard to figure out, particularly if you can't narrow down the root of the issue.

 

Good luck and keep us posted. Maybe others have better ideas who have dealt with more feather destructive behaviors.

[judygram]

Hello Sarahsflock and welcome to the family, so glad you could join us and we look forward to hearing more about you and Sarah.

 

Sorry to hear that Sarah is biting her feathers, sometimes I think that there are some greys destined to do that behavior and there is not a whole lot you can do about it but maybe this will not be the case here.

 

This will probably take some time to figure this out as it may take a process of elimination to find the cause and toget her to stop. But do not draw attention to it when she does it for she may continue to do it for the reaction it gets from you. Just ignore it, I know that is hard to do but you don't want her thinking you are enjoying her doing it.

 

You might find some answers and advice in our many threads so read thru them at your leisure and do ask any and all questions you may have and we will help you in any way we can.

 

She is a beautiful grey from the pic you provided in your opening post and if you have some more you would like to share with us we would love to see them.

[danmcq]

Hi Sarah,

 

Thanks for the additional information.

 

Preening aggressively right after the shower/misting is unusual. Most wait until they have dried, then start preening.

 

Hopefully, this will boil down to either an allergy to the peanuts or corn. But it would be odd to have an allergy just pop up to one of these foods after a few years.

 

It good to hear your going to give the Avian vet another shot at performing some additional tests to confirm there are not any underlying reasons. Several medical conditions can cause a bird to feather mutilate.

 

The behavior needs to be stopped before it becomes a habit. The good thing here is you are getting on this early, before it has had a chance to become a habit.

 

Looking forward to hearing updates on this. :-)

[LisaM]

Dan - I think she is 7 months old...do you think that is too young for allergies to show up or develop?

 

Sarah - remember to let us know what the vet says! I hope it can be kicked soon!

 

Lisa

[danmcq]

Lisa - Your right, for some reason I though she was 7 years old. :ohmy: So an allergy is certainly a good candidate to look for as a possible cause. :-)

[pynkzephyr]

I have been following this thread and wondered if anyone has heard anything more about Sarah after her visit with the vet yesterday?

[SarahsFlock]

Our vet visit was this morning, so here's an update:

 

The vet examined Sarah and observed her for awhile while she was biting away at her feathers. She felt certain that the problem is behavioral vs. medical.

 

Diet- she told us to drop all sunflower seeds. A little corn on the cob was ok, occassional peanut ok, but encourage pellet vs. seed. So-- no real changes there.

 

Environment - She wants us to create more of an environment for foraging. To hide her food, etc. She mentioned a DVD called Captive Foraging DVD... $25+s/h, so if any of you have knowledge of it we'd like to hear what you think. Or-- if you have any special foraging toy designs to share that would be great too. She liked that we have packed her cage with Eucalyptus, and shred toys. She was fine with us taking her on walks.

 

Supplements/Herbal - The vet recommended Red Palm Oil, so we bought some from her (next time we'll buy it online). She also recommended we get some Rescue Remedy (Bach) and drop it in Sarah's food or have it on our hands when we handle Sarah.

 

Medication - The vet instructed us to give her Children's Benadryl in her water every day. So, we've added some today.

 

Her other suggestion was that if/when her trimmed feathers grow back in, that we not trim them again. (She trimmed them last visit, but our bird is obviously not happy about that). She mentioned that an outside aviary where she could fly would be nice... but we don't really have a yard to put one in. Oh, also that we could give her a box with Care Fresh, or hay or straw in it, for her to dig/kick around.

 

So--these instructions will be followed for a month or so, and then we'll check back in with the vet. If things have not improved, the vet mentioned the possibility of prescribing Haldal, after full blood tests. We don't like the sound of that... but will try to stay positive.

 

Thanks, and please share any foraging toy ideas or info about that Captive Foraging CD or alternative.

[pynkzephyr]

Thanks for letting us know what the vet said. Am so glad you took her again (know that it is $$$) but sounds like what she needed.

 

Sounds like you are on the right path

 

I have not heard of the Rescue Remedy and looked it up - is this supposed to help her to relax and feel less stressed or am I way off base? sounded interesting like something I might want to try here.

 

 

tks

 

pynk<br><br>Post edited by: pynkzephyr, at: 2009/01/24 00:38

[judygram]

Thanks for letting us know how the vet visit with Sarah went and I hope you do get to the root of the problem, I would be interested in how the Rescue Remedy works, I have not heard of it before either.

[Luvparrots]

Hello and welcome to the family. Sarah is much a beautiful grey, I'm glad the vet visit gave you some good input to help correct her feather biting problems. Can't wait to hear more about Sarah and how things are going.

[MazyAK]

My best wishes are with you and I can't add anything more than these good folks have said. It sounds like there may be several things that may be causing the plucking so narrow the field down and you will prevail. Stay with it.

Bruce & Mazy

[LisaM]

Here's a link to a website that gives some great foraging ideas...

 

http://www.avianweb.com/foragingfood.html

 

I don't know about that DVD, but there is a link to it at the bottom of the webpage also.

 

Here is another one that shows how someone went through the process of "teaching" their birds to forage...

 

http://onafricanwings.com/Foragingtree.htm

 

I hope these help.

 

Lisa

[SarahsFlock]

Thanks so much for the encouragement and the foraging ideas. For the last few days we have been adding all sorts of foraging opportunities to Sarah's cage.

 

Her food bowls are covered and her treats and toys are hidden. She will pull up a shoelace to get to a peanut, scratch through a box of shredded newspaper to find a favorite toy, open a covered plastic container to get food and rip off coffee filter packets to see what's inside.

 

When she uncovers a food item, she often leaves it and moves on to another package--as if the process of uncovering things is more important to her then the food itself. We figure every minute she's engaged in foraging is one less minute that she's biting her feathers.

 

We are also following vet's instructions with daily Benadryl in her water, and drops of Red Palm Oil (which she eats from the dropper), and the drop of Rescue Remedy (in the afternoon when she feather picks the most). So-- we remain hopeful.

 

Thanks again. Oh-- we didn't buy that DVD yet, sort of wondering if it could possibly have more info than we've already found, with your help.

[Lyric]

Sounds like you are doing great to find a remedy to Sarah's feather chewing. One thing to remember which was mentioned above but not really stressed is to not let Sarah see you react to her feather mutiliation. If you make any noticeable reaction to it she may be noticing your reaction and taking it as attention. Also, she will be able to pick up the fact that you are stressed about something. Try to project calm and happy thoughts when you are around her.

I'm sure that with all you are doing it will be no time at all before she has moved on from this behaviour.

Oh, some people have also had success by adding a full spectrum light to their routine- you might investigate this option a little more as well- I know it has been discussed before on this forum.

[SarahsFlock]

Thanks. We were coached to not react to her feather biting, so we usually try to distract her from afar, and if that doesn't work we leave the room. We do have a full-spectrum light right alongside her cage. Are there any guidelines you know of about how far away from the parrot it needs to be? I guess I'll search around for that info... she frequently sits near it.