Tail feather ?plucking, chewing?

[bandits_mom08]

I am a little conserned with Bandit. He is not molting right now but for some reason it seems as if he is chewing on his tail feathers. I have already found 2 that have been chewed off. Could there be a reason for this?

 

His skin doesn't seem to be too dry or anything. And he only does it once in a while. It's taken a couple weeks for the 2 feathers I found.

 

Thanks for any help,

Amanda

[Dave007]

The only thing you can do right now is to keep the area moist. Sometimes, a bird will chew the ends of feathers as they die off. Others will tug at them frequently and eventually they fall out. It's impossible to tell you why he's chewing right now because it's only two feathers right now. Birds periodically chew feathers on all parts of their bodies, not just tails. It happens more frequently in young birds as opposed to adults but I don't know how old your bird is. There's nothing that you can specifically do that will immediately stop him from doing that. You'll need to see whether it's a steady habit that's beginning and normally, birds who are feather chewers spend a large part of the day constantly chewing on their feathers.

[bandits_mom08]

Thanks I'll keep an eye on him. He is 7 months old now and this hasn't seemed to be a problem in the past.

[bandits_mom08]

Ok, so, when they chew off the feathers will the grow back?? There is something left at the base of where the feather was. He has/had a beautiful tail and I don't want him to loose that.

 

He has successfully chewed out a couple more tail feathers in the last couple days. He is down to 5 and is working on another.

 

Routine has not changed, his skin doesnt look to dry, he is not scratching anymore than usual, and he seems happy.

 

I am confused!!

[Dave007]

All feathers will grow back unless the follicle which is partially located on the external and internal parts of the skin is pulled out. There is no way to replace the follicle. So that area won't have a feathers growing from it anymore. Very serious pluckers often do this to themselves but if and when the habit of plucking finally subsides and loads of feathers finally grow back, they'll often be little areas that feathers will never grow back.

Concerning pluckers vs chewers----The chewer has a much better chance of having all of the feathers returning because the bird's main focus is chewing the actual feather in different areas, not the follicles. Most of the time they leave the area alone where the feathers grows in . What may happen is that the bird is classified as a chronic feather chewer and that has to be dealt with differently then if the problem is temporary and the only way to judge that is over a long period of time. There are no quick fixes and there's no way to make the feather grow in quickly. They grow in at the same rate as any other feathers be it tail or flight feathers and new feather coming in can be just as irritating whether it be a plucker or chewer which many times causes more chewing/plucking.

This situation concerning follicles frequently happen to men who are diagnosed with male pattern baldness. Treatment for the problem is the removal of the whole follicle/follicles (plugs) from a inconspicous part of the head and implanted into the bald area where that healthy hair still has a chance to continue growing.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2008/12/26 18:57

[Tycos_mom]

I wouldn't worry about the feathers not growing back.Tyco chewed all her flight feathers on her left wing for yhe first 4 years of her life due to a bad clip when she was a baby. When I got her I had her wings clipped properly and now she has stoped chewing and has all her feathers on both her her wings back.

[bandits_mom08]

Thanks for the lesson on chewing vs. plucking. I think it is a case of chewing. I am glad they should eventually grow back. How sad for Tyco, I am glad she stoped chewing.

[judygram]

Dave gives good lessons Amanda and he should know as he has had pet and breeder greys for many years.

[bandits_mom08]

That's awsome. I didn't know he was a breeder also.

[Char]

Whisper only has about 4 tail feathers left. Some have been broken from falling and some have just been damaged from rough preening. I am hoping it is something she outgrows. She is molting right now so maybe we will have some new ones.

 

She also chews on the flight feathers and they are a mess. She was clipped when I got her but I don't plan on clipping her again if she will let them grow in. If I had it all to do over again I would have gotten a bird that was not clipped.

 

As for the tail feathers..when I first took her to the vet she pointed out bands on her tail which are called stress bands and probably from weaning or some other stress before I got her. On another trip we discussed the breaking of the tail feathers and she pointed out that they were breaking at the stress bands where they were already weak.

 

Hopefully the new ones will be stronger.<br><br>Post edited by: Char, at: 2009/01/08 00:48

[bandits_mom08]

Bandit finally has 2 new tail feathers growing back in!! Hopefully this is why he was chewing them. He has seemend to have stopped.

[Lyric]

Did you see Bandit chew the feathers off? It's possible he broke them off from a fall or something if you didn't see him chew them. When my TAG was young and clumsy he used to hang upside down off the top of his cage and just let go and fall. He ended up breaking off all his tail feathers. He looked pretty funny without a tail for a few months but they did eventually grow back. I'm glad to hear Bandit's feathers are growing back in now.

[bandits_mom08]

yeah unfourtunantly i saw him chew them off.

[judygram]

Amanda, you said on the 26th that 2 new tail feathers have grown in and he seemed to have stopped the chewing, is that still true?

[poochbabe]

Hello all...I am in day two of Ganesh coming home and he has already figured out that when I walk out of the room for two seconds he starts to rip at the tiny little spike of a tail he has left or at the raggy wings caps. Any suggestions? I want to stop him and have been spritzing him with plain water but I don't want to stress him out more than necessary in his first few days here with me. He came to me with a completely bald butt and just the tops of his wings...all else is GONE. Could he really have figured out that it is a great way to get my attention???

[Dave007]

poochbabe

 

I replied to your PM

[poochbabe]

So now three months into our relationship Ganesha is worse than ever on the plucking front. She has NO tail feathers because I had to take her into emergency when she messed with them and they started to bleed. They all had to be pulled. She is ferociously working on her right wing and she has NO flight feathers. The one that was coming in was worked down to a spike and now a nub. I give her a full soaking shower everyday and spray her with aloe vera juice. She is on Harrisons and fresh fruit and veggies. She has tons of out of cage time and more toys than I ever had as a child. She is so wonderful and sweet and loving but she is a mess when it comes to her back end. I try to ignore it whenever she goes after the feathers but now I am also trying to distract her with other things and noises, like a can with pennies (I read that somewhere as a techique). My vet is great and a full avian vet who does all the work for the avian rescue here in Milwaukee. I have followed her advice and everyone else's since I brought her home and she is getting worse...HELP!

 

P.S. She was DNA'd to be a girl...;-)

[Dave007]

If a bird is a plucker and goes after flight feathers, it's gonna be a long time before a complete new set of flight feathers will appear. More than likely, when the bird is finished with one side of the body, it'll start on the other side. They don't grow back at the same time. The areas near the skin can be irritated because of previous pulling/plucking. The more areas a bird plucks, the longer it's going to take before plucking stops and this is the reason--when a bird plucks down to the skin, the time comes for new feathers to grow back in but they don't grow straight out. they grow out of the shaft but the shaft lays against the body. The feathers grow out across the body and the pointed ends of those shafts pinch into the skin if there's nothing soft at the tips so when the shafts pinch into the skin, there's irritation and eventually there's pulling to get the shaft away from the body and if it's seriously pulled, the shaft will not only come out but the follicle will too and no feather will ever grow in that spot again. A bird who is growing feathers back will have relapse after relapse. There's nothing concerning a quick fix when the subject is about plucking. It's a long process.

If you wanna give her something that has noise, use a heavy duty bell that hangs in a cage so that she can vent frustrations on it to the point of it seeming to be violent interaction with the bell. That's something that's necessary in an area where most of the plucking occurs ( the cage).

It's not uncommon for a plucker to pull all the tail feathers out. In your situation, the tail feathers were chewed and someone else decided to pull the rest of the tail feathers out. tail feathers will take a long time to come back in and there's a good chance that your bird will proceed to either chew or pull those feathers out.

Your description of the seriousness of the plucking may not be as dire as you make it sound but that's not your fault. If you could post a couple of close up pictures, that would help. More opinions and comparisons can be made when seeing pictures.Your bird is now under a vet's care. The vet has the tools and medications which may be needed to treat the problem. Aloe juice isn't a cure all. It works up to a point. You'll need to put pressure on your vet as to what procedures can or should be done. We can't override what your vet says. He knows the, has seen the bird and can make his own conclusions. This problem may go back to when you got the bird---not enough time to be weaned, possible short clipping, lack of proper adjustments in a house, hyperactivity. Now you can say you don't do this or you do that and it isn't this way or I make sure of this or that but what's most important is that your bird is under a vet's care and should be able to help you with explanations, reasons and possible solutions.

It sounds like you've had the bird for 3 mts. Is he a baby or is he an adult who came to you with this problem? With babies, family adjustments can either take a long time or a short time to occur. With older adult birds who have had this problem for a long time, it may have reached the point where it's a permanent plucker.

If your vet is also one that also takes care of avian rescue birds, she should be able to get into the specifics of feather problems because many birds in rescue shelters have chewing/plucking problems. If she has an answer for those birds, then she should have an answer for you.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/08 02:16

[poochbabe]

I have owned Ganesha for more like 2 1/4 months and she came to me from a breeder who was going to put her in sanctuary because she could no longer be sold. She was sold at 7 mos. and was wing trimmed at the time of sale. Apparently the new owners returned her five days later in this condition. I took her at almost 11 months after I lost my 10 year old Grey and all my 'tiels to a toxic oven liner. I have been working with her to try to turn this around but I am concerned that she is getting worse not better. My vet is great with her and she is extremely knowledgeable with plucking. We have talked about anti stress drugs and a collar because she will not let the new growth come in unharmed. She had several tail feathers still in the shealths and just wrecked them over about 3 days until they were blood feathers that had to be removed. She just turned one on Friday of last week. I have attached a photo I took tonight and a fuzzy one from before they had to pull the tail.

 

She was tested for everything at her first baby visit and we were back a few weeks ago. I got some pain medication in case the new growth was bothering her too much because she seems like it could be painful. She will suddenly wrench her body around to her back or tail almost like a spasm with her neck craning out and a little cry. I get the meds into her when she will accept it and when it seems really bad. She seems worse first in the morning and later at night.

[poochbabe]

Here is the other photo...

[Dave007]

""""We have talked about anti stress drugs and a collar because she will not let the new growth come in unharmed.""""

 

In your situation, drugs would seem like the way to go. There's at least 3 drugs that can be prescribed and usually, a vet will show you how to administer them.

 

""""I have owned Ganesha for more like 2 1/4 months and she came to me from a breeder who was going to put her in sanctuary because she could no longer be sold."""""

 

So, can I assume correctly that there were health/body feather problems before you took her? Normally, a breeder won't put a baby bird in a santuary unless there's a good reason. Did the breeder give you the reason for the santuary other than the fact that she couldn't be sold? It's possible that she went through bad experiences while she was with the breeder.

 

So, she was sold to people at 7 mts, immediately returned and was with the breeder for 3 or 4 more mts before you took her at 11 mts? Sorry if I'm miscalculating.

 

For one thing, your bird has been in a very unsettling situation that no baby bird should be put through no matter what the problem is. No bird should be bounced around from breeder to customer back to the breeder and then to another customer--all of which happened before 1 yr of age. A bird who doesn't know where it belongs can become an extremely hyper bird who will find an outlet for it's frustration---Plucking-Chewing. It's not uncommon. I can tell you positively that your bird is gonna need much more time to start feeling like she's finally arrived at her permanent home.

 

Her past situation screams *plucking, chewing, nervousness, irratic behavior*.

 

I truly feel terrible about what you're going through and that also applies to your bird.

 

As far as the tail, I don't know if the follicles are gone or just the complete feathers. If the follicles are there, feathers will come back. I doubt that the follicles were removed if the only problem was that the feathers had to be removed. The spasms you refer to is what I was talking about before--the tiny shafts pinching into the skin causing some pain and a desire to pull the shafts in that area. It's only after the feathers come out a certain distance ( about 3/4 inch ) that the pulling will decrease. At that distance the shafts will have feathers in them and won't pinch the skin. That applies to all areas where feathers are pulled close to or on the skin.

 

To be honest, there must have been some problems in the past. I say this so you can move forward knowing that as of now your bird comes in the classifical of *special needs* bird of which there are hundreds.

 

From those pics, it seems like the flight feathers are totally gone but the covert feathers are still there. From what I can see, the neck hasn't been touched

 

It will take quite a while for your bird to get back in order again. Your bird's feathers may not come in perfectly and one other thing may happen--limited ability to fly.

 

I would seriously discuss the anti-stress drugs with your vet. It's obvious that you have a hyper bird and there's thousands like that, especially greys. As far as the collar, that depends on 2 things--how tender the skin is where the collar will sit and your bird's acceptance or lack of acceptance of it. Your bird may be smat enough to get it off. Your vet can discuss it with you.

 

I know you won't believe this but I also feel that your bird could be in much worse shape feather wise. I say that because baldness doesn't seem to be there. I've seen much worse than what your bird looks like.

 

I wish I could say more but it's good that you have a solid connection to your vet.

 

Patience, time and understanding the problem will more than likely get you through this.

 

Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/08 05:43<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/05/08 05:48

[baz7863]

Our Grey is 8 months old and has pulled all his tail feathers out and his breast feathers and the feathers on the top of his wings and back he is really well looked after. But we cant understand why he is doing it he has just started talking aswell but he looks like a scruffy little pigeon please help!!! :(

[Eckobird]

baz7863 a few questions about your grey so other members can help you better:

 

Has there been any big changes in your house? Does he get atleast 4 hours out of cage time everyday? Does he get attention? Hows his diet? Have you gone to the vet to rule out medical problems?

[baz7863]

No there aint been no changes to our house he gets loads of attention if we go out we leave the radio on or the tv for him he is cleaned out every other day and his food and water is changed everyday he has parrot feed and loads of fresh and dried fruit he eats all his food. We thought it might have been because im in the army and go away alot that might have been something to do with it, the guy we got him from said he has never known it for a grey to pluck it normally his macaws that pluck as he has a few birds in his house as he is a well known breeder in my area.

[poochbabe]

Ganesha update:

 

After several months of trying daily showers, aloe vera juice sprays, valerian root and camomile tea, tons of toys and shredding materials my vet and I decided that it was time for birdie drugs. She was put on Paxil twice a day and in the last week she has grown in quite a bit of fuzz on her butt, sides and a little in the center of her back, all that had been completely bald for a while. She also it much more talkative and playful. Some of that might be that she is getting really comfortable with me and her new home here. She has a really big cage in a separate room for sleep time and sometimes during the time I am gone for work. She has her own tv with cartoons and a cd of birds singing to listen to during the day. I have taken her off any sunflower seeds as well. She still has no wings, but I see a marked improvement. Hopefully it will continue when those tail feather start to reappear. She still gets really crazy and goes after those whenever they start to appear. I am also not taking her with me other places as much. My older grey used to come everywhere will me and I guess I never realized that this youngster was too nervous and unsure to do the same. I made some mistakes early in our time together but hopefully we are turning things around.

 

Has anyone had experience with Paxil for plucking?