mas Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Well, Zahzu is plucking again, but it's so much worse this time than last Today, she's pulled out feathers from the back of her wings, with very thick roots, and a bit of blood came out with the feather - it's stopped bleeding, but I'm just worried about it - if it continues she might develop infections, become aneamic etc. Has anyone else had this kind of experience? It's not just the soft little feathers that she's pulling out anymore - it's quite big feathers. -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Oh Sameera, I am so sorry to hear that. I would contact the vet and see when those meds are coming in. They may be the only way to get Zahzu calmed down to the point that she will stop plucking due to the irritation from all the feather damage and removal she has suffered through. Hopefully, once all new feathers are in, she will no longer pluck. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 20, 2008 Author Share Posted August 20, 2008 I really hope she won't pluck once the new feathers are in... it seems really painful what she is doing to herself. The medication came in yesterday, and she has had 2 doses - was really thankful that she managed to take it! She was growling at the syringe at first, so my husband fed me juice from it, and i enjoyed it soooo much! ;-) after that she was willing to have a small taste, so we have crushed the tablet up, and mixed it with fruit juice and administer it that way. She seems fine now - is happily preening in her cage after being out for a couple of hours; and any bleeding she had was minimal and it has clotted up nicely. This is going to be a looong next few months I think! -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Very good thinking Sameera on the juice and example of you enjoying the liquid coming out of it!!! They do indeed learn by role playing and example. It's good to hear all is well this morning. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sallas Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 Recently I saw a product while looking for a new cage. It is sold by Kings Cages and is called "Pluck No More". Maybe it would be worth a try? http://www.kingscages.com/pluck_no_more.php I really hope something works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzzique Posted August 20, 2008 Share Posted August 20, 2008 I have a friend on another forum that took in a plucking grey. She added red palm oil to Holly's diet. She also mists Holly at least 3 times a week with aloe vera juice. Both are great for skin and feathers! She gets a soaking at least once a week. Holly now has beutiful feathers and you would never know that she use to pluck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 22, 2008 Author Share Posted August 22, 2008 Thanks for your help guys. We are addressing the bathing issue... and we have a humidifier in the room also, as it's pretty dry where we live. The past few days, it seems Zahzu just doesn't want to be in her cage, and the only place she plucks is in the cage! I can't identify what could be bothering her... nothing has changed in routine, took out a toy that could have been bothering her so will see how that goes... She has had a couple of minor injuries, no major damage though so thats good. This weekend hubby has gone out of town, so I'm alone with Zahzu, and really worried about her falling and breaking blood feathers. *Sigh* -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 22, 2008 Share Posted August 22, 2008 Best wishes to you and Zahzu this weekend Sameera. Hopefully the two of you will be able to just comfort and snuggle with one another and have a "No Pluck" good time together. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 24, 2008 Author Share Posted August 24, 2008 Thanks Dan for your good wishes Update: Zahzu was fine all through Friday, and Saturday... however Saturday night I had to go out to a function, when i came back at about 10pm, she was on the front of her cage plucking. I waited a few minutes and took her out, and sat with her till past 11pm because she would NOT settle and go sleep... when I put her back to sleep I noticed a drop of blood at the bottom of her cage. Today, I took her out first thing in the morning, for a couple of hours, however when I put her back she was back to mad plucking (so I've taken her out again). However, I've noticed she's got some yellow spots on her skin where she has plucked - so called the vet and he said they are open at 5pm (3hours from now), so I'm going to have to take her in... This is a real test of my patience, I need everyones prayers please, because it's very testing, and even harder since my hubby is out of the country for the weekend! Zahzu has a lot of 'stumps' that are spiky left from feathers she has destroyed, so I'm wondering if that is now what is irritating her and those also need removal. Anyway, will update you all when back from the vets. I really really wish here in SA there was more information provided to new owners of birds - I feel if we had gotten into getting Zahzu with more information, we wouldn't be in this mess we are in now.... anyway, at least I'm doing the best I can do now hey? -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 I feel your exasperation Sameera and am truly sorry this is happening. Prayers are coming your way. I am so sorry to hear of the continuing saga of Zahzu's plucking. Perhaps an increase in the meds or a different type? Does her plucking seem to have slowed at all since the meds started? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 24, 2008 Author Share Posted August 24, 2008 Well, it's only been a few days since she is on the medication - guidelines say after a few weeks improvements should show. It's only when I'm not around that she picks, or when she is in her cage and I'm here and don't take her out... when she is on top of her cage, she's happy as larry! Will see what the vet says - have printed out an exhaustive list of causes that I will go through with the vet... no blood work has been done on her yet so maybe that is the way to go. She never used to be like this, she was always such a good baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Well, hopefully the blood work may indicate some nutritional deficiency that can be addressed. Plucking is such a difficult thing to get under control sometimes. The list of things that can cause it is staggering, to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 24, 2008 Author Share Posted August 24, 2008 Back from the vets and it's not great news. The vet said he can't remove the damaged feathers today, because he has no assistants, so i'm going to have to take her in tomorrow! again! He said he is going to do a test for PBFD, remove damaged feathers, and he said we are up to our last resort option - and that is a collar to help her stop. He said he has never used a collar on an african grey before, but had success with an eclectus. i'm not keen on a collar, and either is hubby - but the vet seems to think it is the only option left. What do we do?? -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Well, if a collar is a must for a temporary time until the offending irritation goes away. Then it may be the only solution. It does not sound like your vet is keen on the idea either and is only offering it as a LAST resort. Unless the meds kick in or he finds something in the blood work he can treat. It may be the only solution unless you want a completely naked Grey. Only you ultimately can make the dicision and I know you will not make it without a lot of thought, consultation and prayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzzique Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Mas is Zahzu allowed to be out of her cage all the time if someone is home? If not this would be a good start. This is from my friend that took in a plucking grey. It is a reply to plucking for another members too. But it is all still good advice. - Build Honey's interest in crispy/ crunchy/ shredding toys. I bought a gross of these woodchip finger traps and started out by hiding Holly's favorite treats (pistachios) in them, while she watched. Then I'd hand it to her. She knew there was a treat in there, she just had to find the "hard spot" to get the nut. If I were you I'd start a game where you and and your husband (and maybe others?) take turns "hiding" the treat in the toy and passing it to her. And everyone cheers her for finding it! WooHoo! - Once she associates the finger toy with treats, start putting other things in it, besides treats. Thanks to Stephwall's suggestion, I used uncooked penne. I'd hide a pistachio, bookend it with penne, then plug both ends of the finger toy with beads or rope. Now Holly really had to work to find her treat. - After that, I found 2 new uses for the finger trap toys: A) I would thread penne on a skewer / kabob toy (like this one, but you probably already have toys you can recycle). Cover the penne with the finger toy and hang it in her cage. I think this was the start of Holly's turning point. I'd hang it over night, and in the morning it was shredded at the bottom of her cage. I'd hold up the pieces from the bottom of her cage, and cheer what a good girl she is. B) Per Jodie's recommendation I got this Foraging System. The first time I left it hollow, but made sure Holly watched me put her pistachios in there. She destroyed it. From then on I went back to stuffing the finger traps with nuts, penne beads and rope, and THEN putting THESE in the foraging system. They fit perfect, and again, Holly has to work all the harder to get her treat. That's the long way of saying I think your husband should introduce and encourage shredding new things, while introducing you as a co-cheerleader. Does Honey talk? Does she mimic any one bird over another? I would make them neighbors. Granted I only have 2 birds and they have no choice but to be neighbors, but I KNOW Holly has picked up so many habits from Vinnie -- from foraging, to untying knots and picking at beads. She used to never play with toys, and now I find beads in her food bowl -- which means she has to traverse her cage with the beads in her beak. I'm so proud of her. One other thing I think helps when I'm out is singing songs to the birds when I'm home, and playing the songs while I'm out. Uh... okay... they're spoiled! Vinnie and Holly have their own iPod. When I'm cleaning their cages I sing along to "This Old Man", "You are My Sunshine!", "Old MacDonald" etc. etc. And when I have to go out, I leave these playing in a loop. It might not be my voice, but I KNOW it means something in my absence. I don't know if these may or may not apply to you? I'm thinking off the top of my head, what would I do? I hope you'll pardon the verbosity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 24, 2008 Author Share Posted August 24, 2008 Thanks Dan and Suziqque... Yeah, it is the last resort at this stage. I've put in strings of pasta into Zahzu's cage, rolled up newspaper, magazine type thing to shread, toys with string for her to preen, wooden toys for her to chew up, straws to chew up... she has lots to keep her occupied, and she often plays. I really do need to work on encouraging more foraging, and have just spent a lot of time reading up on ideas so will get into that soon - she does already have a couple of foraging toys, but need to encourage it more when she's IN her cage - she forrages constantly outside the cage. When I'm home she's out of the cage 99% of the time - but I think this is part of the problem, because she then associates being in the cage, with being alone. I want to record my voice and hubbys talking for when I go out to play for Zahzu. I just really don't know now about this collar, and I need to have a decision made by 10am tomorrow, its just past 6pm here now... I'm worried the collar is going to affect her climbing and eating... and if it affects the climbing will she fall down more and break more feathers?? Eish... decisions decisions! -Sameera She also talks a lot to entertain herself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzzique Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I like the idea of the singing with the birds then playing the cd on loop when gone. Another idea that was done on the other forum was they made a doll for in the cage. They made it out of an old t-shirt of the favored person. I hope you can get her better! Just remember everything takes time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 25, 2008 Author Share Posted August 25, 2008 Thats the thing - everything takes time! Will keep thinking, off to bed now... and when hubby gets home will discuss with him and let you know what we come up with. I'm not keen on the collar, rather lets see how the medication goes over the next month or so, and if no improvements, or within that time if things get worse, then maybe we can consider it - but will also see what the vet says... he was talking about an e-collar which i'm not keen on, i prefer a tube colar if we are going to use one... night night... -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 That sounds like a wise path to take Sameera. Sleep well. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missa818 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Sorry to hear about the plucking. Raz does it too in phases. I don't know if the vet has suggested this, but when Raz got really bad (severe plucking, even seizures at times) we found that he had a deficiency in calcium. Even 3 years later, if I forget to give it to him once a week, he will start pulling like crazy. I give him scrambled eggs with a liquid calcium supplement and pure palm oil all over them. He LOVES it and it helps keep the feather pulling down. His mood improves as well. I hope this helps! Best of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tycos_mom Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 You must be just at your end I know I would be you have all the prayers i can muster up and a few more. I don't know whats best for your Baby I hope the meds work. I have heard that a calsium deficency can cause Greys to pluck even in humans calsium is a big thing I would ask the vet to test for this. it might just save you all of this grief. You just never know it could be somthing that simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 25, 2008 Author Share Posted August 25, 2008 Hey guys, Back from second vet visit and it's bad news! The vet suspects PBFD - he said her feathers are ver brittle and were just breaking, in addition to that I've noticed many deformed feathers - so that might be the case. It takes one week for results to come back - if positive he said our options are to let her battle it out till she passes away, or put her down. Also, she mutilated herself a bit last night, so the vet said he's not giving me a choice and put on the collar. Anyway, not happy at the moment... will keep you updated. Oh, we got home a while ago, and she figured out she can reach her tail and pulled out the last remaining tail feather - so she is tail-less. Will keep you all updated. -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tycos_mom Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Oh no thats awful news I'm so sorry to hear that I hope thats not the case. I will be praying for you and your baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted August 25, 2008 Author Share Posted August 25, 2008 Me again - Zahzu fell and has broken a blood feather which is bleeding a little - called the vets office and he is out till 2pm, which is in one hour. Am really furstrated - Zahzu is crashing around her cage, really stressed - 3 or 4 days of this is going to be torture for her. -Sameera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzzique Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Oh Mas I am so sorry to hear this! Here is a link that might make you smile anyway. http://cbs4.com/pets/Oscar.Cockatoo.Broward.2.696525.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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