zeta Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Hey gang, I need help! :ohmy: Brody is starting yo bit. Not like a bad birdie, :unsure: but I think he's upset at me. He will make this clucking sound, his beak is to his chest, and he will bit. Bit my finger or my face. He will only lunge but no hold on to my finger. I'm worried as I never taught him this. Please what does this mean? He is only 6 months old! Lisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Lisa he may be doing what some breeders do with their birds. If you go to this link and watch my little cockatoo you will see what I mean. Did you just get him? As much as it may hurt try not to show any emotion if he does bite down hard. They will think this is funny or see that you back off and keep doing it. We don't ever teach our birds to bite just they know from instinct to do so when they are scared or nervous. Have you changed anything? Is there a reason he may be upset at you? do you have any more information on what else he has been doing or like after I did this or put this in his cage he started biting? Does anything trigger? He's very young and may just still be getting used to everything. I don't know how long you have had him. Hope to hear more.<br><br>Post edited by: Ronda477, at: 2008/02/23 05:39 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 Ronda, I've had Brody since he was 2 months. I hand fed him myself. (I'm sorry I mis-spelled BITE. LOL. I put bit or bitting. I'm typing in the dark on laptop). Anyways, back to Brody. Everything in his environment is the same. I move his toys around every other day and fill is basket with new foot toys. I don't see why he would be mad at me, I'm just thinking he is upset at me because he does it alot now... I really don't want him to start this because it really hurts and I love him too much for him to do this! Please help me! Does the clucking sound mean something? Like is it a upset sound? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Well they are very known for growling, does it resemble that at all? Usually they kind of do this as a warning before a bite and I only say usually lol. But that is very normal for him to do that before he bites. Being he is young and hasn't done that before with you, he may just be like a regular kid and seeing what he can get away with, and what actually makes you back off. If you want him to step up than make sure you make him, don't back off just cause he warned you. I know it may hurt, but you can't give in and give him the upper hand. He will learn that even though he doesn't want to do things sometimes he has to. It's really only for their own safety. Not to be mean to the birds, but for instance you need him to step up right away because you feel something is going to harm him, he needs to know there is no debating the subject he has to step up cause your not going to back off. It is a upset sound, but like I said if you haven't changed anything he's just testing you most likely being he is soo young. He is learning how to train you, the idea is though to train him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 No, its not a growl. Its a chicken clucking sound, he puts his beak on his chest, then he lunges. I've heard the growl from a breeder pair. He does this especially when new people walk into the house or when he is on my shoulder, so now I'm avoiding putting him on my shoulder because that's when he bites my face. He's being a good boy right now. He is resting my me while I type. Brody is a night baby, he's not very excited to be handled during the day. Is this also normal? I've read that Greys are very independent and they don't like to be handled a lot, but how will he get his time with me? Brody doesnt like to walk around the house on my shoulder. He likes it right on top his cage, in his cage, or on a stand. I want my baby to get use to me. I need all the help I can get! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Well hon I'm sure others will be along shortly to give more advice, but all Gray's are different. My SweetHeart is 9 months old, we got her when she was 6 months old. I still can't have that lovey little Grey yet either. It takes time and patience. I have made little steps and you just have to look at it as every little positive like him sitting with you now is a good thing. My quaker clucks, but I haven't heard my Grey do that yet. I'm sure they do not saying it isn't normal. Mine doesn't like to be handled much at all. Some are like that. Than some are very cuddly, but you are right. They are known to be independent somewhat, but it all starts right now in these stages. So work with him every day and he will get used to the idea of being with you. I would be very careful though with him on your shoulder. I have read stories before of a woman that hand raised her cockatoo and had him for 10 years and never in a million years did she ever think he would bite her, but one day he lost his footing on her shoulder and took a very good chunk out of her face that needed a bunch of stitches. So just be very careful! Just try to spend more time with him every day and keep that up! He'll come around even if he's not the cuddly type he'll at least hang out with you in time. But trust me 3 months later I'm still working on my own, so I know how you feel. Just be patient, little things every day will start showing you how it pays off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 Thank You so much Ronda! You've been a world of help. I want him to be happy and with him lunging and biting makes me sad cause I don't want him to feather pluck. That really scares me. Anyways, I'll do some more research on Grey Behavior. I wish I did this research before I got him, not that I wouldn't still get Brody, just that I would be more educated on Grey's. I also read that they do not like high stress environments. So, I 'm happy to know that I have a very calm and quiet house. No other pets or kids, just my parents. He has a room all to himself. Anyways, if anyone would come and help me more that would be great!<br><br>Post edited by: zeta, at: 2008/02/23 06:31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 LOL stress, than mine would for sure be a picker lol. We have 5 dogs, 3 cats, 3 other birds, 2 children and hubby and myself. Hon I'm sure he'll be just fine, just give him love and the nutrition he needs and he'll love you forever! Like I said he is probably just testing the waters. But yes read up and there is nothing wrong with what you are doing. At least you are taking the time now to read and learn. That is very good! I know it is heart breaking when they bite at you trust me, but you do have to show that he can't boss you. Not by being mean, but by being firm and not backing down. Try your hardest not to show any emotion, they pick up on that very easy. Good Luck to you hon! I'll check back tomorrow and I'm sure others will answer as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Zeta I tried to do a little research for you, here is a popular and informative post for you to read. http://www.greyforums.net/forums/african-grey/5198-newbie-how-can-i-stop-charley-bitting.html#5198 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 Awesome, I'm gonna print it out, so I can take it to work. THANK YOU RONDA! Lisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connie Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Hi Zeta, Have you checked his feathers, I know my 2 get nippy if there is a new feather coming in, or if there is a blood feather that needs to come out. He may just be asking for more attention too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 At six months old they are starting to test their boundaries. They are becoming very self aware and know they are not totally reliant on their parents to feed and over see them 24/7. This will continue for a while. The most important thing to do now, is learn your Greys body language very well, as you have already begun to do in noting that the beak against chest is just before the lunge. It is ok to respect the fact that they might be preening or playing intently with something and would rather not be bothered at that time. There is nothing wrong with starting to offer your hand to step up or scratch from a distance of a foot or two and then closely watch body language as you start to move your hand in closer. If you see he wants to be left alone, just abort the step-up or scratch if you don't really need to move him. If there is need to have him step up to move or place back in cage, then follow through with your hand in a taught fist with the back of it towards him and just slide it under him until he must start to step up and follow through. If he Bites, say something like "No Bite" with a stern look as you keep on following through with the step-up. This method will do two things. First he will realize you allow him to make some choices at times for himself. Second, he will realize there are times that you have a different plan and will follow through on making him step up. After a few weeks of this, the bites will become less in power and more of a "Do I really have to?" type of questioning. I hope this helps a little. :-)<br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2008/02/23 14:58 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Zeta you say he has a room to himself, maybe he is feeling isolated from the rest of the family, they like to be where the family lives, plays and socializes, they want to be in the middle of the action so to speak. Dan and Ronda gave you some excellent advice, he may be testing his boundaries to see what he can get away with. Try the methods and ideas that they gave you and see if they help I am hoping you will be back soon with an update that the behavior is improving so good luck to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 24, 2008 Author Share Posted February 24, 2008 Hey guys, Another biting day with Brody. But, I'm not letting him on my shoulder anymore since he has that "I'm in charge" feeling. I brought him to work today so we can have sometime together. He did well there. A good friend came in today and she has 2 Grey's. I talked to her about Brody and she told me that I need to start doing time outs. Is that a good idea? I don't want that to stress him and he starts plucking. I know Grey's don't like stressful environments. She said to put him in the bath tub, turn the light off, and close the door. Does this sound okay? He's doing a lot better just sitting on my arm. I'm teaching him no shoulder since he likes to lung at my face. Oh yes, and he does have his own room. Maybe that could be it? He also has two different cages. Should I leave him only in one cage since he is still so young? He has a sleep cage and a day cage, both Avian Adventure cages. Very large... Maybe he wants to stay in one place? I'm also having problems with Brody when it comes with playing with toys. I spend $100 on toys a week to keep him happy and satisfied, but he won't play with anything. I've tried big toys, small toys, hard toys, shiny toys, soft toys, everything. And he will not play with them. He goes for the tags more then the toy. And, I know your bird needs a variety of colors, shapes, and textures. HOW can I keep him busy/ Can I just give him the tags instead? Please let me know! Lisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeta Posted February 24, 2008 Author Share Posted February 24, 2008 Oh, and I'm planning to put his day cage downstairs and leave is sleep cage in his room. Does that sound like a good idea? That way he can see what's going on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I don't really think the time outs like that are a good idea. Others I have read that when they do something wrong will tell them firmly no, and than place back in cage and turn their backs on them for a few minutes. But I think that is actually very harsh with putting them in the tub and shutting the lights off. That will just frighten him and any progress that you have made with him will be in danger because of it. If you are going to do time outs I would suggest the putting him back in his cage and turning the back on him way instead. I personally don't do that myself. If SweetHeart goes to bite I tell her no bite firmly and keep going with whatever I was trying to get her to do. I don't want to tick her off but if I needed her to step up I won't give up till she does. Which I haven't had any problems with yet on that one. What is he doing that you would consider doing time outs for? As for the toys, don't buy any more just yet hon lol. You are getting toy crazy. Put a couple where he spends most of the day. If it is his day cage than place them in there if he doesn't seem afraid of them. He will start exploring them. As for the tags, if they are cardboard you can leave them on there, he will just tear them off and shred them like he would a paper towel roll. The no shoulder is good in your case, he can't be trusted and even the most well trusted bird like I stated above could lose footing and well you just don't need a scar. Yes that very well could be a big problem if he has his own room. I mean it's good if he had others to see all day but they hate to be by themselves. They are flock birds and love the company of someone. Even if you don't have him at work with you, you need to see if your parents would let him stay in the living/family room with them while you are gone, so he can see others and not get stressed out. That could be a big part of it. And yes the sleep cage can be off in another room, but curious as to why if they are both soo big why you are switching him? But I guess if you have the room than it's not a huge deal. But maybe cause he is going from cage to cage and not able to get used to one thing he is stressing a little as well. But the cage by itself for sleep wouldn't be a big deal cause the quieter the better that way they are sure to get their beauty sleep. I'm sure others will be along to give some more help and advice. I am very happy to see though that he is liking the sitting on your arm! See little baby steps is what you need to look at. And seems like you are doing well with him. But IMO I would not do those time outs, that just doesn't seem right to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Hi Zeta, Ronda has given you good advice. Putting your Grey in a scary bath tub and then turning the light off leaving him in total darkness is not a way anyone should treat their Greys or any other Parrot. It would be terrifying to your Grey and would induce fear. As I'm certain you know, Parrots to not relate to punishment. They relate to a firm NO BITE and then place him back in his cage. Repeat this cycle every time he does it. You must judge his responsiveness for yourself. My CAG for example will respond to just a firm NO, eye stare him in the eyes with a firm look and then just set him down on the counter top or wherever he was when the bite occurred. They definitely understand the change in your voice, the word NO and the facial look you have. In regards the two Cages. One should be where you and the family are during waking hours so he can interact with and feel like a part of the flock. A secondary sleep Cage is fine IF he seems to like that arrangement. Does he seem comfortable in his sleep cage or anxious when you take him there? It is of most importance to pay very close attention to his body language in these different environments to determine what may be causing his aggression. As I stated in my earlier post, he could just be testing boundaries right now also at his age and may not be aggressive at all. He could just be checking on what is ok and what is not. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nychsa Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Hi there Zeta, When Bella and I play and horse around she will do that clicking sound and play-bite me. She's particularly frisky in the morning when she first comes out of her cage. I'll open her cage after she wakes me up (going through her entire range of sounds at the top of her lungs until I get up! :laugh: ) When I open her cage she'll come charging out, sit on her cage door and bob her head up and down, she'll give me kisses and then if I reach for her she'll gently grab my finger with her talons and then make that clucking sound and nibble on my finger. When we play in the evening I'll play pinchy feets or pinchy wings or pinchy nose and she'll do the same thing, she'll cluck and gently grab my fingers and nibble on them. Sometimes I'm busy doing something but she wants to play anyway, and she'll follow me around, she'll try to climb up my leg or she'll climb up the side of the furniture and once she gets to me she'll start bobbing her head, making that clucking sound and nibbling on me. I usually play back, hold her way up in the air and flip her over on her back and give her a rasberry on her belly. She play fights back, pulling on my hair. I'll also use paper or a toy to play fight back with her. She'll get into tearing that up and playing tug of war. And she always makes that clucking sound. I make it back and she looks at me very closely and then starts to horse around again. Maybe your little one is playful too? Cheers! Terri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nychsa Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Oh - forgot something - she REALLY has a thing for toes. If she sees bare toes she REALLY gets a charge out of chasing after your feet, making the clucking sound and nibbing on toes! I say 'ow ow ow' and she repeats it after me and continues nibbling my toes! So, with Bella, that clucking sound with me seems like playing. But she also does it when she's in a tiff with my conure Jigme. If they nip at each other she'll make herself tall, puff herself up and make that clucking sound at him. For my own interpretations I've translated that sound into two things - 'I'm play fighting with you' and 'I'm about to open a can of whoop a*z on you!' and I differentiate when she means what by her body language. Whe she's play fighting she will want neck scratches in between and kisses and she has her feathers flat and she just has this sweet look on her face - no pinning of the eyes. But when Jiggy upsets her you can really tell - she blows herself up and she looks at him as if she had darts in her eyes! Cheers! Terri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Lisa, Ronda and Dan have given you some very good advice and I concur with the notion of putting them in the tub and turn out the lights, thats no way to do a timeout, I would think it would further stress them. Then we have Terri who plays sort of rough and play bites with her grey and maybe you have a playful one also, but the body language will tell whether or not this is the case. In any case keep us updated on what is happening and if any of the suggestions work for you and Brody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Yes just as Judy has said please keep us updated and tell us what is working for you. Like myself I have been working with SweetHeart now for almost 4 months, which on a scale really isn't that long, but I have tried many things as everyone here on the forum can tell you lol. So don't let your hopes get down and please remember that time is the key! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatB Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Ouch!!! Oliver just got a chunk of the flesh between my forefinger and thumb!!!! I needed to move him from his play stand to his cage for a bit (can't remember why now, maybe it will come to me when the bleeding stops ). Anyway, I'm so verrrry proud of myself for not giving up. I can't say I didn't flinch, but I did remember to say "No Bite" firmly and stick my hand back up there for more abuse. He got me twice before he unbalanced himself with the fury of his bite and flipped upside down on his perch. By the time he righted himself, he had forgotten he was supposed to be biting me and stepped up nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Very good job Kat, and it is hard not to flinch but at least you didn't give up and he ended up stepping up nicely for you, you go girl!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatB Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Thanks for the encouragement, Judy! It did take everything I had to keep putting my hand in there LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nychsa Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Wow Oliver! That sounds painful Kat!!!! We should see if Dan is making merit bite badges for the Parrot Bite me Club! It sounds like you earned one!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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