When is "a lot" too much

[nevjoe]

Nychsa, I have seen in this post you addressed everyone by name when replying to their comments. Not sure why you seemed to overlooked that with me.

 

As I read your posts in this thread, you seem to want to know nothing. You seems as though you like to persuade people to think as you do, and not of a person who wants any gain of knowledge with issues of importances. You are a very inept person who knows all, and has a mouth of disgust. You probably knew all about everything the minute you were born. You're a pompous ass. You need to own your own site, about dogs and birds.

No offence, you are who you are, and that’s fine. Need not to respond to this OLD man, you are right, what ever you think, or think you know.

 

Not your friend, Joe

[NerfGunWarHero]

Personally, I think that if you want your partner to feel like he can get close to the birds and give them treats without having to run after, you should clip their wings. I have heard several success stories with people being able to gain better control over there birds and then being able to have them flighted afterwards.

 

I know that YOU have control over them, but if your partner doesn't become part of the flock the problem could get worse. Maybe he can try sitting next to the cage, maybe bellas, with the door closed talking quietly to her or reading outloud. Once and while offering her a treat once and a while.

 

Here is an article with a small part about the chair exercise, it maybe help your birds not see him as a threat any longer.

 

http://www.companionparrot.com/fearful%20&%20phobic.htm

[Talon]

Thank you NerfGunWarHero for putting this thread back on track with your advice. That is all why we are all here, isn't it?

 

PLEASE REMEMBER EVERYONE, WE TREAT EACH OTHER WITH RESPECT AND VALUE EVERYONE'S OPINIONS HERE, WHETHER IT BE DIFFERENT OR THE SAME AS OURS.

 

THERE WILL BE NO MORE PERSONAL ATTACKS HERE, OR I WILL CLOSE THIS THREAD.

Thank you to all our contributing members and moderators that were trying to help keep this on topic, and fan the flames.

[Nychsa]

Well Joe, I'm sorry you take offense to my dislike of your son's approach towards me. I wish you and yours luck with your rescue efforts.

[Nychsa]

Hi Nerf,

 

Both Bella and Jiggy's wings are clipped. They can fly short distances. I think that's why Jiggy looks to jump on someone's back for a ride!

 

He does sit next to their cages and talks to them - a lot!

 

But, they can tell they have the upper hand. I'm wondering if there are tiered memberships of the flock - you know, like wolf packs have an alpha couple and then beta wolves etc.. A "pecking order" of sorts! I mean that term came from somewhere no? I wonder if he eventually could become a part of the pack but that they end up ranking him? I think he could be fine with that - he prefers I handle the birds

[Nychsa]

birdmom wrote:

Teri,

 

I have learned that birds have a special heirarchy that is very strong...as do dogs, but I think due to the survival threats to wild birds it must be a bigger deal in the bird world (pecking order?) not too sure....anyway they surely love you and are bonding so well with you! They do it to survive in the wild ...so you are doing the right things. This is a natural learning curve with your birds I think. They will go thru phases, too!

 

ps: I think maybe our Ziggy is just very passionate about the birdies he rescues alot, he may have initially reacted that way becuz, you will notice after a couple years with birds, an amazing number of people that get them, dump them within a year or two due to the very problems you describe, rejection of a partner. So, it is a sensitive issue in the bird rescue community. Not that we think you would do that, but we hope not and I think Ziggy's passion was temporarily misdirected at you becuz he has alot of birds right now, that were dumped by some people that were for lack of a better word, ignorant about birds in particular. For example, I have a second grey, Charlie. I got Charlie from a family, he was in love with the wife, but hated the husband who Charlie viewed as his main rival for Karen. The husband just didn't want to take the time it needed to work it out, and things can settle down a bit after they go thru puberty at around four years. And, they had two dogs, and then got a third, and Charlie the CAG was odd man out at that point, nobody wanted to deal with him, and he had become a biter, attacking anyone who came near his cage, bcuz it was the only area he could control, and he was angry. He got no respect and was approaching the age of four.

 

I hope that may help you to understand Zig's reaction. You will come to understand he is very passionate about the birdies. xo, joanne ps Welcome!

 

Hi there Joanne, Thank you for the welcome and XO right backatcha!

 

I should have gone back and re-read your edited post before I posted my last message! So there is a kind of heirarchy. Is there some cues as to who is ruling the roost? I'm quite familiar with canine behavior - the raised tails, the looks, the posturing etc.. But I'm not sure I see who is in charge between Jiggy and Bella (or is anyone in charge between them???) And is there a specific body language when they view someone as being lower on the pecking order? It seems they toy with my partner, particularly Jiggy. This is all SO interesting!

 

Re: Ziggy's response - well, it's too bad it escalated - I can appreciate being affected by so many animals in dispair being brought to one. But not all new bird families are that irresponsible, and miss directed passions turn the "good families" away as well as the bad ones. That is my main concern - there can never be enough rescue organizations out there for all of the animals in need. That's why it is so important to cultivate, grow and integrate those families that would provide good homes. And I've just seen too many good people be put through hell by viriliant rescue organizations, and have watched how animals are denied a new home because of it.

 

Birds have been a part of our discussion for the past two years, and that discussion wasn't just between my partner and I, it was also with my children, who are grown and could potentially inherit the birds if I pass before the birds do. I'm quite lucky in that my daughter and her husband have a very good relationship with my birds - which is very interesting because they don't see them as much as my partner does! But my daughter is very confident with the birds, and she has this quiet love and patience for them. She enjoys being with them. My son-in-law has that same quiet confidence. In fact, he is the only other person who has ever had Bella on his shoulder! Now granted, Bella was very skeptical and she went from his shoulder all the way down his arm, but hey! She didn't growl once!

 

So, this has been a long and thoughtful process and we have no itention of "getting rid" of the birds because my partner is having some initial bumps in the road. He is the kind of person that believes that once you take that step and invite a living being into your home, that animal is now a part of the family.

 

I think that is why I reacted the way I did to Ziggy's post - because I know my partner's heart, and the thought that he would ever do that to an animal is unthinkable and it hurt that someone would say "he needs to accept that is THEIR house" - he knows that, he advocates for it. Not all people who can't connect with birds would do that to a bird.

 

But - we will work through the issues - I have an entire thread of ideas now - changing the greeting order when he comes home, get him to give them treats continously, get him to sit closer to them etc....

 

Cheers!

Terri

[danmcq]

Hi Terri (Nychsa),

 

Yes, I was in the U.S. Army Air Defense Command. I spent 7 Years in. I know I retained a few terms that still seem appropriate at times and I just like them too. :-)

 

 

It is interesting that your Daughter and Son in Law have a good relationship with your Parrots. You may have hit the nail on the head, in regards your Daughter is confident, versus your Partner is not.

 

As you know, these guys are smart and if they think they can scare an Elephant, they will, just for the fun of watching it react. :-)

 

The best advice I can give, is trial and error using all that suggestions put forward.

 

It will be interesting to track, what you try and it's result. That could be a thread of it's own that could greatly help others in the future. Should they encounter a similar problem.

[Nychsa]

Hi Dan!

 

I think it will be interesting to track. Before getting Bella, I had no idea how many people are afraid of birds, including my partner! I don't think he knew he was this jumpy around birds before we started living wiht the birds as he's quite confident and good with other animals.

 

We're going to start by changing the greeting order when he comes to the house - dogs first (they just ambush him at the door, so that's always going to be the first round of greetings) - birds next - me next (and restrained in front of the birds LOL).

 

I think since Bella's favorite meal is breakfast, I'll prepare it, but I'll have him actually give it to her. If you call her and say 'breakfast' she comes running, so if she hears him doing that - she may connect differently with him.

 

I think he needs to table his contact with Jiggy and focus on Bella - Jiggy is just a little devil and will torment him as best he can. We can work with Jiggy later!

 

I'll also make sure that all of Bella's treats come from my parnter as well. Eventually if he does it often enough, he'll forget about her beak and learn to read her body language.

 

We'll see how this goes! Baby steps - baby steps! I'm lucky that my partner is the kind of person who believes that all relationships take work, and patience. He is willing ot take it slow - and that's a good thing!

 

Cheers!

Terri

[danmcq]

Hi Terri,

 

That sounds like a great plan. :-)

 

Please keep us posted on the progress.

[Dave007]

HEY HEY HEY!!!

Sometimes, a single post can wind up going in way too many directions and people wind up misunderstanding another person or persons' reply or replies because it's hitting on personal beliefs, and passionate people who have any stones at all will reply in a personal and sometimes combative way. Sometimes people need to have the last word because they feel that others will think that the person who doesn't have the last word is the eventual loser in the war of words. This battle isn't gonna come out with a happy ending. Sometimes, personalities conflict with each other. I'm not gonna say who's right and who's wrong. If I did, I should be kicked in the ass. It might sound naive on my part but there comes that time when people who are part of a family of passionate lovers of something such as animals need to call a truce, shake hands and concede that each combatant is both a winner and a loser. In other words, it's a draw. Each person has proven that they love their animals in many different ways. The only subject that doesn't fall into this catagory is one person telling another person that they physically abuse an animal. No one here did that. The world of animal lovers is very much different than the world of electronics lovers. Electronics don't love you back.

As far as these kind of things happening with other people---well, it happened between me and another person on this board. Lots of things were said back and forth. Other people got involved. The subject matter was very serious. I let loose, this other person let loose, other people let go but finally the calm overcame the storm. Back then ,this person and I eventually were BSing with each other on the IM a day or two later and we both had the sense to realize that what happened was yesterday and we realized that today was today and we both hoped that tomorrow was gonna be better than today and yesterday. So, tommorow turned out to be pretty cool. Things were so cool that I tried to date this person. What happened?

1--this girl actually said I was much too old for her.

2--my wife beat the s*hit out of me.

Seriously,the important thing was that we made peace with each other. Without any words being spoken, I knew that I was happy and I'm sure that this other person happy at the outcome. The other important thing was that bygones were just that, bygones. Sometimes, in the battle of the words in the boxing ring of the internet, there comes that time when you have stop listening to your cutman in the corner and try a different approach.

 

Now for Nychsa, from what I've read so far, the problem seems to be the acts of friendliness and acceptance by your bird and your boyfriend. Listen, so what if the bird doesn't like him? Lots of birds don't like certain people for a thousand reasons and you can look at that visa versa.

He comes over every few weeks and stays for a week. Come on now, why is he coming over AND STAYING?? He's interested in your body, not the bird's body and that's important. What if he started coming over and showed your bird a great amount of interest but put you on the back burner?

 

So come on now, this whole thread is just becoming a war of words. It's been stated by the parties that love of animals is important and exists. It's been stated that the parties here feel sadness towards places that have to do drastic things with unwanted neglected animals. It's been stated that the parties here are glad to be a part of their animal's life. Probably, the animals are too.

 

Nychsa, concerning yor question... You wanna know who's the ruler of the roost here. Well, actually I'm the Roost Ruler here. It's well known so it isn't mentioned alot.

You wanna be part of the roost? Well, there are things you have to do.

1--you have to chip in with the rest of the female flock here in order to pay off my mortgage.

2-- you'll need to chip to pay the taxes here.

3--Concerning my food, I only like prime quality foods. True, they're expensive but after all, I am the roost ruler. All the side dishes must be made to my standards. The desserts will be made on a daily basis.

4--My cars..I love my cars therefore you'll have to chip because both of them enjoy high octane fuel. True, gas prices are very high but it's part of the price you'll have to pay to join the roost.

So, These are just a few samples of things you'll have to participate in so that you can be a part of the roost.

For any extra information, just contact Judygram because she'll help you set up a weekly plan schedule. She is the moderator of my roost.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2007/12/17 23:25

[Guest briansmum]

{Feel-good-0002006E} LOLOLOLOL.. well said as usual dave!

 

p.s. my contribution to your mortgage will be a bit late this month.. what with the holidays and all

[KatB]

LOL, I want to be a Roost Ruler! But I want my flock to be males!

[Guest briansmum]

in my house.. i am and they are

[KatB]

Smart lady!

[DebT]

Just finally having the time to read some other posts, and I'm glad I found this one too! I have to tell you that the reason I have my TAG, Cinders, is because his former owner, a woman, got married and her husband was jealous of Cinders. Apparently she tried to return him to the store twice (Cinders, not her husband). The first time she dropped Cinders off she and her new hubby sat in the car and talked for a couple of hours. She finally came back in and retrieved Cinders. The second time, a few months later, she dropped him off for good. I snatched him up right away. My thought was that her husband was insecure and either never had a pet or hobby, or felt threatened if he wasn't always the center of attention.

 

Cinders is really sweet, handsome and a great addition to our family. He has recently become very attached to my 12 year old son. He tends to talk in dialogs, does both parts of old conversations, and it's been a real eye opener! Although I don't know his previous owners, I know a lot about them! (LOL)

 

My other grey, Fawkes, is a female CAG and very attached to me. She will fly off her perch to be with me, but can also play by herself and gets along well with my son and husband. Someone once told me that the reason she picks her feathers is because she's become TOO attached to me, and it's all my fault. But reading these posts makes me feel better, like its okay to love your bird and its not abusive or unnatural to develop a relationship with them.

 

With all the bad things that happen to people and animals in the world, its good to hear that some of us treat their animals well and LOVE them.

[birdmom]

holy toledo Dan..r u commuting from visalia to SJ?

 

My cousin lives in Springville near Tulare, he used to work in SJ but rented a house in Scotts Valley....too far to commute!!!:ohmy:

[Nychsa]

LOL Dave, hmmm, I don't know re: the roost ruling thing - you'll have to convince this guy of that! Dave - meet Jiggy! As far as he's concerned, he rules anything he sees!

 

 

 

<br><br>Post edited by: Nychsa, at: 2007/12/18 04:00

[KatB]

OMG, no wonder your partner is wary of Jiggy. He looks positively dangerous! :lol: But seriously, he is georgeous!

[Nychsa]

LOL Kat - Jiggy just has a Napoleon's complex! He really is a handsome boy and seems to always have this mischievious grin on his face!

[danmcq]

LOL Dave!! I always enjoy your spin on things :-)

 

KatB - Yes, I commute to San Jose from Visalia when they think I "Must" be there to put out the fires or manage my ILL behaved staff at times ;-) I keep telling them I can verbally beat the staff over the phone, just as easily as in person ;-) It is an "Ok" commute though and I stay up here for however many Days each week my illustrious prescence "In-House" is needed.

 

It all boils down to making the $$$ to pay towards the Support of the "Ruler" here.....Dave :-) He keeps the Women all busy cooking (amongst other things) and therefore they can not provide enough monetary support themselves.

 

Terri - Just the sight of Jiggy makes me shudder :ohmy: I thought Jake was BAD to the Bone B)<br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2007/12/18 14:26

[judygram]

Now there is a sight to behold, Dan shuddering at the sight of Jiggy, what a Kodak moment that would be.

 

FYI, Dave does not keep me busy cooking, the bedroom duties keep me occupied as Dave is insatiable!!!!!!!

[ziggy]

Dave you seem to have the herum going on. You sure your not from Utah. HAHAHA!!!!!

 

So how many do you really have? Its OK you can tell us

[Nychsa]

LOL Dan - I'm doing my poor Jiggyman a disservice - here's "pretty-boy" Jiggy

 

[judygram]

He doesn't look so mean in this photo, he looks like a little sweetie but then you can see the devil in his eyes.:evil: Thanks Terri for sharing another photo of Jiggy with us.

[danmcq]

Awww, there's the pretty birdy :-) Thanks Terri.