When is "a lot" too much

[Nychsa]

Greetings Everyone!

 

My partner has started to voice concerns that Bella is WAY too attached to me, and that I should encourage her to back off a bit. I'm not perceiving a problem with our relationship as we both seem to get a good deal out of it.

 

He is specifically concerned that she follows me around all over the house. She either flies to where I am, or she waddles over to me. She doesn't necessarily want to climb up on my shoulder all the time, she is content exploring things on the floor, or riding on my foot. But she also likes to "hang out" with the dogs. In fact, if either of the dogs leaves the room, both Bella and my conure "call" them. In the evening she sits with me in front of the TV and we snuggle and chat. She also joins me in my meditation practices (I'm a Buddhist and do daily meditation practices). In fact, she seems to really enjoy that - I had to make a little hanging bag that I drap around my neck for her to sit in as she tries to sit on my chest whn I practice, and seh slips of fall the time.

 

So, yes - we do spend a lot of time together, but she is also quite good at playing on her own, and spends a good deal of time playing in her space with her toys.

 

So, is there such a thing as "too much" if everyone is having a good time?

[danmcq]

There is nothing wrong with that Nychsa. She loves you and wants be involved where you are. :-)

 

If you have that kind of constant schedule with her, it totally ok.

[Talon]

Sounds like a very loving and content grey. You should consider yourself lucky to have such a special bond with her. She in my mind, is perfectly normal!

[judygram]

Terri, if you are comfortable with it then by all means continue with it, you are very lucky to have such a devoted grey, many here would love to have your problem.

[Nychsa]

Dan, Talon,

 

Thank you very much. Your response actually brought a tear to my eyes! I was staring to feel terribly conflicted by my partner's input. The way things are with Bella and I feels "right" and neither of us seem to have a problem with it, and if we continue like this, I don't think it will become a problem.

 

Talon, I am lucky that she is so content. The breeders where I got her are two nurses and they really nurture all the babies they raise - it is an incredibly loving environment. When she came to me she already was very loving, knew how to "step up" and know "no bite".

 

Thanks again for the feedback - it is really a relief to have a "grey" community to chat with about these "growing" issues!

 

Cheers!

Terri

[Nychsa]

Judy,

 

Thank you for your response. My partner isn't here at the house all the time. He's here every other week. So, maybe he's feeling like the odd man out as Bella and Jiggy are quite different then dogs are - they are much more specific about who they understand as "their flock".

 

He's been unable to help me understand the exact concern he has - he just says "well, she's just really fixated on you" - but really can't say why that's a problem.

 

Again, thank you for the response. Unless it harms Bella in anyway, I'm going to continue the way we are.

 

Cheers!

Terri

[judygram]

I'd say he is a little jealous of the closeness of the two of you and that is understandable since he is not there all the time like you are but it won't harm her unless something happens that you can't be around her much. They do get used to the attention and if that changes then it could become a problem. But if I were you I would do the same thing, enjoy her.

[Nychsa]

Judy - understood re: not having time all of a sudden - but I think I'm lucky in that I determine my own schedule and can spend time with the animals. The only time I would be concerned is when I go on retreat in the summer for four weeks. I think during that time I'll board them with the ladies where I got Bella. I think they would be able to help the birds overcome any separation anxiety.

[judygram]

Four weeks is a long time to be away but that certainly helps that you can board them with the people you got Bella from, I'm sure she will miss you terribly and vice versa but the ladies will be able to handle it.

[ziggy]

Hello Nychsa,

It is great that you and your grey have a great friendship and have bonded well. You are very lucky for greys are not the most effectionet birds. There is a differance from being spoiled to being over loving. This sounds like he is very spoiled. That is a good thing. But not in all cases. You have company and the bird is always wanting to be on you and you cant entertain because he is always wanting you. You put hiom in the cage for a diner party and then he starts screaming so you give in and let him out. The bird wins. You have to make him know that NO is NO when you need time for yourself. I am not saying you are doing anything wrong but even you will need time for yourself sometimes. You are lucky like I said people that own greys would kill for a bird like this. But he has pushed his weight around and now you need to play a little rough with him. You lost control of the bird and he runs the roost. You need to take that control back before it gets even worse for you.( not saying it is a bad thing all together). Good luck with him and enjoy him forever.

[Nychsa]

Hi Ziggy,

 

Thank you for your response - point well taken. I will be cautious of any bratty kind of behavior as it relates to wanting to be with me.

 

As of right now, Bella isn't acting bratty when I need to do things without her. If I have to leave or do something else where I can't have her on my shoulder or hold her I will get her interested in one of her toys by hiding a treat in them, or put things in her foraging cups. She's so curious about everything, she's instantly interested in what I did with her toys, and then she starts playing and I can close the door of her cage.

 

As for people coming over - she's shy around people she doesn't know. She prefers to stay in her area and space and not be around strangers. I had a group of people over for an HOA meeting and everyone wanted to see Bella, but she stayed in her cage behind her hanging toys. She did come out but then when people approached her she flew to my male greyhound and sat with him. If I'm not in the room, she goes to the dogs if she feels uncomfortable.

 

So, we're ok for now - I will keep my eye on her behavior though and make sure she doesn't get bratty if she can't be with me.

 

Thanks again!

Terri

[lovemyGreys]

Terri it sounds to me as if you have a wonderful relationship with your grey, you carry on the way you are going,You have a content & happy bird there Just make sure you are always the boss in the relationship

[loviechick]

I think it's understandable that your Grey is more bonded to you, especially considering that you sound like the "primary" caregiver being that your partner isn't there all the time. I unfortunately can't give the best information here, as I live alone, so my fids are forced to love me:laugh: That and your bird might just start perferring females over males in general, and that might be something that your partner will have to consider. These birds are known for that! Good luck!

[Nychsa]

Hi there Tracy!

 

Yes, Bella has tested the waters a bit as far as seeing if I'm the boss - we have on going debates around the window shades and why they are not toys. Sometimes I have to put her in her cage for a little time out when she's playing that game with me LOL!

[Nychsa]

Hi there Lovie!

 

You know we were wondering of Bella prefers women over men - but when my son in law was here he was really the only other person to establish a connection with her and she even sat on his shoulder, which was VERY surprising for all of us! So, it doesn't seem to be a male/female thing - maybe she recognized a fellow aviator in my son-in-law - he's a pilot LOl!

[nevjoe]

Hi Nychsa. It seems I have the same problem with my Hemingway. I do know, I am hard working to solve the problem. Yes, it's a problem for our birds, not us owners. I have forced myself to keep him on his cage to learn how to play with himself. I am home most and so on. They have done MUCH better since I have let them fend for themselves. Don’t get me wrong; they still are a great part of my life on a daily basis with all their antics of the day with my birds, and I WAS their only form of fulfillment of fun, time, friend. I love that Hemingway is playing more, and more with objects instead of just with my daughter and me. To put it plainly, he needs a hobby.

Joe

[Nychsa]

Well,the birds certainly have changed the dynamics of our household here and I'm afraid my partner is drawing the short end of the stick :huh:

 

While his concerns were around Bella becoming too attached to me, I think his new concerns may be that the birds - collectively - have defined what the flock is and he's not in it! :ohmy:

 

While watching TV together, with Bella cuddling with her head under my chin, my conure, Jigme (aka Jiggyman)who always likes to stir the pot, decided he was going to try to chase my partner off the couch my sneaking up on him by way of the back of the couch, jumping up on him and biting his ear. I recommended to my partner he scootch Jiggy along with his hand and push him back to me. As he raised his hand over Jiggy, my sleeping beauty Bella all of a sudden let out a fierce growl clearly letting him know he better not touch Jiggy! So, while Jiggy and Bella fuss all day long, nipping at each other's tails, she defends him if someone "outside" the flock tries to touch him!

 

Does anyone have a sense of how something like this turns out - in other words, do you think my partner has a chance of becoming accepted as a "flock member" one of these days?

 

 

Terri

[danmcq]

Nychsa wrote:

Does anyone have a sense of how something like this turns out - in other words, do you think my partner has a chance of becoming accepted as a "flock member" one of these days?

Terri

 

Wow, your partner has definitely become the outsider.:ohmy:

 

You may need to change up the daily routine a little to include your partner, when he is home, as a key person in both your Parrots feeding and cage exiting activities. I know you mentioned he is gone every other week, so this may be near impossible to accomplish in a relatively short time. It seems they may be viewing him as an occasional "visitor" rather than a true flock member.

 

Perhaps you could try having your partner bring the two out of their cages for example and also feeding them, giving them treats Etc..

 

This definitely calls for him becoming a person they rely upon and therefore must interact with at a much more social level.

 

Otherwise, you had better stock up on your band-aid supply <br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2007/12/16 15:19

[Nychsa]

Hi Dan!

 

Thank you for the recommendations - the problem is my partner is uneasy about touching the birds. He's afraid he'll get bitten - he's particularly worried about Bella's beak. He watched some Macaws one time tear up a 2 by 4 and since then he's had a very healthy respect of a Parrot's bitting power. It doesn't help that he read up on all things African Greys when I first brought Bella home, and one of the articles he read was the amount of power behind their bite. To me this is such an incredible concern because Bella is by far the most docile creature I've ever lived with! Even when she lets Jiggy have it, she does so with such restraint. He does give them treats, particularly Bella, but she can tell by his body language that he is doing so with great trepidation (heck I can tell by his body language!) and she plays on that.

 

While my partner doesn't live here, he's here every other week for one week. The dogs view him as part of the "pack" and I think he was hoping the birds would accept him too. He really likes birds, he just doesn't want to have physical contact with them!

 

Thanks again for the feedback - we can get him to feed them, but pick them up - hmmm.. I think that won't work.

 

Cheers!

Terri

[ziggy]

It can work, your partner has to be dedicated to make it work. If he works with your birds and not be affraid of getting nipped he will make some progress. The key is to make friends with the bird and to have the birds trust him. He needs to make the conection with them. That is THEIR home and he needs to make the first move to show them he is a visitor and not a threat to there home. You need to make the choice to tell your partner,to make the first move to make it work between them. It is your house so your partner has to except that you have the birds in your life all the time and not only every other week. He is the one that has to respect their home as well as your home. The sad thing is that the birds are the ones that are always the ones that get the bad wrap. ( not so in your case ). A new baby comes, or a move is coming,or how about the owner dies and the kids dont want the bird. All of these things are taken out on the birds. You as a respectable pet owner need to make the desision when you buy a pet,I dont care what kind of pet that you get you need to make changes in YOUR life to make them feel loved, and not just get rid of pets because its easy to do. Pets have feeling and need to be treated with respect. If people can not have that kind of dedication to the pet then DONT GET ANY PETS. I go to dog shelters and want to cry when I see all the dogs that are up for adoption and when they are not adopted they are put to sleep. Did you know that 80% of dogs in the shelters are from people that just dont want them any longer. Not that they were lost or got out of the yard but because there owners have other things that are more important to them. They should have not got the dogs in the first place. This goes even more for birds. Do the reaserch before you get a bird. They will most likly out live you and you need a life long dedication to these long living pets. 100 years is a long time to have a pet but if you know this going into it you can make the choice before you purchase. This post was not directed to you Nychsa just in general. Alot of people just dont understand pets because they cant express themselfs. They can let you know what is wrong. But like everything else in this world it is just to easy to get rid of something just because you can. That even goes with us humans we get tired of or spouse and what we can just get a divorse because we can so easily. Its a shame that we can not learn to make the proper adjustments in our lives to make it right for each other, and for all of the pets that would love to be in a loving and caring home.<br><br>Post edited by: ziggy, at: 2007/12/16 16:50

[judygram]

Terri, your partner is going to have to get over the fear of getting bitten if he wants to be able to have the birds enjoy his company as well as they do yours. They pick up on his fear and run with it and until he can overcome that fear he won't be able to handle them like you do. Ziggy has given you some good advice so put it to good use and see how it goes.

[Nychsa]

Ziggy,

 

That certainly was a mouthful. I'm not sure why you wrote that in response to my post as what you describe is about as far removed from who I am as it can get.

 

I'm not really going to respond to this any further as I don't have a need to defend who I am or who my partner is.

 

R/N

[Nychsa]

Hi there Judy,

 

I think the way this is going to play out is that my partner will give them treats and enjoy them from afar (he loves watching them when he's sitting at the kitchen table). But, I think his fear is too deep seated and he won't touch them for some time to come. Jiggy is such a little Devil he jumps on them!

 

As for Ziggy's advice - I didn't read that as advice, I read that as a rant. My partner and I are animal lovers who go well out of our way to take care of the animals. He would NEVER deny the birds their place in this house, and I deeply resented the patronizing and condenscending tone of Ziggy's post insinuating I needed that kind of "lecture". I've spent most of my life rescuing animals, and granted today - I focus mainly on greyhounds and now birds. In that past that included wolves through programs that I was involved in at Duke University. I don't need someone ranting and raving at me.

 

R/Terri

[Nychsa]

Ziggy,

 

After my initial reaction to your post, I realize do want to respond - in particular, I'd like to share why what you wrote rang so offensively with me:

 

Many rescue organizations, particularly within the greyhound community have viriliant, pontificating, soap box loving members who absolutely take as their primary responsibility the duties of imposing their "superior" animal loving morality on to prospective greyhound families.

 

This has had a toxic effect in the greyhound rescue community as prospective families do not appreciate being condenscended to, and made to feel as if they needed to defend themselves for simply wanting to rescue a greyhound! I too wanted to cry when I was at the vet and this lovely lady with a Dobby sat down next to me and admired my hounds and said she so badly wanted to rescue one, but she was treated so badly by the rescue organization, she couldn't bring herself to deal with these people - she rescued a Dobby instead. Did you know 20,000 greyhounds each year are put down simply because they can't perform on the track and no homes are avaialbe for them?? How do you like that statistic! And when self righteous rescue people turn off potential adopters with a pontificating and condenscending attitude, my heart breaks - because one more greyhound is sentanced to death because some jerk has to feed his/her ego by pretending to have the ultimate lease on being an animal lover.

 

I am a VIRILIANT advocate for the hounds and when ever I encounter this kind of approach, I think I resemble my Bella CAG with my hair standing up the way she raises her feathers when I try to sweep up her food droppings around her! And your post reminded me TOO much of these people who run around putting everyone on the defensive.

 

This board thus far has been a fabulous experience. The people here thus far have had open hearts, and minds and are wonderful in terms of sharing their resources and their knowledge. People will only take advantage of that if they feel they have a safe environment in which to ask. If you start pontificating away at people, you will turn people away, and who knows what happens to the animals then! I won't be turned away because of what you would write to me, but someone else who is less feisty may just simply leave and never return to ask those critical questions that may save a bird's life.

 

I'm done with my soap box, do you want to use it for a while? LOL!

Terri

[danmcq]

Nice post Terri :-)

 

It is sad to hear the Greyhound rescue mission has become so self righteous.

 

I have been rescuing Dobermans for 10 years and know how important each breed specific mission is.

 

It is understandable, why you are sensitive to this area. I may be may be wrong, but I have a hard time believing Ziggy was trying to do anything other than help. But, then got off the original topic and on to the rescue subject he is so actively involved in. :-)