Maunaolu Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 I've been out of the loop the past month for various reasons and am sad this is the post that brings me back to this forum. Here's what happened so everyone else can be forewarned. I was preparing dinner with my CAG, Monte, sitting on my shoulder. He had already eaten some carrots and spinach and had proven to be very curious about everything I was eating. I was peeling garlic cloves and he became very interested. He crawled down my shirt, hopped onto my arm and sidestepped out to my wrist to to try to grab a clove to taste. He seemed pretty keen to taste it and I thought it best to check to see whether it's safe. The 3 books I read and various posts here and there state the big dangers are - avocados, chocolate, coffee beans - with the other assortment of fruit seeds, alcohol, etc. I was in the kitchen and didn't want to run to my office to check on-line for garlic. So I put Monte on the counter and looked up "parrot garlic food" on google on my blackberry. This website was the first to come up: http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww56e.htm I scrolled down to garlic and read the paragraph. I summarise the key lines below that I believed: "Garlic is helpful in the prevention of illness caused by viral, fungal, and bacterial pathogens...Fresh garlic, rather than concentrated forms such as garlic powder, should be offered to parrots...One clove from a regular size bulb of garlic (not an entire bulb of many cloves) given two or three times a week is sufficient as a preventive food supplement for parrots, who love the pungent taste. Leave the peeling on so that the birds can unwrap their aromatic and medicinal food gift from Mother Nature." After reading this and assuming this website was informed, I gave Monte one unpeeled clove. He immediately chomped it up, letting the larger pieces fall to the countertop. I sweeped them away and put him back in his cage next to his water bowl. Two days later Monte was found dead in the bottom corner of his cage. I had a necropsy performed by my local avian vet who reported that all vital organs were normal, there was digested material in the intestines, there were several undigested pieces of what he considered to be garlic in the stomach and the portion of the mid-intestine immediately following the stomach had turned gangrene, ulcerated and perforated (the lab tech described it as being black). His diagnosis was a ruptured bowel and secondary perotinitis that killed him. He could not pinpoint the cause but looking at the crop and stomach contents and the fact that the garlic was the only undigested matter - he believes the garlic was the cause. My bird was about six months old. Needless to say, I only had Monte for six weeks and he was starting to take his place in my life and household. I am pretty distraught and will just set aside all his toys, cage, etc for a while and decide when I may get another one. As far as the website is concerned, I have always looked at the internet as a turbulent sea that needs to be navigated between fact and misinformation. I'd be interested to know what others may have experienced with garlic and whether they know anything more specifically about this website and/or its author Carolyn Swicegood. I will be sending her an email as well regarding my unfortunate experience. I hope to rejoin this community again under better spirits. Mahalo - Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmycoop2005 Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 That is horrible, I am very sorry to hear this. Thanks for the warning though. I was like you though, I had only ready about coffee, chocolate, avocado and such. Sorry again for your loss:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevjoe Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Wow, I'm sorry for your loss. This was so sad for you and your family. This is, no way your fault and the info you gave might save other birds. Thank You, Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovemyGreys Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Martin what a very sad story,i am so sorry for your loss & my thoughts are with you. A lesson has to be learnt from this tragic story,i for one will avoid feeding garlic to my greys.I always believed it to be safe in small quantities as many other foods we feed our greys.The only information i know is that garlic belongs to a family of plants that can cause anemia in some animals if given in large amounts for long periods of time. On reflection of this sad story & a little research i will now no longer feed garlic to my greys,please air on the side of caution if you are feeding garlic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makena Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Martin, I am so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine what you must be going through. I will definitely be keeping garlic away from Makena. You are so right about the internet, separating fact from fiction is a tricky thing. Thank you so much for posting this information as there is a good chance it will save many grey's lives. Again I am so sorry about Monte. My heart goes out to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 oh no what an heart breaking story im so very sorry to hear this and i really do feel for you!but thanx for sharing this as we can all be aware of garlic in the future:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeasarsDad Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 My heart breaks to read this story. I guess you never know what might affect a living organism While Garlic might be OK for 99% of all Greys that eat it there is always the possiblility that it will cause a reaction. Much like Peanuts do with certain humans. It's tragic when things like this happen. One thing I would tell is that you didn't cause this and did everything you could assure your Grey was eating safe foods. My advice to you would be to buy another bird ASAP. Ask me how I know this. Yes, in fact I lost 2 of the most loved pets I ever had. A European Starling named Hercules and a Dusky Conure named Sammy. I still have a heart ache because of those deaths.. But you MUST go on and give your love to another creature. You might even find that things happen for a reason in life. I know I found this out myself. Cd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Martin, I am so sorry to hear of your loss, and it hurts no less for the fact that you had him for only a short time, we can fall in love deeply and quickly. Do not blame yourself for Monte's loss, you believed garlic was safe for him and in this case it was not, but like CD said, things happen for a reason and a long life was not meant for Monte. Please do get another grey, I believe you have a lot of love to give and it would be a shame not to lavish it on another one, somewhere out there is another grey needing a home and sometimes the best way to heal that hole in your heart is to fill it with the love of another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Hello Maunaolu, My condolences to you in this time of grief and mourning. Know that you were a good provider and it could have been the Garlic or something else that your Grey previously ate and passed that did the intestinal perforation previous to the Garlic. Thanks for having a necropsy performed and sharing the warning regardig Garlic. It will never touch Dayo's Beak. I hope we hear from you again. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 I am so sorry to hear that. So much of the info I know (or think I know) about greys and their diet is random, stuff that I think I might have read or heard. In the case of garlic, I think I read that it's not good, also that onion is not good. Thank you for sharing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Martin, my heart breaks for you. You had no way on knowing. You did all the research you could, it's such a tragic loss. But I agree with the others, you have so much love to share, go find that special bird waiting for you to love it. He or she is out there, and it is meant to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggy Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Well words dont even begin to say how sorry I am for your loss. You know with us having a zoo in my home I can tell you that you fall in love with a pet and it becomes like another child to you. So when GOD takes you little companion from you it hurts so much but you have to say it is in a much better place. I agree dont put the blame on yourself you did the research and were misleaded into thinking it was O.K. to feed it to your grey. Please dont give up there are so many other birds that need a loving home and you sound like you can give another little angel a great home. Please also take into mind dont replace you bird with the thought of replacing the one you lost, but getting a new pet. You can never replace the one you lost. My wife did this when she lost her dalmation, It can never replace but it may fill the void in you heart. What ever way you go I wish you luck. You will make the right choice from your heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest briansmum Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 i am so sorry to hear this news, my heart breaks for you. thankyou for sharing your story with us, i too will be avoiding garlic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronda477 Posted November 19, 2007 Share Posted November 19, 2007 Wow Martin mine is 6 months as well and garlic is a big thing in our house. I grew up in an Italian home so we always use it in about everything! Sooooo sorry for what happened. I hope you will join us again although nothing will take the place of your little Mahalo. Sorry again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loviechick Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 OMG how incredibly tragic!!! My heart goes out to you, thank you for the warning! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DweamGoiL Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 I am very sorry this happened. It is truly heart-breaking and I am hoping you and your family can move on from it and welcome another bird in your home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maunaolu Posted November 30, 2007 Author Share Posted November 30, 2007 I'd like to thank everyone who posted their condolences and sent support. This situtaion is just very unfortunate. I have not heard anyone else having similar problems with garlic. It's possible that Monte's young age could have been a factor. I also never received a response from the author of the referenced website - Carolyn Swicegood. I appreciate the kind words. I will be sure to check in and also let you know when I get a new bird. Happy Holidays! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Please do check in Martin and when you get your new bird be sure to let us know, we want to know how you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dblhelix Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Thanks for sharing this difficult experience with us. This trajic event has served value in alerting other owners to this possibility. Whether it was Monte's age, or if he had an allergy to garlic, or if he just consumed too much at once I guess we will never know. I will say with hind site, raw garlic is pretty harsh. I know if I eat some it kinda burns. Our birds are small and maybe it was just overload for a youngster? In any event, you did nothing wrong and could not have known. I extent my condolences for your loss and look forward to your future participation here, hopefully with a new addition when you are ready. Best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kibibi Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 That's very sad. I'm sorry to hear about your story but I'm grateful that you shared your story. I noticed some time ago that some avian publications listed it as safe and other sources listed it as unsafe. So my site lists garlic as "Garlic is listed as SAFE on some lists and UNSAFE on other lists. It appears that either a large quantity (I don't know how "large" is defined) or a lot of small quantities would be required to cause problems. Just to be safe, you may want to avoid garlic." I guess this is a lesson to all of us, if something is questionable then we should just avoid it. Have you sent Birds-N-Ways an email? Even though the necropsy wasn't conclusive, they may want to add a note to their article. Thank you for sharing your experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 That is terrible news. I'm soo sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdmom Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I am so sorry. I can't thank you enuf for telling us. I just read the same info on birds n way a few weeks ago and I bought some fresh garlic to give my birds. I only tried once, they didn't eat it, so I am not going to give it to them anymore. Please don't blame yourself and feel guilty, owning a Parrot is a big learning experience for all of us. But, you can try again, maybe give a rescue bird a home? Our condolences, joanne buddi and charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sandy1 Posted December 8, 2007 Share Posted December 8, 2007 Oh i am so sorry to hear that.I am like you i look up alot of info on greys on the net and you assume they now alot.I guess the best info to get would be from a bird breeder or here or a vet. I know that he will be always in your heart.not easy lossing a member of your family if they are 2 legs or 2 wings. sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICERAT4 Posted December 8, 2007 Share Posted December 8, 2007 CeasarsDad wrote: My heart breaks to read this story. I guess you never know what might affect a living organism While Garlic might be OK for 99% of all Greys that eat it there is always the possiblility that it will cause a reaction. Much like Peanuts do with certain humans. It's tragic when things like this happen. One thing I would tell is that you didn't cause this and did everything you could assure your Grey was eating safe foods. My advice to you would be to buy another bird ASAP. Ask me how I know this. Yes, in fact I lost 2 of the most loved pets I ever had. A European Starling named Hercules and a Dusky Conure named Sammy. I still have a heart ache because of those deaths.. But you MUST go on and give your love to another creature. You might even find that things happen for a reason in life. I know I found this out myself. Cd +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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