Wait for an invite before petting

[Bigwick70]

Just wanted to throw something out there that I heard and have experienced for the Grey Owners out there with Biting Birds... This Forum helped me Tremendously when I first got "Wilbur" and was struggling with the cuts and hurt feeling that come with them from the bird you so desperately want to adore you. It's all about watching their body languish, as I was told... I noticed with Wilbur if I bring my hand in from the side, so he could see my hand clearly, and then pet his head or scratch, it made him feel more at ease. He leans his head into my hand inviting me to scratch. Sometimes he likes to be mischievous and gently nips, and sometimes he likes being scratched, and sometimes he just doesn't want to be messed with. When he feels like this, now he pecks me instead of grabbing on for dear life and trying to rip my finger off lol. We have came a long way. There is a mutual respect now. I used to press the issue causing him to no doubt think he had to respond this way. He cant tell me. It's fight of Flight. You might try this. Usually Wilbur will lean his head in to my hand when he sees it, if he wants to be scratched. If he just sits there like he's undecided, Don't do it! He's thinking BACK OFF DUDE and I can tell he's thinking this... I'm by far, no expert now but I know someone is having this problem also...

[katana600]

Early on, I read that a grey is very subtle in their body language. Just as you say with Wilbur, a slight leaning in is his subtle clue that its okay to get closer. When their subtle clues are not heeded they resort to not-so-subtle and often shocking bites. The problem is once that is what they consider the most effective way to get the point across, it becomes a first line of defense rather than a last resort. It takes a lot of patience, forgiveness and keen observation to learn your grey's subtle clues. Congratulations on learning Wilbur's cues. It takes a long long time to undo the damage when someone else pushed the boundaries too far too soon. Our rehomed grey has taken 2 1/2 years with her previous caretaker and 3 1/2 years with me to just start considering to offer that subtle invite. Thanks for bringing this up.

[Bigwick70]

So very welcome. This brings a memory of trying the first thing I read on him. It said on google to use a spray bottle and spray him when he nips. DEFINATLY THE WRONG THING TO DO. Poor Wilbur. It's a wonder he ever trusted me again. Alot of bad information out there 4 sure. Now, he never gets too rough with me. Even when he's telling me to back off with actions (The "peck" I mentioned).

[Acappella]

I've seen that spray bottle advice as well. Thank goodness this group was the first resource I found when I was thinking about re-homing Dorian. Training techniques that might work with dogs or cats just do not carry over to parrots. I'm glad that you were able to step back and observe his body language before there was long- term damage done to his ability to trust, and that you have found a way to interact that is rewarding for both of you. Well done!

[Bigwick70]

Yes I love this site also. This is the greatest. My and Wilburs relationship changed over night it seemed when I found this site. LOL he still wont go near water though and id say he has flashbacks thanks to me...Poor Feller...

I've seen that spray bottle advice as well. Thank goodness this group was the first resource I found when I was thinking about re-homing Dorian. Training techniques that might work with dogs or cats just do not carry over to parrots. I'm glad that you were able to step back and observe his body language before there was long- term damage done to his ability to trust, and that you have found a way to interact that is rewarding for both of you. Well done!

[Bigwick70]

I never dreamed these birds were so intelligent. Like little ornery children sometimes

[Timbersmom]

I've had Timber for almost 2.5 years now. A couple of weeks ago, I had my first bite in almost a year. Yes, I got careless and wasn't watching the "signals" he was putting out. I think he has resigned himself to the fact that I'm a "slow learner"

[Bigwick70]

Me and Wilbur have had so many arguments that I think he likes to fuss with me and I notice him luring me in and playing like he wants to bite me, then he will lick me or barely nip. But, the slightest hint of a nip and my hand is out of there! He can and has really caused me to bleed bad at times. Over all though, I know we got a great bird who needed us just as bad as we needed him. Especially after hearing some of the horror stories on here. lol... I swear I think he enjoys it... He climbs all over my son though and nips at his nose and eyes and he lets Wilbur bite him and he doesn't hurt him. He can reach right in the cage and take Wilbur out and he doesn't try to bite at all. I just cant trust him like that now. My nerves wont let me lol... They are really powerful birds if they want to be. My son says its where we are afraid of him. He says "Just grin and bare it". I'm like "Yea right dude, not into letting a vice with a punch clamp down on me lmbo... Looks like a murder scene when he's done with me lol...

[Bigwick70]

I cant put my finger n it but I since something that troubles Wilbur. He doesn't talk alot and he likes to be in his cage most of the time. He likes to intimidate too. The previous owners just put him outside on a patio and forgot about him I heard. I heard somewhere that isolation like that will make them antisocial. He just doesn't talk like the small bird. He will say "By, I love you" in my voice if he sees us leaving, sometimes, and sometimes he will answer the phone if it rings with "Hello", But mostly he doesn't say anything. He makes alot of beeping microwave oven noises too but not often. The small bird you cant shut up lol. I would hate to think something I could do is preventing his happiness? Really my son is the only person that he messes with...

[Inara]

What a great update on Wilbur. I wouldn't worry about him talking or not talking much. Some greys do and some don't. Some are more social, some prefer more time alone. As you've already figured out, they're not one size fits all. As long as he is healthy, allow him to call the shots about socializing. There are days when all HRH Inara wants to do is be out, out, out. Other days, like the past couple, she just wants to come out for breakfast then hang out quietly in her cage.

 

My first CAG was very isolated and abused for years before coming to live with me, and he was far from antisocial after he settled in and figured out that he was not going to get the same treatment as in his past home. He was, not, however as social as Inara but he really did enjoy daily time out upon my shoulder while I was studying or typing up papers and he never missed a beat when it came to observing the household activities from his lofty perch where he preferred to be for most hours of the day.

 

Relax, don't over analyze and just enjoy Wilbur for Wilbur

[Bigwick70]

Thanks everyone for the advise on our Wilbur. Yes I have figured out that it is his way or the highway LOL. If I notice something that is a problem I try to address it to make his life easier but I am really still ignorant as to their care, as you can see with me taking him outside without a harness. He is as our Child and we really let him by with anything. His cage door is never shut unless he is in "Timeout" and that's not often. To be honest, I cant bare to think he was neglected some way and punish him anyway. Broke my heart when I found out I was hurting him with the spray bottle thing... What got me taking him out without a harness was, my Mother has a friend that has an "Amazon" and she said she would let her's go out as he wished. She said her friends would tell her about seeing him out in town in Logan, WV, perched on a telephone line or something lol. Although I never intended to let him have that much freedom. Not such a good idea I guess... Feel free everyone to give us all the advise you wish. It is GREATLY appreciated...

What a great update on Wilbur. I wouldn't worry about him talking or not talking much. Some greys do and some don't. Some are more social, some prefer more time alone. As you've already figured out, they're not one size fits all. As long as he is healthy, allow him to call the shots about socializing. There are days when all HRH Inara wants to do is be out, out, out. Other days, like the past couple, she just wants to come out for breakfast then hang out quietly in her cage.

 

My first CAG was very isolated and abused for years before coming to live with me, and he was far from antisocial after he settled in and figured out that he was not going to get the same treatment as in his past home. He was, not, however as social as Inara but he really did enjoy daily time out upon my shoulder while I was studying or typing up papers and he never missed a beat when it came to observing the household activities from his lofty perch where he preferred to be for most hours of the day.

 

Relax, don't over analyze and just enjoy Wilbur for Wilbur

[Bigwick70]

[video=youtube_share;pcJ7DemjDXQ]

[katana600]

You have a great attitude with Wilbur. That video shows trust on both sides. I get what you mean about the occasional bite and bloodletting. Something we talk about on this forum is grey time. I could kind of understand when I had my first two babies, but I really have been getting a lesson with Miss Gilbert. We have had three and a half years together and I could not reach out to her yet as you do with Wilbur. You have had a short time together in relation to the decades you will have together. Don't beat up on yourself about the spray bottle. You looked for advice, you got bad advice and you recognized it wasn't helpful. Then you changed. My favorite quote from Maya Angelou is "we did what we knew and when we knew better we did better". There really is no way of knowing how or why a grey chooses their favorite person. Another thing us, that can change. Keep doing the things that bring you closer. Also early on with a parrot who can't fly due to damaged wings, I might have thought it was okay to get her outside for fresh air with me. Then through our forum I saw hawks attack a beloved pet. Also even though Miss Gilbert hasn't flown in six years or more, it isn't written in stone that she can't. An adrenaline rush at the same time as an updraft of wind and I could lose her and the agony of thinking of her helpless in a wilderness of predators would be too painful to risk. You are the right home for Wilbur. You are learning right along with him. As far as being quiet, if its been his nature, I wouldn't be concerned. Miss Gilbert talks but its sporadic, not chatting all day. If he was usually chatty and suddenly quiet, not eating well etc. that's more of a concern that he could be ill.

[kins2321@yahoo.com]

How old is Wilbur? I watched the video. BEAUTIFUL feathers, by the way. His stance in the cage was guarded, but his eyes weren't pinning. Makes me think Wilbur trusts you so far, but that mutual trust needs to continue to grow. You are doing an excellent job! Love how your son has bonded. Mine did too. Some kids are scared, some not.My kids picked her up from day one, never hesitated. Neither ever got a bite. Just a suggestion... have your son pickup wilbur, then practice flying " away" from cage. Your son to " send off", you to receive. I am a firm believer of practicing things away, if not " off" the cage.( door).You should be proud that you can put your hand in the cage! Most cannot.Greys are very territorial... so try and remove that stress by practicing and teaching away from cage. Nancy

[Bigwick70]

Nancy,

No we never tried this before but We will. The previous owners said he was around 10. Thanks for the complements on him and me, makes me feel like a good Dad lol. There's not alot of room in our house but we will try this. Reminds me when I first got him, He could fly great, was the landing he had trouble with lol. He would take off and go till he hit something . I was scared to death he would hurt himself. He would try to skid across our tile kitchen floor usually so he could slide in gently against the wall LMBO. I still see him doing that in my memory. Too Funny... He's since gotten good at it, turning corners in the house in flight till he lands where he wants. No doubt it was where he never had exercise on the patio in his cage constantly.

My Son lets him bite his fingers but Wilbur never bites him hard. Wilbur gets so very excited when he sees my son (Jeremiah). He will flap his wings and move his head back and forth like an Egyptian lol. He totally Adores our son and if he hears his voice he has to get out to go to him.

I usually test Wilbur to see if he wants to step up and come to me. If he doesn't, he will lower his head to block me, and if he does, he doesn't hesitate to raise his head and a leg to climb up. He does this when he feels like it though, on his terms. My Son can reach in and get him anytime though and not get a nip even...

How old is Wilbur? I watched the video. BEAUTIFUL feathers, by the way. His stance in the cage was guarded, but his eyes weren't pinning. Makes me think Wilbur trusts you so far, but that mutual trust needs to continue to grow. You are doing an excellent job! Love how your son has bonded. Mine did too. Some kids are scared, some not.My kids picked her up from day one, never hesitated. Neither ever got a bite. Just a suggestion... have your son pickup wilbur, then practice flying " away" from cage. Your son to " send off", you to receive. I am a firm believer of practicing things away, if not " off" the cage.( door).You should be proud that you can put your hand in the cage! Most cannot.Greys are very territorial... so try and remove that stress by practicing and teaching away from cage. Nancy

[kins2321@yahoo.com]

You dont have to have a big house to practice flying. Your son should send off, you should receive. Even if your bird can fly! Thats just part of your bird learning... " we are a family!" We work together! I am so happy Sophie loves us all for different reasons, steps up to all. I am always the person " bad news.... this is what Rom wants". Sophie knows I make the final decisions, and we have had many battles!

I am also the person that Sophie calls for when she feels " threatened!" Nancy

[Inara]

I just love your and Wilbur's interaction. He is just one beeuuudiful guy. Another great way to give Wilbur some flying exercise is to set up two T perches facing each other a little ways apart -- just enough so that he can step from one to the other, then over time gradually move them further and further apart. HRH Inara loved that and still does as the perches give her a great place to land. If you purchase them online they can be spendy -- but you can make them really easily yourself with a couple of old microphone stands a fitting to go into the top of the mic pipe, and then a branch/dowel to form the T part. You're an artist, you can figure out some good ones After she got good at flying between them, then I started varying their height and/or holding out my arm for her to land on. (There's several youtube vids out there that teach how to do this)

 

She didn't fly at all except when she was startled and then she was like a brick that someone flung to the ground. So I started her off by having her hang onto a thick cotton rope, and I would gently swing it back and forth, then speed it up a bit and give it a little drop which stimulated her wings to flap. The first time she figured out that she could flap her wings and "push" the rope through the air the "I can fly light bulb went off."

 

She now loves to fly through the house and is great at corners, etc. Sounds like Wilbur is, too, and just needs a bit of a refresher. I always wanted Inara to see/feel my arms and hands something secure and safe for her, so we didn't try the toss method. I do know, though, that that one works well for many people.

 

I hear you on getting choked up if you feel you've done something that wasn't quite right. There's not a person here who hasn't had a bird that they haven't made some kind of mistake with at some point - so as Katana said, know better, do better Wilbur is one lucky guy! Can't wait for more vids and more pics.

[Bigwick70]

Yes We try, Wilbur and I ... He sure is something else and has changed our lives in a positive way. I just noticed you we from the "Rockies". I always wanted to visit them, being from the hills myself lol. Ours aren't quite as big as yours though. Were from the Hatfield and McCoy part of the country lol. I bet its beautiful there. Might take Wilbur with us when we go lol...