Talon Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Well here I am sitting on the love seat in the bird room.....got Nilah confined to this room but can't catch her to fester in her cage. 45 minutes late...... I hate these days, can't outsmart her with any forbidden item....makes me angry and then all I want to do is cry out of frustration. It's the days when my daughters boyfriend was here in the am who she adores and is in love with.....sometimes other days, but mostly I can outsmart her. I usually get her eventually , along with a nasty bite or two, but today is the worst. Just need to vent......having a bad time with her today thanks for listening.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray P Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Could be Nilah is having a bad day too. Cricket can be stubborn too, but she never bites me. Someone else maybe, but not me. P.S. You love her and you know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbersmom Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I feel for you! Timber hates the towel, and usually all I have to do is wave it around and he goes in his cage. I hate doing it, but sometimes it is my last resort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I don't have a problem with my fids going in their cage but then they don't come out in the mornings either as I don't have time to have them loose. I do feel for you Penny and shame on Nilah for biting you, sounds like it has become a game and she loves it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Make the boyfriend cage Nilah and you go to work on time! That or forbid him from ever coming over again, because he is a trouble maker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbersmom Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 LOL Good idea Dan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvparrots Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Ouch!!! But isn't that why we love our zons, they are so different from the greys and they can read us like a book. So which is worse my Louie who won't let me touch him or your Nilah who (believes) she is in charge. It's a toss up. Hope your day turns around for you Talon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 17, 2013 Author Share Posted September 17, 2013 Thanks guys, I am finally at work. Lucky for me, my daughter took the day off to stay home & do homework, so as much as I hated to let Nilah win this one time, I left her out and went to work. I have tried having "her" boyfriend put her in her cage, but she flies off with him as well. She gets too wound up when he is here in general. She will attack my daughter when ever he is in the house as she sees my daughter as a threat to stealing "her" boyfriend....my poor daughter has to carry this stupid noise maker tube around everywhere she goes as it is the only thing Nilah is afraid of. When he isn't here, Nilah is fine around my daughter. It's been a hard situation....but we all try to make it work as best we can. Nilah is simply in LOVE with him. He has never been around parrots before, but has done his best to learn quickly from us. He is a very nice guy, and very patient and laid back, but he must be Nilah's dream boyfriend for sure. Most mornings I have to trick Nilah into her cage, I only get an "I hate you bite" maybe once a week when I have (after exhausting all other efforts) had to grab her and hold her with a towel or against me to get her in her cage.. My last resort which I really HATE to implement is to not let her out of her cage with the others in the morning, but I just don't have the heart to leave her in her cage for an hour and a half screaming "BIRD!" when the others are out having breakfast and out of cage time with me before work. but I know I may have to....it seems to make her act up worse on the days I have had to do that to them all so I am reluctant to do single her out and do that...ugh.. I KNOW she has ESP and can read my mind, she seems to know beforehand that I am going to try and put her in her cage, even tho I change my routine and do things that seem like I am just going to hang out at home,. Just having a really bad day in general.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katana600 Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Dear Penny, I have eight placemats, I will save one for you. Nilah may need enforcement. Of course I am saying that "tongue in cheek" after chasing Miss Gilbert with the placemat yesterday. I swear I wanted to roll it up and bash her with it, just this once. LOL. I know I am right behind you as Miss G finds her mojo and gets more interested in thwarting me. I am an easy opponent, she knows she is way out of my weight class. I wish we lived closer. When Nilah refuses to go in her cage for you, you could leave and I could come swoop her up in a net... all you have to do is ask nice, please go in your cage Nilah or I will have Big Bertha come put you in after I go to work. Now, take a deep breath, visualize Nilah hopping right up and obeying and going into her cage when you ask her. Then pretend that is how your morning started. Breathe deep, smile and start from there. The day has to get better for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywings Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 You only hate that she is not complying, you don't hate her at all. Were you always obedient and never a thorn in your parents side? I know I drove mine a little batty from time to time. Are you able to make the room dark? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Well, here's todays update. For the past few dys have had corner Nilah in a room and catch her with my bare hands with lightening reflexes Each day was different room she's too smart to fall for that twice in the same room. the second I lift my hand she's ducking and flying off. So tody, I let the other birds out for breakfast and uncovered NilH and left her in her cage.....I gave her toast in her snack bowl and we were in a different room having our breakfast. I feel so bad for her, and I miss having her out in the kitchen with me.... But the alternative is far worst I keep telling myself.....i came in and sat next to her cafe to post this and talk to her. I don't know if or when this will make her understand she needs to go back in her cage before I go to work in the am. Any advice? But I must say, I imagine going to work with much less stress, but I miss her....Is this going to turn her into a meanie cause she only gets time out of her cage after 5 every day, is this cruel, or what should I be doing next or just keep doing this? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywings Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 You have to adjust the routine to make it to work to support her green backside then that is what has to be for now. Talk to her and let her know the "why" of it (sounds wacky but it works for me). Maybe later you can try the old morning routine again and see if the result differs. You shouldn't feel guilty she still gets out time and weekends offer more time. Many birds are cage bound there entire lives as people just are not aware that there is an alternative or fear of bite rules. Nilah is loved I know that so just don't say you hate her even in jest, just work with what she is willing to comply with this year. You have many months and years ahead to perfect your interactions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvparrots Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 Talon, you know that my zon, Louie is untouchable. He does fortunately understand me when I am talking to him. If I put his travel cage, a large wire cage, up to the opening of his door he will go in so that I can take him outside or into my car. Perhaps you can more Nilah around in a smaller cage until she understands what it means to go back into her cage. I have never had a problem getting Louie into his cage in the evening as he understands because he watches my two greys go into their cages at night so he complies once they are in their cages. My parrots do understand me when I talk to them. I believe they are very intuitive and Nilah just has your number. You do need to be strong and do what you need to do to get to work on time. The needs of the family outweigh the need of Nilah to be the winner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 Thanks Janet. Nilah goes into her cage fine at other times, it's just in the morning. Usually they are out for about an hour than hour and half. Thank you for the travel cage advice. I may have to try it. Tonight when I got home an hour late, I let her out first. She flew around, acted out as usual, but then cuddled me and haven't left my side since. We're still chillin together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingy Posted September 21, 2013 Share Posted September 21, 2013 Ohh what an excellent idea. If Nilah is in a travel cage she can still join you for breakfast and you don't have to chase her around afterward. I would love to let Jake out in the mornings before I go to work but he is not a morning bird and prefers to sleep in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 22, 2013 Author Share Posted September 22, 2013 Well,today being Saturday, I let the birds out for breakfast and they stayed out as usual most of the day. I had a hair appt at 2, so I had to put them in their cages a few ,insures before. No succes with Nilah, it was as tho it was morning.....I had to leave her out....couldn't get her in her cage. Icloaedrhe room off, left her out and I had to go. Quite a while later, my daughters boyfriend tricked her into her cage. My heart is heavy...you all know how strongly I feel about clipping wings.....my only choices now as I see it, keeping her cage bound, which is unacceptable , or clipping her wings to gain back full control until she gets thru this defiant stage, i can't have her ruling the roost and being allowed to be out when she chooses. I am the flock leader and with an amazon, that has to continue ....especially with an amazon. I'm so depressed over this decision. I will have to call the vet on Monday.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 22, 2013 Author Share Posted September 22, 2013 So tonight, I went over to Nilah, asked her to step up for bed, and she did willingly, I held her for her nighttime head rubs as she always likes, and she shes had enough, usually I get me bite on the finger asshe says nuh nites....tonight, she Lulled her head away, no bite, but let me bring her to her cage and she nicely when inside as she said nuh nights again. No problem.....this is ormal for her, but daytime is the problem...... sigh..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katana600 Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Penny, I have been able to think about this from both sides and for Nilah, I can imagine that she has worked out that if she could just make you late, if she could just make you get fired, you would be finished with that thing called a job that keeps you from being home and being wonderfully together all day long. But life has its way of making us do what we must, buck up, do the tough stuff and go into the world to work in order to support the lifestyle in which dear Nilah has become accustomed. If a working trim is necessary to make her understand that coming out and enjoying flock time has a responsibility of going back inside to do her "work" to support the flock too, so be it. It is a short term modification. It doesn't have to be severe and knowing the joy that is Nilah, I am guessing it will be a short lived effort for a long term gain. I wish there was a magic jacket we could put on them to confine their escape maneuvers for the short term. In reality we have limited tools to use and you are not one to look for an easy way out. You will make it work no matter what you decide. You have my support in any changes you have to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray P Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 With Cricket and Corky they both know that when they go back to their cage there is something special waiting for them in there cage. When they are out we hide a treat some place in their cage. Some times they see us putting the treat in , but most of the time they don`t, they just know it`s there. When we take them back to their cage it`s fun to watch them go all over their cage to find what we hid, never in the same place and never the some treat. Some times they go back on their own to find it. We put them in and take them out of their cage many times a day. We live in a log home so we can`t let them all the time, they would eat their way through the walls in nothing flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingy Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 JMHO but wing clipping may not solve the problem. If she is determined to rule the roost and not go in her cage she will do so with or without the ability to fly. It is easy for me to say but try and think smarter not harder. There are many things you can try, putting her in her cage several times per day for varying amounts of time with something good, changing up your routine so she goes in before you start to get ready, changing the order so she goes in first and if she is good she gets a treat and praise if she isn't she has to watch the others get a treat and praise, making her earn time out of the cage (this really worked for Jakes biting), the use of a net to catch her mid flight or covering the high areas so she has no place to hide that you cannot easily reach. This is going to sound really crazy but you might need to reset the emotion of going into the cage. Your stress over getting her in could be reinforcing her actions. You want the big emotional high to be because she was a good girl not because she has exceptional evasion tactics. Put her in the cage, give a treat, praise praise praise make a huge deal of it, let her out after a few minutes and keep doing it several times an hour if you can. The moment she gives you a hard time get her in and turn your back to the cage, no treat, no talking, no praise, no emotion. After 10 or 15 minutes start the routine again. While this is just my opinion I believe that temporary shunning is quite possibly used by our parrots in the wild. The parents or flock elders have to have a way to teach the youngsters the ins and outs of proper flock behavior which would have to include a way to covey that a particular action is not going to be tolerated. They really only have a few ways to say don't do that (vocalizing, shunning, beaking or biting, body language and maybe by releasing a scent or vibration that only others of their species can understand). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 22, 2013 Author Share Posted September 22, 2013 Hi Wingy, with the exception of net, I have done everything else you have suggested. This has been an issue for quite some time that she started almost a month ago for whatever reason. I have always tried to outsmart her, many times have worked, but she is smart and only falls for my tricks once. I have exhausted all resources except a net, (which I don't have) . That's is why my last resort is Wong copping as temporary fix hopefully until she gets thru this new stage, which I believe it is. She was fine for the last 4 1/2 years.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvparrots Posted September 22, 2013 Share Posted September 22, 2013 Talon have you tried dimming the lights and darkening the room. I have heavy drapes in my bird room and this works for me with an unruly parrot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 22, 2013 Author Share Posted September 22, 2013 My room is pretty light. I have hung a curtain over an open door way to keep her in. I have French doors I close on the other doorway, but I have 5 windows. Maybe I should buy room darkening curtains and try that first. I HATE to see how upset she will be if I clip her wings. She LOVES to fly, she flies thru the house playing with Talon and at other time yelling. She flies from one high spot to another.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted September 23, 2013 Author Share Posted September 23, 2013 Well I am sitting here next to Nilahscage as she has breakfast. She seems ok with it all . Iletthe others out,but not her. I probably am more upset than she is. I angling to try this weekend darkening the room with new curtains I want to exhaust all efforts before I clip her. She will be devastated, she loves flying more than the others. She spends most of her day flying and I really don't want to take that away and watch her fall every time she flies and doesn't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbersmom Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I think you are doing the right thing. She may prefer less out of cage time to not being able to fly, at least for the present. Hang in there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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