switching to pellets

[Karen Wise]

I want to switch Cosmo from a all seed diet to pellets. Problem is I don't know how much seed to pellets. He was fed 1/3 cup of seed in the morning and about 90% was gone by the next morning. I need guidance on the ratio seed to pellet for the conversion so I can be sure he is getting enough nutrition. (this goes back to my paranoia when he started his feather plucking a few months ago which is now under control) I want to make sure I am doing the best I can for Cosmo. Whatever it takes is my motto for him!

 

What about the dehydrated organic veggies which have to be cooked in addition to the pellets for variation?

 

Thanks again for all your help

 

Karen

Karen

[Dave007]

Veggies are a great idea and many people prepare them in different ways. Raw, steamed etc. It depends upon what your bird likes. It may take time to find what he likes. As far as seed to pellets, well that also depends on whether your bird likes the type you buy. You may have to try out different ones. Your bird needs his basicfood 24/7 and if that means seed, then it's seed. You can try putting one cup pellets in and then take it out and put one cup seed in and see what happens. Or you can put 2 cups in-- pellets in one and seed in the other and see what happens.

One thing though----pellets aren't really that important or extremely nourashing for a bird. Chemicals, coloring, processing all has to do with pellets. Many of us here have found out that pellets aren't really as good as they're cracked up to be. Lots of baloney advertising.

 

The best thing you mentioned here is veggies which are very natural and important for parrots.

[Spinner]

Good for you on your efforts to transition to pellets.

 

Given a choice between seeds and pellets, Cosmo will surely pick seeds. Mixing them in just doesn't work - Cosmo will simply pick out the seeds and leave the pellets. Try starting the day with pellets and switch to seeds midday. Slowly extend the time before the switch after you notice definitive consumption of the pellets. Let Cosmo dictate the timing.

 

In some cases, birds simply won't accept new foods. So try again in a few weeks if it fails. Under no circumstances should you deprive Cosmo of available food that he will eat. By starting the day with pellets, he'll get the idea that this will be his go-to food quickly.

 

High quality pellets provide the best nutritionally balanced diet for our greys. They should be available to your grey at all times. Complemented with a variety of fresh fruits, vegetables, meats and cereals, and you can't go wrong.

[Jayd]

We feed a good quality seed mix less sunflower seeds and NO peanuts in the shell. We buy a mix without sunflower seeds or pick them out and give about 3tbs of the sunflowers a day. The only shell in peanut is a human grade roasted or low sodium roasted in the can. The reason for no peanuts in the shell is a parrot can possibility get Aspergillosis which can be deadly..http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?115338-Aspergillosis

We keep seeds and pellets 24/7 in the cages.Our reason for not feeding pellets is the way there made and the fact there not 100% you don't have to feed anything else parrot food. A lot of pellets are mostly chemicals, and filler ie:corn. Another main reason is there are know pellet trees in our parrots natural habitat. A diet of seeds and natural foods, veggies and some pellets have all the needed requirements for a healthy and long life. The more sugar, salt and chemicals we pump into our parrots can only do harm.....Advertising is the main ingredient in pellets. A vet will recommend a pellet because they get compensation or free samples, it's just like Nike or any one else, it's advertising...Red meats aren't really needed,Greys are prone to cholesterol, which can kill them. A little chicken, fish on occasion is more then fine, especially a chicken leg bone. Dave007 is right! Thanks Jayd

Edited February 26, 2013 by Jayd

[Spinner]

Of course, everyone should do their own research. However, to generalize pellets as bad is a mistake. Sure, there are some brands that are not the best for our birds, but there are known high quality brands that are a 100% nutritional provider for greys.

 

I would point you decades of research, research papers and peer review that clearly are the defining body of what we know as avian nutritional knowledge. For example Roudybush products (our pellet supplier of choice for our use) is one pellet product that meets the nutritional needs of our birds. Check out some of the available articles at http://www.roudybush.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=birdbrain.articles as well as the research papers available in many journals. Roudybush pellets provides 100% of the nutritional needs of our greys. Period. (note, I am just a Roudybush consumer, not a reseller, etc)

 

Sure, no pellet trees in a grey's natural environment. But no cages either, or reduced direct sunshine, household chemicals etc. We do the best we can for our birds, research what works best, and do the best we can to provide the best artificial environment for our birds. We find out new results, create new technologies, change formulations and do a better job for our greys. It's all good.

 

Karen, I applaud you in moving from a seed diet to a quality pellet diet. Research shows this as a positive step forward for our greys. Keep us updated on your progress.

[Jayd]

To start with, Rowdybush is one of the better pellets..

Here's the ingredients in Rowdybush:

 

Ingredients: Ground Corn, Ground Wheat, Peanut Meal, Soy Oil,Soy Meal, Hydrated Sodium Calcium Aluminosilicate, Yucca schidigen Extract,Salt, Calcium Carbonate, L-Lysine, DL-Methionine, Mixed Tocopherols, Rosemary Extract, Ascorbic Acid, Citric Acid, Lecithin, Silicon Dioxide (carrier for liquid antioxidants), Sodium Selenite (on Calcium Carbonate), Niacin, Alpha-Tocopherol Acetate (Source of Vitamin E), Biotin, Manganese Sulfate, Calcium Pantothenate, Zinc Oxide, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vit. A Acetate, Thiamine, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (Vit K), Cyanocobalamin (VitB12), Vit D3 Sup. Folic Acid, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide, Propionic Acid, Ammonium Hydroxide, Acetic Acid, Sorbic Acid, Tartaric Acid, and natural apple flavoring.

 

You will note the 1st ingredient which Rowdybush has the most of is Corn, You will also notice that it has Soy and peanut which is high in sat fat, it has many different chemical salts and sugars, it is also heat processed. I stated that "No" [Spinner stated]"pellet is "100% of the nutritional needs of our greys. Period." The link suggested is Rowdybushs own link and research! It is also made up of man made chemical ingredients. None of these chemicals exist in the wild. I and many others on this forum do not applaud you for switching to pellets but we applaud you for questioning. You can go to almost all pellet manufactures and find out what there made of and how their made. As a wise man on this forum once mentioned, "Parrots have been eating seeds and fresh natural foods far longer than pellets have been available" [These are not his exact words but close] Thank you for questioning.....Jayd

 

Edited February 26, 2013 by Jayd

[Spock]

Hi, here's a example of what Jay and I [Maggie] feed the fids lol. There's many wonderful diets on this forum.....Thanks Maggie

http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?190462-We-Feed-Our-Fid-s!!!-Update

[danmcq]

I want to switch Cosmo from a all seed diet to pellets. Problem is I don't know how much seed to pellets. He was fed 1/3 cup of seed in the morning and about 90% was gone by the next morning. I need guidance on the ratio seed to pellet for the conversion so I can be sure he is getting enough nutrition. (this goes back to my paranoia when he started his feather plucking a few months ago which is now under control) I want to make sure I am doing the best I can for Cosmo. Whatever it takes is my motto for him!Karen

 

Hello Karen and thanks for wanting to provide the best diet and keep that plucking at bay. I believe your motto "Whatever it takes is my motto for him!" is one that all grey owners should have.

 

The others have made comments on what they feed their greys and their respected thoughts on this. I agree in part with most of them, but there is always the thought of needing to keep a well rounded and balanced diet. My personal thoughts in trying to maintain a well rounded and bountiful diet for my grey and conure, is I feed seeds, nuts, pellets, veggies, fruits, legumes, grains etc. to keep it nutritional and an enjoyable experience for them that they look forward to.

 

I have always relied on Harrison's when it comes to pellets. Why you may ask? Because Dr, Harrison did a very in depth study on grey nutritional needs an formulated the high potency coarse pellets based on that research. You will not find corn fillers being the main ingredient. You will find it is all organic. sunflower seeds and peanuts are the main igredients and of course the vitamins are added in as well as "Clay" which is a foundation of grey ground feeding which coats the crop and digestive tract to absorb toxins they my eat during the day.

 

I just mix around 10 pellets in with the seed/nut mix and let my grey decide how many pellts he may desire to eat that day. I personally wold never try to switch him to a full pellet no seed diet. It would just not be fully healthy and in my opinion a dull and incomplete diet.

 

If you wish, you can find all the information you need on Harrison's website in regards the pellet switch, studies Dr. Harrison did etc. I hope you find the posts in this thread thought provoking and respond back with any questions or additional thoughts you may have. We do not in any way want you to feel your desire to provide the best diet to your grey is being questioned or looked down upon.

 

http://www.harrisonsbirdfoods.com

[Jayd]

Thank you Dan, I agree completely with you, that's why I stated and always state to keep some pellets 24/7 available at all times. As Dan pointed out, Harrison's is probably one of the best pellets available. My biggest complaint is the bold statement some company's and people make that a parrots can prosper and recive everything their parrots need to survive on pellets alone!

In all fairness, if a parront chooses to have pellets as the main entree in their parrots diet, please also learn why seeds, veggies, beans legumes etc need to also be supplied to their companions diet...Thanks so much. Jayd

[Dave007]

Jeez, all this talk about bird food and it's value to the parrots and how the bird will suffer if not given these *good foods*. I've brought this subject up before and no one seems to have any answers. The reason is that most of the birds that are talked about are very young birds.

 

So

1--what about the any age bird who won't accept any of these * good* foods no matter what method /methods are used for a long period of time but has only accepted parrot mix?

 

And

2--what about the bird that about to be adopted at the approx age of 9 to 13 yrs and older and has only accepted parrot mix as a food staple for many years and refuses to accept new foods no matter what's introduced over a long period of time? And many methods are used. Should the person who's doing the adopting change his/her mind about adoption?

 

Should the person prepare him/herself concerning the early death of the bird?

[Jayd]

Jeez, all this talk about bird food and it's value to the parrots and how the bird will suffer if not given these *good foods*. I've brought this subject up before and no one seems to have any answers. The reason is that most of the birds that are talked about are very young birds.

 

So

1--what about the any age bird who won't accept any of these * good* foods no matter what method /methods are used for a long period of time but has only accepted parrot mix?

 

And

2--what about the bird that about to be adopted at the approx age of 9 to 13 yrs and older and has only accepted parrot mix as a food staple for many years and refuses to accept new foods no matter what's introduced over a long period of time? And many methods are used. Should the person who's doing the adopting change his/her mind about adoption?

 

Should the person prepare him/herself concerning the early death of the bird?

 

Sir, the statement I made to" a Wise old man", was you. I know I always address my diet threads to all parrots and age, Thanks Dave Jayd

[danmcq]

So

1--what about the any age bird who won't accept any of these * good* foods no matter what method /methods are used for a long period of time but has only accepted parrot mix?

And

2--what about the bird that about to be adopted at the approx age of 9 to 13 yrs and older and has only accepted parrot mix as a food staple for many years and refuses to accept new foods no matter what's introduced over a long period of time? And many methods are used. Should the person who's doing the adopting change his/her mind about adoption?

 

Should the person prepare him/herself concerning the early death of the bird?

 

Well Geeez Dave good questions and good topic to continue discussing as well.

 

#1 - My answer would be you must keep feeding them the parrot mix and not giving up while still offering foods of various types. You just never know which day they may pick one up to toss and as the texture and flavor rings a pleasure bells in the greys brain it thinks "Wait a minute, thats good, lets try a few".

 

#2 - My answer would be the same as #1.

 

Personally, I would suffer the expense of those various foods and just keep on keeping on. But, thats just me! I would certainly never take away the food they will eat and try starvation as a motivator hoping they well eat the pellets I keep putting in the cage as the continue a hunger strike.

[Dave007]

Well Geeez Dave good questions and good topic to continue discussing as well.

 

#1 - My answer would be you must keep feeding them the parrot mix and not giving up while still offering foods of various types. You just never know which day they may pick one up to toss and as the texture and flavor rings a pleasure bells in the greys brain it thinks "Wait a minute, thats good, lets try a few".

 

#2 - My answer would be the same as #1.

 

 

Personally, I would suffer the expense of those various foods and just keep on keeping on. But, thats just me! I would certainly never take away the food they will eat and try starvation as a motivator hoping they well eat the pellets I keep putting in the cage as the continue a hunger strike.

 

Good productive response. Expense isn't alot. After all, how much do veggies really cost but no matter what, the person has to be prepared to accept so called failure. Failure is the name that people classify this problem as but that word shouldn't be used in this situation. . Pellets? Expense wise, that's a whole different story but I'm not so excited about pellets because I saw parrots do very well without ever seeing a pellet.

Also, understand that my 2 questions weren't hypotheticals. I know the owners and their birds who are in these exact same situations but they're not having problems.

I only bring this whole thing up because I see some the worry and horror that people have when their birds just don't follow the same path as other birds do. It's not a nice thing to see many people get depressed over such a thing when it isn't necessary and Dan, I know that you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Edited February 26, 2013 by Dave007

[danmcq]

I only bring this whole thing up because I see some the worry and horror that people have when their birds just don't follow the same path as other birds do. It's not a nice thing to see many people get depressed over such a thing when it isn't necessary and Dan, I know that you know exactly what I'm talking about.

 

How very true Dave. People should not let the pressure they feel from all those advertisements that if your not feeding pellets to your birds, dogs, cats ... on and on your doing them wrong. Sad really what commercialism does to people.

[judygram]

I also regard Harrison's pellets as a good nutritional supplement to the grey's diet and Josey eats some of hers every day, I keep a bowl with some in it at all times as she will snack on them from time to time.

[Timbersmom]

I'm still offering Harrison's, but Timber isn't "biting." He also won't do Roundybush, Zupreem or any of the others I've tried. He's a nutriberry bird. I feed him sprouted seeds, mashed sweet potato, birdy bread, grains, Higgins world cuisine (with hemp seed and red palm oil), chicken wings and drums, occasional beef and fish, veggies on a skewer etc., which he eats some of. He may never eat the recommended pellets. I'll keep sticking them in, but I know it may never happen. If not? So be it. He will be as healthy as he can be for as long as he can be and I'll enjoy every minute of it!

[Karen Wise]

Thank You. Do you feed your bird veggies in the morning and fruit late afternoon? I have visited several sites and some feed three or four times a day, some feed twice a day. I am assuming it is going to to a slow process. Should I continue to give him a little seed and some pellets and offer veggies and fruit in small amounts to see what he likes?

 

Thanks again

 

Karen

[judygram]

You can give him some veggies in the mornings and evenings but greys do not eat in "meals" like we do, they eat or snack all day long and some may munch during the night, be sure to have some pellets and a good seed mix in a bowl or separate bowls for anytime snacking.

When you offer vegetables try them different ways, raw, cooked, mashed, chopped, shredded and what ever other ways you can do them for some will like some certain ways and not others, do this for a while and you will find out what his favorites are.

[Dave007]

Parrots don't eat like us. There's no breakfast, lunch or dinner. They eat all day long. They need a staple dry type food in their cage 24/7. Greys won't gain weight no matter how much food is around. As for as veggies, anytime is fine as long as they eat the veggies within 2 hrs. After that time, the veggies start to go bad. They dry up, shrivel, lose their moisture and some even rot so the veggies go bad. More can be supplied but only you will eventually know if putting more in is necessary. They don't need veggies all day long. Various amounts of veggies throughout the day won't hurt a parrot. Notice that I don't focus on fruit? Lots of fruit isn't important because there's really no nutritional value. They're acidic and run through a bird's digestive system . A little fruit 2x a week is fine. Also feed that anytime you want.

Parrots don't eat every kind vegetable that's given so it's gonna be a trial and error situation in the beginning. Just make sure that the veggies are darkish green, leafy or solid. You'll also have to find out how your bird accepts the veggies. Some like them raw. Others like them steamed. Others like both. So that's another trial and error situation. Stay away from any type of avocado. It's toxic. You've gotten different opinions concerning pellets so I'll repeat---you'll need to find out which he likes. Another trial and error situation.