Chop

[Guest Jocelyn]

I love the Parrot Nation blog. And Patricia Sund is always writing about Chop. I would really like to try Chop for my boy, Romeo. Now Patricia refuses to place a real recipe on there because she wants us to be creative and come up with our own ideas. Now taking the safe fruit and veggie list from here I think I can think of something. My only issue is the stuff that isn’t a fruit or veggie that needs to go in. Like veggie pasta? Oatmeal? Brown rice? (All cooked of course) Do these seem like the right idea? How much do I need? Is the jist of it I take the cooked stuff and the not cooked stuff mix it up and just bag it up and throw it in the freezer?

Any tips for a semi picky grey?

Anyone else use chop?

[Timbersmom]

I would really, really like to see someone's basic chop recipe (including amounts). I understand you can just throw safe things in, but it would be helpful to newbies (especially anal ones like me) to have a basic recipe to start with! If anyone is willing, please post!

[monax]

If you haven't already seen this - Shauna Roberts has a nice mash recipe: http://parrot-chow.livejournal.com/24403.html

Also very flexible, but she does give some guidelines on proportions which I find helpful. You can take some cooked items like rice or quinoa and mix it in the chop/mash for freezing, but it might change the texture after you defrost it. I haven't been overly successful with chop, as my parrot is a pellet fiend, but I keep trying different combinations of frozen and fresh vegetables, cooked and uncooked, cut into different sizes. Have not found the perfect formula yet - but from what I've read, it takes time and trial and error., so be patient!

[Sarasota]

Chop is a good "jumping off" place for a good diet. However, it does include pasta, which I stay away from in the mix. Hi-carb, high-fat foods have been shown to increase behavior issues. Here's a great article by Pamela Clark: http://www.pamelaclarkonline.com/uploads/Diet-Linked_Behavior_in_Parrots.pdf.

 

I use all sorts of veggies and grains in my mash. I will switch it up each batch. My standard grains are farro, amaranth, quinoa, kamut, spelt. For greens, my regulars are kale, mustard, collard, brussell sprouts. Veggies are carrots, broccoli, cauliflower, peas, squash, purple cabbage, sweet potato, etc. The dry ingredients I add are flax seeds, pepitas, chia seeds, hulled millet.

 

The bean mix is either sprouted or cooked adzuki and mung beans. I tried the bean soup mixes, which were ignored. I also sprout the China Prairie micrograin mix http://www.chinaprairie.com/afd.html.

 

Burt, I believe, was raised on a mostly seed diet. In his bowl he also gets a small amount of the Leach's Hookbill Cuisine (It's a pretty dang good seed mix, no peanuts in shells): http://www.leachgrain.com/hookbillmixes.html.

 

All diets are supplemented with a small amount of hemp and Red Palm Oil.

 

Both birds get almonds in the shell as treats.

 

I feed the mash mixed with their favorite Harrison's Pellets which encourages them to be less picky!If you want in depth information about parrot diet, you can join the Feeding Feathers Group. The website is not as user friendly as Parrot Nation. However, I know Shauna (spent a week with her at Natural Encounters). She travels the world learning about feeding parrots - even Japan! I need to convince her to make a more readable, blog-format website: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/FeedingFeathers/

[BeeFernandez22]

I love the Parrot Nation blog. And Patricia Sund is always writing about Chop. I would really like to try Chop for my boy, Romeo. Now Patricia refuses to place a real recipe on there because she wants us to be creative and come up with our own ideas. Now taking the safe fruit and veggie list from here I think I can think of something. My only issue is the stuff that isn’t a fruit or veggie that needs to go in. Like veggie pasta? Oatmeal? Brown rice? (All cooked of course) Do these seem like the right idea? How much do I need? Is the jist of it I take the cooked stuff and the not cooked stuff mix it up and just bag it up and throw it in the freezer?

Any tips for a semi picky grey?

Anyone else use chop?

 

Oh thanks a lot for giving me something else to distract me at work (other than this forum of course) Hahaha... I have not yet seen this blog but I just pulled it up and it looks great! Now that I am completely uninterested in my workload for the day, do you know any others??? I have never heard of "chop" but I have been looking for other things to give Maverick so this sounds like a good thing to try.

[Greywings]

There are alternative non wheat based pastas available such as Garbonzo bean, Corn, Quinona, Potato & and Rice.

[Sarasota]

There are alternative non wheat based pastas available such as Garbonzo bean, Corn, Quinona, Potato & and Rice.

 

Thanks, Greywings, I should have mentioned garbanzo beans!

 

I forgot to add that I chop a small amount of fruit each morning (if you are planning on freezing your mash, fruit does not work well). I keep grapes and bananas as special treats. Daily they will get a little apple, papaya, pomegranate, blueberry or goji berries (yay! My plant is finally giving me berries!)

[Sarasota]

I would really, really like to see someone's basic chop recipe (including amounts). I understand you can just throw safe things in, but it would be helpful to newbies (especially anal ones like me) to have a basic recipe to start with! If anyone is willing, please post!

 

I'll try to get you an exact recipe (it's hard since it's always different). Heck, in fact, I'll try to take some photos!

[Jayd]

http://parrotnation.com/2010/08/08/chop-shot-by-shot/

[Timbersmom]

I'll try to get you an exact recipe (it's hard since it's always different). Heck, in fact, I'll try to take some photos!

 

Great! I have mixed some stuff up but still struggle with proportions. I'm a "recipe" type gal and need a solid starting point on the proportions (i.e. how much grain to how much vegetable etc.).

 

Thanks to everyone else who posted links. Very helpful!

[Sarasota]

Duh! I forgot that Kris Porter put a chop step-by-step on her enrichment page. Try this (and some other delish stuff): http://parrotenrichment.com/nutrition/recipes.html

[Timbersmom]

Duh! I forgot that Kris Porter put a chop step-by-step on her enrichment page. Try this (and some other delish stuff): http://parrotenrichment.com/nutrition/recipes.html

 

That's great thanks! Just what I was looking for but not finding.

[Jayd]

Here's probably the most famous and popular Mash ever..... http://gabrielbuddhistparrot.blogspot.com/2006/12/mikes-mana-mash-complete-parrots-diet.html

[Timbersmom]

Great, thanks! Once I can get going on the proportions I'll be fine. I really like to cook, it's just a matter of having a starting point. These recipes will help a lot. I watched the video some time ago of the lady showing how to make it, but she didn't give amounts. I'm creativity impaired and needed more specifics!

[Jayd]

Great, thanks! Once I can get going on the proportions I'll be fine. I really like to cook, it's just a matter of having a starting point. These recipes will help a lot. I watched the video some time ago of the lady showing how to make it, but she didn't give amounts. I'm creativity impaired and needed more specifics!

 

Whats nice about Mash, smash, glops ect, is you ca adlib, add what you want, remove what you don't. Rule of thumb, treat your recipe like a Chinese menu, 1 from column A, 1 from column b, etc. Priority's, Dark Green Leafy Veggies, Orange/Yellow Veggies, Legumes, Grains and nuts, etc. Whats really important is your Omega 3's and EFA's [Essential Fatty Acids] this is your Red palm oil, Olive oil, nut's,[almonds,walnuts etc] And lets not forget Sunlight/indoor full spectrum UVB lighting....

We have to remember that not everything will be eaten by all parrots, they have a tendency to pick and choose, this is where you watch and remove and replace until you find what they will eat....Our biggest difference with most people is, we don't freeze, we make enough for a day or two....[we severed fresh even when we were caring for 50+ parrots at a time...Thanks

[Jayd]

This is from our very own Shanlung, search him, it's worth it......

 

http://shanlung.livejournal.com/119016.html

http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?190007-Tinkerbell-Mash-Best-food-by-far-for-your-Grey

[Timbersmom]

I will definitely check it out when I have more time tomorrow!

[Wingy]

I am making Jake a mix today to use as a base. Hopefully he likes it. I've got a 16 bean mix simmering on the stove in one pot and an 8 grain mix simmering in another. If he goes for it I can freeze portions and use that as a base and chop some vegies while I'm making dinner. I have struggled finding good things that he likes but I think I finally have an acceptable group of vegies to work with.

[Timbersmom]

I can't find anything Timber will eat much of. He will take a bite of several things, but not much more. Hopefully, that's all he needs in addition to his purchased food. The skewer with fresh vegetables caught his interest for a few days, now it mostly just hangs there. Same with the greens I was threading in the cage bars, the birdie bread I make, the seeds I sprout, etc. etc. I haven't made my own chop yet, but have been buying the Higgins worldly cuisine, which he will eat a bite of. He does eat about half of the quarter slice of toast I give him in the morning with almond butter.

[Wingy]

Jake is very similar except he won't eat toast or bread at all. I thread a kale leaf through the bars of his palace every morning. Sometimes he eats and sometimes not.

 

To his beans/cooked grains mix I added some frozen diced fresh cranberries. diced carrot, chopped kale and a bit of diced jalapeno. I know I shouldn't have added the jalapeno but he loves them so and I wanted to add a flavor that was a favorite so he would be more willing to take a few bites. I also sprinkled a few of his beloved safflower seeds on top.

[Jayd]

1) Doesn't sweet corn have large amount of sugar? Isn't that harmful for the birds?

 

Fruits that you give your birdie such as apples, strawberries, etc etc have sugar in it. When the sweetcorn is a tiny fraction of the overall mash, I do not think we have to be concerned

 

2) I don't know if we have in our stores frozen sweet corn (I never saw any). Can I buy fresh and then freeze it? Is there a process which I need to follow or I can just put it in the fridge? why does it need to be frozen in the first place?

 

If you do not have sweet corn, use dry corn. In which case use 50 grams of dry corn, or 100 grams if the corn is not dry. I used frozen sweet corn as that was what I bought.

 

 

3) I newer saw a sweet potato so I don't think we have any. Can I use something else instead?

 

I think sweet potato will be better . If you cannot get that, use potatoes.

Google for photos of sweet potatoes

4) When I saw pictures of kidney beans I thought it was red bean, so what is the difference between those two? How will I recognize them (from each other)?

 

 

Kidney beans are big looking red beans

 

5) When I saw pictures of lima beans and Great Northern white beans I thought they are the same, so what is the difference between those two? How will I recognize them (from each other)?

 

 

Lima beans are big looking white beans.

 

 

6) If I except something from the recipe, do I need to compensate with something else?

 

You do not need to. Or you can compensate by more of similar type. If you cannot get glutinous rice, use double portion of regular rice

 

 

If no great northen white beans , use more black eyed beans. Or no need to substitute even.

 

 

7) What are green beans? This: http://www.ifood.tv/blog/four-tasty-...of-green-beans ? Or does it has to do with peas?

 

Grren beans above below the peas and next to the red beans

 

Look into the flickr folder with many more photos

Preparing Tinkerbell Mash 7

http://www.flickr.com/photos/shanlun...7623146773717/

 

8) There are peas in the picture but I haven't seen in the recipe that it says peas .. So how much peas? Or you want peas in a bean and that would then be answer to question number 7? So what do I do with the bean? throw it away?

 

Thank you. I forgot to add the peas into the recipe even though it was clear my photos included that. I since changed the Livejournal and credited you for that discovery

9) Brown crushed barley? I think I know what barley is? But brown? Are there some other kind? I think I eat that for breakfast:-)

 

Brown cereals are more healthy than refined cereals. Use brown where you can.

 

10) I don't know the difference between brown glutinious rice and brown rice? Glutinous means sticky, right? How can rice be sticky?

 

Glutinous rice is common in Asia. Double the rice quantity or use more oats/wheat/barley

11) I know what oat is, but what is brown rolled oat?

 

Use breakfast oats from the can and brown in color.

12) Have no idea what are brown rolled wheat berries. Picture?

 

 

brown rolled oats, wheat and barley

13) Do i "peel" the shell of a Brazilian nut, right?-and how am I gonna do that? I saw them in a seed mix but don't know where can I buy just them. Any suggestions?

 

No need for brazilian nuts if not available.

 

14) Now question about making TM. This is what I understood but I need exact time frame:

In the morning I soak all the beans/peas for 8-10hours. Then I wash them/rinse and drain them. That is in the evening of the same day. I leave them like them in separate containers. Next morning, lunch time, dinner, for ten minutes I soak them again and then wash them/rinse and drain them. How many days do I need to repeat that process three times a day?

 

Continuous soaking of beans can make them rot. So make sure you drain them after the soaking. I repeat this for 3 days from when I started adding water to when I cook them all together.

 

 

Then I don't know when do I need to put peas and black beans in the fridge. How long do I need to keep them there?

 

If the roots start to appear and about ¼ to ½ inch long, you put them into the fridge to slow the germinating process until the time of the cooking.

 

 

Also, I don't know when do I need to take a third of sweet corn and green beans and red beans and peas. Am I right to think that I pour boiling water over that?

 

You remove 1/3 to ¼ just before the time of cooking and liquidizing them. I have some whole green beans peas etc etc to give texture. These are safe beans unlike kidney, lima etc which must be thoroughly cooked.

 

 

Now I put all the beans/peas in a pot and I keep it boiling for 5minutes. Remove icky scum while cooking. Then I cool it down. I blend all that was cooking and put it back in the pot and add water if it is too thick. Now I add that third of sweet corn and green beans and red beans and peas. Do I add millet now?

 

Yes. Add the wheat germ now too if you like.

 

I let it boil again and cook it for 10 more minutes. Do I continue to cook when I add grated sweet potatoes and grated carrots?

 

Yes. You then add the cereals with the pot still on the fire.

 

Keep stirring.

 

It will be fast to add the grated carrots and sweet potatoes.

 

When the pot is boiling , you can take it off the stove.

 

 

 

Now I add wheat germ. At this time is pot still boiling? Is it all together ten minutes or this last two steps prolong the cooking period? Don't we kill all the vitamins with cooking?

 

Beause of the liquidizing of the beans, the cooking time is reduced to 10 minutes. If not, those beans must be cooked for an hour which will kill all the vitamins.

 

I removed the pot and wrap towels around the pot. Leave it overnight. When did I start to cook all this?

 

The pot continued to cook in its own heat. By next morning, it will be cool enough for packaging.

 

 

I serve with veggies and fruit which I put in the mash?

 

Vary the veggies as you like and as to season, together with fruits. I prefer to put fruits and veggies in foraging points. You can mix them all up with mash.

 

If I wanted to add Brazilian nuts and almonds I would do that when liquidizing, right?

 

Yes. But not necessary for brazil nuts and almonds. If I make the next batch of mash, I will use groundnuts, human grade, and parboiled for that 5 minutes with rest of beans before liquidizing.

[Timbersmom]

Wingy, Sounds good! Timber seems to prefer the spicy/hot stuff too. I wonder if that is why he is so picky about his more "bland" stuff.

 

Jay, thanks for the Shanlung info!

Edited September 30, 2012 by Timbersmom

[Wingy]

I made Jakes base mix which is bland but added the fresh bits to the serving dish. I have been wanting to do this since I brought Jake home but he has just been to particular to accept it. When he ate the beans out of my chili I figured he might accept a bean/grain mix. He did eat a few beans out of it.

[Jayd]

The 34 ingredients I use for this mash:

 

Part 1: Cooked Grains-Beans Component

1) black-eyed peas (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

2) organic pinto beans (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

3) kidney beans (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

4) yellow split peas (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

5) red split peas (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

6) chick peas (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

7) black beans (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

8) soy beans (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

9) lima beans (2 tablespoons/30 ml)

10) organic wheat (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

11) pearled barley (1 tablespoon/15 ml)

12) organic wild rice blend (2 tablespoons/30 ml)

 

 

 

The beans are bought in separate packs and mixed. You can try to find pre-mixed grains-beans mix at health food stores but they would nto carry the exact ingredients as required for the mash. Some of the beans are not available in Singapore's supermarkets and therefore I tend to use organic grains and beans from health food stores if I can't find them in the supermarkets. Freshness of dried beans and grains can be extended by storing them in the freezer, otherwise they can be stored at room temperature in cool and dry places.

 

The beans are rinsed several times and soaked overnight (at least 8 hours of soaking). This will soften the grains and beans up and activate the process of germinating, which further enhance their nutritional values.

 

They are again rinsed several times before filled with clean water that just barely covers the mixture. The mixture is heated to boiling for 10 minutes and then allowed to simmer till most of the water has been simmered off. The trick is to have as little water left from the cooking as possible as nutrients will be leeched into the water. By simmering till dry, it will further soften the grains and beans while retaining the nutrients. This cooking method is similar to cooking rice.

 

The cooked grains-beans mix is the allowed to cool before used for the mash.

 

Part 2: Frozen Vegetables Mix Component

13) frozen corn

14) frozen peas

15) frozen carrots

16) frozen green beans

(all-in-one 500g pack)

 

Frozen vegetable mix can be bought direct from supermarkets and grocery shops. Stored in freezer compartment and thawed when needed.

 

Part 3: Cooked Vegetable Roots Component

17) steamed sweet potato (1 small piece/175g)

18) steamed white potato (1 small piece/175g)

 

 

The sweet potato and white potato are cut into cubes and lightly steamed. Steaming will make them more palatable as well as make it more easily digestible.

 

 

 

Part 4: Seeds Component

19) sesame seeds (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

20) raw pumpkin seeds (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

 

 

 

 

Pumpkin seeds are raw. they are harvested from pumpkins directly and not bought commercially. You can buy pumpkins and retain the seeds. These are washed and sun dried. The sesame seeds are bought from supermarkets or shops. You can choose either black or white sesame.

 

 

 

 

Part 5: Fresh Vegetables and Fruits Component

21) zucchini (1 small piece/60g)

22) tomatoes (1 piece/110g)

23) parsley (25g)

24) tou miao (baby green leafed vegetables; 25g)

25) bananas (1 piece/150g)

26) apples (1 to 2 pieces/150g)

27) oranges (1 to 2 pieces/150g)

28) blueberries(1 tablespoon/15 ml)

29) mango (1/2 mango/60g)

30) papaya with seeds (150g)

31) red/green grapes (175g)

 

 

 

 

 

Fruits and vegetables are cut into bite size. Any leafy vegetable can be minced, especially for birds who turn away from these green vegetables. Mincing will ensure some of these vegetables in the form of tiny green pieces will be ingested together with the rest of the mash.

 

 

Part 6: Supplement Component

32) kelp powder (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

33) alfalfa powder (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

34) pollen powder (1 teaspoon/10 ml)

 

 

The supplement powders have been pre-mixed before the photo is taken. Some supplements can be bought containing both kelp and alfalfa. I added pollen and I also recommend another possible addition in the form of wheat grass powder. Just be careful with the amount as these are supplements and not main components of their diet.

 

Ingredients before mixing:

 

 

 

The final stage of preparation is simply a mixing of all the various components together. Just ensure that all the ingredients are well mixed.

End product:

 

 

 

Storage:

 

The mash is packed into serving size and stored in the freezer compartment for around 1 week. Each pack is thawed slowly over 24 hours in the cooling compartment of the fridge before serving.

Afterthought:

All my birds take the mash readily. It helps that they have been trained to eat these food as I have been feeding them fresh or cooked vegetables, fruits, grains-beans sprouted or cooked. So for them, it is just a change of presentation and variety.

Considering the issue of freshness, I would have preferred to offer the three main components separately so that the food offered will be as fresh as possible instead of having to freeze them. For example, I would advice to give one day cooked grains-beans mix, another day would be fresh vegetables and fruits mix and yet another day giving cooked vegetables.

 

 

 

[Jayd]

Hi, my reason for showing more recipes is to clarify that if a Chop, mash, glop or any other blended recipe, is correct and okay to feed your parrot as long as it has certain basic ingredients. After you have a basic recipe, everything else you add is personal or specific for your parrot. What are these ingredients?, how much?

To start, [largest percentages first]

 

Dark Leafy Veggies,

Orange and yellow veggies,

Legumes, peas, lentils

Grains

Fruit [more or less depending on species]

Supplements [food]

 

Supplements, pick and choose, read what others use and why than, experiment.

 

We don't freeze, we make a couple of days worth and don't add fruit until serving. How we do it isn't right or wrong, to freeze or not to freeze is completely up to you.

 

Substitute example: Kale for Turnip tops etc, depending upon you parrot likes

 

With this type of diet, always keep seed available, the amount of pellets you feed can be reduced greatly, since that's what this diet replaces.....

Enjoy Jayd

 

P.S. If I omitted something please feel free to correct..................

Edited October 1, 2012 by Jayd