Our story and we need help!

[Fratyr]

Hello,

 

I'm new to this forum, and to Grey's world as well. Introduction thread.

 

As I said in the introduction, my grey is around 9 months old, I've brought her home 6 months ago, she was barely feathered and very silly and scared.

 

I would like first, to share our story of 6 months being together, show some pics and then ask for help, as I feel that I've FAILED in raising my baby grey. :-(

Or maybe not?

 

So here It starts... June 2011, we brought her home in a closed box so she won't get stressed during the long driving trip.

 

We live in a warm country, Israel, so It's kinda very similar to where she comes from, Congo.

Hot and high humidity. Lots of fruits always even at the winter.

 

Unboxing Jaco!.. Her name is Coco.

 

First contact

 

After getting used to the main room, she could go asleep on the couch without any problem :-)

 

A few more pictures can be found here:

http://imageshack.us/g/208/feeding01.jpg/

 

First two months were very good and full of hapiness.

Hand feeding, kissing, playing, learning new sounds.

 

After that, I had a lot of personal and professional problems, and I couldn't dedicate too much time to my Grey. I know It's not an excuse, but that's the reality.

Tho my wife were helping me to feed her, play etc.. Still, I feel I've failed in getting to close with her in this critical period.

 

There were days when we wasn't playing or seeing each other at all, I wasn't paying attention to her.

Not taking bath for about 4 months!!! :-(

No new toys, no yummy fruits, etc...

What is good - she always was out of the cage during this period, sometimes playing with my wife, sometimes with the kids coming to visit us (brother's son etc..).

 

Currently, she's pretty playful with me, she's not biting at all, not screaming, she always comes to me when I take her, she kisses, hand feeding, sitting on my shoulders and cleaning my hair, chewing my ears or cleaning her self

 

What's bad now -

She don't let me touch her (under the wings, belly, tail, head, fingers), well, she is when I force her, but she tries to run away or step away.

She hates bath, she won't let me spray water over her, she tries to fly and I just can't understand how to bath her :-)

She's not really a person of hugs, I can touch her back, but not too much

 

Well, in my opinion It's still a fail and now I have a lot of questions and I want to revive the situation.

I saw the same age grey at my friends and their grey is much more friendly to them.

 

I hope this bird can forgive me, so...

If anyone is willing to help a bird, please answer a few questions of mine so I can make her life much happier.

 

1. First of all, what I did, is It something recoverable in terms of a baby grey to start trusting me and letting me interact with her? Or It's too late?

2. How to make her take a bath?

3. When she's cleaning her self, there's a lot of dust. What is this and what to do? Bath? ;-)

4. Any good threads/docs explaining how to properly play with greys without making them scared or anger / and how to teach them speak, that you can suggest?

5. I hear a lot about plucking feathers, my grey is not doing it yet, but what are the steps to lower the risk of that? Don't want her to look like a thanksgiving day turkey. :-/

6. I saw here a lot of thread about their health and care, but everything is seriously spread around, is there any good place with health/care tips in one?

7. ??? Whatever you want to say, tip, or tell me that I'm a jerk.

 

Thanks a lot to anyone who will decide to help or spend some minutes on reading our story.

 

Hope everything will be good.

[JeffNOK]

I will just address a few of your questions. First of all, Coco is still young and whatever damage you think you may have done it isn't too late. Bathing is very important for your grey, so I recommend do a spray bottle misting bath at least two times a week. Greys typically don't like baths, so don't worry if she seems to dislike it. With regular bathing she will get used to it in time and at least tolerate it. As far as cuddles, strokes, and general handling--please be patient and don't try to rush or force things. My grey (Female CAG Gracie) is still at the breeders and will be home in a few weeks. I visit her almost daily and she doesn't really like to be touched very much either. Some of the other grey babies with her are just the opposite. They love handing and cuddles. In many ways it is just a difference in personality. I don't force the issue with Gracie. I interact with her by having her step up and sit on me. We play with toys together, and I give her treats and things to chew on. If I'm lucky she will let me rub my chin or cheek against her feathers, but if I try to pet her, she moves away or flies off. Let Coco do things at her pace and on her terms. Greys need to be able to make decisions. In time she may be a cuddly bird, but there are no guarantees. Your relationship will develop naturally and in a way that suits her personality. I'm glad you are resolved to spend more quality time with Coco. That is what both of you need to solidify your bond. With regards to talking, avoid just repeating words or phrases to her that you want her to learn. Instead, most grey parronts recommend just speaking meaningfully to your grey like you would a young child. You might want to "Broadcast" what you are doing as you go about your day: "I'm going to get a toy for Coco", "I'm going to make dinner", "I'm going to take a shower" etc--just give words to your actions as you do them and she will pick up the meaning over time. Good luck and welcome!

[Fratyr]

Thanks a lot!

Very helpful and positive. Will do!

[JeffNOK]

As for plucking--this is an issue that does affect some greys. The main thing is to make sure she is healthy and has a rich diet with lots of fruits and veggies as well as sufficient calcium. Bathing her regularly (with some aloe vera mixed in the water) will help her skin and prevent irritation that can lead to plucking. Also, it may be good to get a humidifier in your home if the weather becomes too dry. This can also cause skin issues and possible irritation. Most importantly, greys often pluck because they are bored or lonely. Spend lots of time with her, give her a good assortment of toys, and make her feel safe secure and loved at all times. Is Coco clipped? Some people say that flighted greys are less likely to pluck--but this is not a proven fact. Even with every precaution, some greys still pluck. If that ever happens, make sure you take her to an avian vet for a health check. Also, there are some products that you can buy that are supposed to help greys stop plucking, but I don't know how effective they are. From what I understand, plucking is usually not an issue until the grey is a few years old, so you have lots of time to do whatever you can to prevent it now. Also, if she does start to pull feathers out, try not to react or show your concern. This often makes the habit worse. All this being said, a plucked grey is still a wonderful creature and you will love Coco no matter what.

Edited November 24, 2011 by JeffNOK

[pikachu]

She sounds like a perfectly normal CAG to me!

Remember, they go through developmental stages just like other babies.

[Eshana]

You didn't fail! Things come up in life, and whatever mood changes you're experiencing is normal for a grey.

 

Also, the "no liking water" thing is normal in a lot of birds. Some birds like water, some don't...it's not a species thing either, it's a bird by bird basis.

 

By the way, it's so cool you live in Israel! I'm 1/8th Israeli myself.

[Morana]

Hi and welcome!:-)

 

Fratyr: There were days when we wasn't playing or seeing each other at all, I wasn't paying attention to her.

Not taking bath for about 4 months!!! :-(

No new toys, no yummy fruits, etc...

 

MORANA: Well, if it is any consolation, I was neglecting my Grey without realizing it for much longer than you have, and I'm 100% sure I could do better even now but important thing is to realize it and to do something about it. You are in the right place;-) BTW, my Grey doesn't hate me and we overcame many, many difficulties so hang in there, everything will be just fine;-)

I can tell you, there are days that I am so tired I can't even stand let alone play with my Grey but I try.. You need to try. What is done is done but remember that your birdie needs you and you need to try for her. The more pressing issue is that you need to find toys that Coco likes. I don't know how is with toys in your county but I order some food and toys from stores in the UK or US. Some toys I make myself. You really need to occupy your bird so she wouldn't get bored. Also try foraging tree/toys.. What diet is Coco on? Start offering veggies and fruits to your bird daily. Read carefully which ones are toxic. This applies to plants in your birds environment too.

Bathing is a must do. As already mentioned, if a bird doesn't bathe skin starts to itch and bird will start overpreaning and maybe even pluck. My Zak also hated the bath in the beginning, but after time he became more and more relaxed. It took a really long time to achieve that but Zak loves bathing now. Try misting Coco and over time it will probably get better. But don't force too much. I started with little misting and if Zak was shaking too much (because he was scared) I would back off and maybe try later or another day.. Nothing should be done by forcing the bird. That is not a way to build trust. Just to mention..I also didn't figure out, for quite a long time, why Zak wouldn't play with his toys.. He likes just one kind-shreddable ones;-) You need to be careful, if you make your own toys that you use non toxic materials/colors.

Another thing a bird will need is sunbathing. I sunbathe Zak for an hour every day outside (in the cage) if it is sunny and warm enough. The alternative is full spectrum lighting for birds!! Don't buy bulbs for reptiles or fishes. It has to have correct amount of UVA and UVB .

 

Fratyr:What's bad now -

She don't let me touch her (under the wings, belly, tail, head, fingers), well, she is when I force her, but she tries to run away or step away.

She hates bath, she won't let me spray water over her, she tries to fly and I just can't understand how to bath her :-)

She's not really a person of hugs, I can touch her back, but not too much

 

MORANA: Don't force the bird. It is very important! Be very patient, observe your bird and introduce everything gradually. I don't like to be touched everywhere so why should your bird like that? We/they are all different. Also, when you gain Cocoas trust things might change... Maybe not.. It shouldn't be a pressing issue (right now).. When my Zak was frustrated with my neglection he wasn't a snugly bug either but now we came to the point when he is and it is very rewarding;-)

Bathing.. It took a lot of praise and cheering (it still does) for Zak to even start bathing, but once he starts it is a blast:-D Be patient and don't give up.. Bathing is very important..

 

 

Fratyr:I hope this bird can forgive me, so...

 

MORANA: I don't think they forgive. Let me rephrase.. There is nothing to forgive. You act in a way and your bird acts accordingly. Your job is to try to understand this bird and to make her life better and happy,fulfill her needs and earn trust. As long as you try to do the very best for your bird, you'll be fine. You need to forgive yourself and move on.

 

Fratyr:

1. First of all, what I did, is It something recoverable in terms of a baby grey to start trusting me and letting me interact with her? Or It's too late?

2. How to make her take a bath?

3. When she's cleaning her self, there's a lot of dust. What is this and what to do? Bath? ;-)

4. Any good threads/docs explaining how to properly play with greys without making them scared or anger / and how to teach them speak, that you can suggest?

5. I hear a lot about plucking feathers, my grey is not doing it yet, but what are the steps to lower the risk of that? Don't want her to look like a thanksgiving day turkey. :-/

6. I saw here a lot of thread about their health and care, but everything is seriously spread around, is there any good place with health/care tips in one?

7. ??? Whatever you want to say, tip, or tell me that I'm a jerk.

 

MORANA: Of course it is not too late!

Don't think in a way: how to MAKE her do something. You shouldn't force anything. She is alive, intelligent creature who can choose what to do. Use positive reinforcement to get her to like doing something that you would like her to do.

Lot of dust is because she is not bathing. They always have dust but it is more or less ok when bathing is regular.

Don't force talking. It will come. I still don't know how my Zak started to mimic a chicken! Lol

About playing.. I think lot of other members do this much better than me but here is my way..I try to play with a new toy in front Zak to peak an interest. I pick it up frequently. Always keep the toy in sight so Zak would get used to it. In one shreddable toy I stuck seeds so Zak went after the seeds and ended up playing and eventually destroying the toy :-)

What about plucking? Try occupying your bird with toys and foraging as much as you can, especially while you are away and I think Cocoa will be just fine. Use aloevera juice when bathing. I put one third of it in the water with which I spray Zak with. He is looking dashing;-)

About lot of treads..you'll just need to read and ask specific questions;-)

 

Good luck and keep us informed!! :-)

[Fratyr]

Thanks to everyone for support.

 

Morana, THANKS A MILLION for this information and words of support. It really helped me to understand things, now I'll be more careful!

[Morana]

I'm glad that I helped.

You'll get through reading who are more knowledgeable members . Some members work much with their birds. When you figure out who they are keep an eye on their threads;-) I'm not saying/thinking that other members aren't valuable or contributing but some have a really special parenting skills;-)

One of the best things here is that someone, novice or not, asks/tells something of great interest/help to the rest of us. This is such a great place!:-)

[thenabrd]

ok, relax and breathe!! you've found a great place to help you with questions and to connect with others. all of our greys are individuals, in fact all creatures are individuals. as with all individuals, there are likes/dislikes, different personalities, etc. my conure is not the playful clown that conure's are supposedly known to be. my grey is very brave about some things that other greys are terrified of from some of what i've read. so, try to find what kind of individual you have. once trust and respect has been gained, you'll be surprised at what is possible!

 

plucking! ok, athena is an on again/off again plucker. even kallie has an area on her neck she picks. they're both healthy according to the vet and have regular checkups. they both have tons of toys, things to shred and preen, are in our living room, tv/radio is left on if we're not home, can look out the front window, have areas where they can "hide" from the world inside their cage if they want/need to, eat as healthy as we can get them to eat, get misted (athena takes regular baths in her water bowl), have a humidifier for the winter, etc. all that said, they still pluck! if this happens, you can't get stressed about it, unless there is a physical/health reason or they are mutilating themselves, then you do what you need to for their physical well being. even then, you have to keep the stress away from the bird as the bird can sense the stress and it makes the problem even worse. so what works for me is that athena likes to run around in her grey down underwear (or if she's feathered, she's in a beautiful green shirt), kallie doesn't like wearing a "turtleneck" or sometimes she does (if the feathers have grown back) we love them no matter whether they're completely "dressed" or not, lol!

 

not all birds like or even should be touched/cuddled all over. when the bird becomes mature, that could cause a problem with frustration, if you know what i mean.

 

you'll find balance with all of this, just like new parents find balance when they have their 1st baby. patience, patience, and more patience! i know its easier said than done, but all of us have many years of life and adventures ahead of us with these little gems! don't be afraid to ask questions, read as much as you can. sometimes you'll even need to think "outside of the box" since what works for one doesn't work for all.

Edited November 29, 2011 by thenabrd

[kins2321@yahoo.com]

Fratyr... I agree with Morana. Fantastic advice! Slow down! Your baby sounds quite normal to me also. It sounds like baby has progressed quite well. It sounds to me, like YOU need to catch up, and are trying! I would be glad to help you personally, if you would like. Kins2321@yahoo.com. It is not a race for time. Your bird is doing just fine. We will all help you, educate you, just make sure you don't turn this into a stressful time for your baby. The education, is about you. Well it should be. I would love to help you. We need to make sure your grey doesn't pick up on your stress.They are VERY sensitive to owners stress. Nancy