African Grey advice needed - Please help!

[Popsicle]

Hi Everyone!

 

I'm 29yo, married, no kids. My husband works from 9am to 6pm and I'm not working at the moment but intend to start working soon. I've had 2 Blue Fronted Amazon parrots and 2 parakeets when I was living with my family in Brazil. They were not tame but I really enjoyed them. I had to leave them with my family when I married and relocated to the UK. And now I'd really like to have a parrot again and I'm keen to get a hand reared African Grey. I've been doing a LOT of research, watching videos, reading articles, etc.

My main doubts are:

1. As they are very intelligent, they need a lot of stimulation and attention. Whilst I'm not working it will be fine, but what will happen when I start working again? Do any of you have to leave the parrot alone during the day to go to work? What do you do? Do they cope fine? I know the main trick is leaving treats and foraging toys in the cage so they can keep busy. Also they take naps during the day. Any other ideas? How is your experience with it? Please share!

2. I've read AG are quieter than Amazons, for example. Do you think they are reasonably quiet or not? My Amazons were pretty loud!

3. How many hours do you normally let them out and play with them every day?

4. And if you have to go out after work and can't play with them on that day? Do they cope with it as well? How should we deal with them on occasions like these?

5. Even though we are planning on moving to a house asap, we're currently living in a flat. Anyone had problems with Greys in apartments?

 

Thanks a lot! :-)

[danmcq]

Answers below your questions and welcome to the forum!

 

My main doubts are:

1. As they are very intelligent, they need a lot of stimulation and attention. Whilst I'm not working it will be fine, but what will happen when I start working again? Do any of you have to leave the parrot alone during the day to go to work? What do you do? Do they cope fine? I know the main trick is leaving treats and foraging toys in the cage so they can keep busy. Also they take naps during the day. Any other ideas? How is your experience with it? Please share!

 

A) Yes, they cope just fine when left while your at work. As you already have mentioned, just have plenty to keep them busy in their cage.

 

2. I've read AG are quieter than Amazons, for example. Do you think they are reasonably quiet or not? My Amazons were pretty loud!

 

A) Greys are normally very quite compared to any other parrot

 

3. How many hours do you normally let them out and play with them every day?

 

A) We let them out for 4 hours minimum when we are at work. I started working from home, so now I let them out at lunchtime and they are out until we go to bed. They adapted very well to varied hours.

 

4. And if you have to go out after work and can't play with them on that day? Do they cope with it as well? How should we deal with them on occasions like these?

 

A) They would of course be longing for your attention the minute you walk through the door and most will even start contact calling before you ever get you hand on the door knob to enter. I would at least take the birds out and interact with them, even if for only 30 to 60 minutes before retiring so they get some actual out time with you. But, thats just how we roll.

 

5. Even though we are planning on moving to a house asap, we're currently living in a flat. Anyone had problems with Greys in apartments?

 

A) They get a long just fine in apartments.

[Malikah]

I am lucky to be able to have a bird room with a large play gym that I can leave her in. I also have a companion bird in there - Charlie the parakeet. I leave the radio on for them some days too. Some days I put her in her cage in the livingroom where she can see the TV and leave that on for her. She can also see out the window. I let her decide where she wants to hang out while I am gone. I have lots of toys, I rotate which ones are out, and rearrange toys and perches often. I do have foraging and destructable toys and hide treats around in her cage. She finds the treats all very quickly, so I don't know how much good it does except make her happy to go in there! LOL!

 

I think Kito is pretty quiet for a larger bird, I have never heard her scream. My conure was much louder. I'm glad I didn't get Kito until after Jolly the Jenday passed away though. I'll bet she could scream good and loud if she wanted too! I'm pretty sure Amazons are considerably louder. I find all her whistles and noises quite pleasant, but if I were you I would talk with my neighbors first.

 

Optimally (from what I have read), you should have at least 3 different areas where your parrot can hang out (even if one is on the outside of their cage) and they should have a minimum of 3 or 4 hours (total) out of the cage daily. Some days this isn't possible, so if they can get out for 30 minutes three or four times on those days it shouldn't bother them too much. Spend at least 5 to 10 minutes of that time face to face with them when they are out. I have rearranged my life so that Kito is rarely alone for more than 3 hours at a time. I miss her too much if I'm gone longer than that!

[Popsicle]

Thank you so much for your replies. It's helping a lot.

 

It's very sweet that you rearranged your life to spend more time with your parrot, Malikah. When I start working I will try to do the same.

 

Another thing I've been trying to figure out is... what should I choose? Timneh or Congo? Is there a significant difference between them, apart from the looks? Is one quieter than the other? I've noticed Timnehs are cheaper. Why is it? Just because they are less popular? Or is there a negative side to them?

 

Which one do you have? Looks like you both got CAG.

Edited June 8, 2011 by Popsicle

[judygram]

Dan has pretty much answered your questions and so glad you are considering a grey, we all live different lives but as grey owners we do the best we can for our fids especially our greys. I work full time as does my hubby but my grey comes out as soon as I get home and stays out until her bedtime and some days it might not be as much as on some days when I might get home later than usual but they cope very well. Today I happen to have her with me at work, I do bring her occasionally as she enjoys the one on one time she spends with me without the other two fids.

[Popsicle]

I'd love to get a job I could take my parrot with me too. hehe

[MarcusCAG]

Another thing I've been trying to figure out is... what should I choose? Timneh or Congo? Is there a significant difference between them, apart from the looks? Is one quieter than the other? I've noticed Timnehs are cheaper. Why is it? Just because they are less popular? Or is there a negative side to them?

 

There are a lot of "Timneh vs. Congo" threads here in the forum... it is a perennial topic! Timneh greys are usually much smaller than the Congos, and although some generalizations can be made (ie-that Timnehs often start talking before the Congos) I think it really must boil down to each individual bird. Some may be more outgoing/friendly, some more reserved. Some may end up talking a lot, some may always be 'quieter'. I've read enough here of the various forum members' birds to think that, regardless of the Grey being a Timneh or a Congo, they're all intelligent and have their own personalities. Just like people.

 

If I can throw this out, however, if you are interested in acquiring a Grey at some point, do please look around and see if there are any Greys--Timneh or Congo--that need to be adopted in your area. Older birds sometimes take a little more effort, but they can make wonderful companions and over time can just show so much love... and there are so many grown parrots that need loving forever homes, if you can open your heart to a poor 'second-hand bird' then regardless of the subspecies, you'll know your Grey got a second chance at happiness and life with you.

[Popsicle]

Hi Marcus,

 

Thanks for your advice. All my parrots and parakeets in Brazil were "second hand". hehe But they were not tame and I only managed to tame a little bit the small parakeets. The big ones would bite easily. So this time I am hoping to get a hand reared baby to be sweet and well socialized. Especially because it will be my husband's first parrot and he wants one that he will be able to play with and give love to. He doesn't want to take the risk of having a parrot that will be horrible to him like my Amazons were. However, when we buy our own house (hopefully in a year or two) and have more space I do intend to get another one. And will definitely consider adoption for the second one. I agree there are so many birds out there that have been abandoned and are in need of a loving home. I'm gonna be pleased to help one of them for sure. Is yours adopted?

Edited June 8, 2011 by Popsicle

[Dave007]

There's no difference between the two other than basic personality. Either personality is easy to handle but they are 2 different birds. Timnehs take to new things much more quickly than Congos. A Timneh is an extrovert --a congo isn't. Congos need much more time to investigate new things--toys--new cages--new people--new environments. Timnehs need much less time. Amazons and african greys are very different species and in the amazon world, there's many personalities. Some are loud, some aren't. All are intelligent. The subject of talking rarely comes up on amazon bird boards because there'sso many different ones to pick from. The main topic of discussion on amazon boards have to do with aggressiveness or lack of.

 

Price difference------The congo is more popular because of all the hype concerning their talking. They're also more popular because of their coloring. Timnehs have a very different beautiful color and eventually, an owner can easily see that. They have no red tails. They have marroon to dark grey ash tail coloring. Sadly, coloring and size has to do a lot with pricing.

The reason for the price difference is because all of the information that's put out has to do with greys. Little is put out concerning timnehs. Articles, utube and other info concerning greys has to do with their talking plus the other reason is their coloring. Most people who put out videos of their out congo has to do with ability to talk or the ability to play with toys. Timnehs do the exact same thing. Interaction with people is the same for both birds. Each has to be socialized into a family setting.

Simply because of your questions, I can that you haven't had experience with greys and greys are different than amazons.

It's a new experience and the last thing I would advise do do is that you get a rehomed bird. A rehomed bird has habits and ingrained traits which he/she will bring into your home. Those may be very difficult to handle. Those habits and traits can't be changed. Here in the US, there's very legitimate places to buy rehomed birds BUT those organizations will also tell people who adopt that they'll be paying a visit within 6 to 8 mts to see what's going on with the bird and if theres serious problems, a person has to give the bird back.

sme people only have Congos. Some people only have timnehs. Some people have both. I have both and I can tell you from past experience that one of my congos and my one timneh wouldn't have lasted very long in an inexperienced home. They were given to me because each had drastic but different problems. Both were adults when I got them. It took a long time for my wife and I to deal with the timneh and his problem. It took me even longer to deal with the congo because of his problem.

One last thing I would never do is to tell my neighbors about any congo or timneh I may have.

There's only 2 medium to large sized species of parrots that you may have to tell a neighbor about----a macaw--a cockatoo. Two of the loudest birds around.

Edited June 8, 2011 by Dave007

[MarcusCAG]

Is yours adopted?

 

Yes, we've had Marcus for about eight months now (all of our parrots were adopted 'second-hand', actually). We were told Marcus was eight years old when we adopted him from his former home. He didn't have the worst of circumstances, but he certainly didn't have the best either, and most assuredly his quality of life is a lot better now. It has taken some time to work through some things with him, and we're still dealing with a few other issues, but the turnaround has really been amazing... He's really such a lovebug, and most of the time very gentle. In the beginning he bit, but I think that was more because noone had ever taught him to be gentle. Does he still bite? Yes, occasionally, but it's not anything major. But all parrots will bite at one point or another; with the young ones it might be testing out independence, with older and more neglected/abused birds it's usually fear. With enough time and trust and love, however, those occasions can become fewer and farther between.

 

I will admit, I grew up in a home with a wild-caught Amazon, too, and unfortunately my parents really didn't work much with him. At the time, I knew nothing about parrots and now I think back and get angry and depressed that I didn't try to help that bird a lot more than I did. My mom was very afraid of his bite, and although I was too, when I got to be in my teens I did take him out for a nice shower on the back porch every once in a while in his cage. I hate to think that was really the only joyful interaction he got... so of course he bit, whenever he had the chance. He was lonely and miserable and away from the jungle where he should still have been. When I got married and, after one of my beloved mammalian pets died, I told my husband I wanted a parrot, something more suited to the temperatures here--he just stuck his feet in, citing my parents' Amazon. "He bites, he's angry all the time..." Of course he was, I wish he was still alive so I would take him from my parents' home and let him join our flock here. Anyway, I convinced him it was just because he had been wild-caught, and not at all worked with. We got our little Quaker parrot first (you could say he was 'practice' in a way), and then along came Marcus about five months later... slightly intimidating, he was more the size of the Amazon my parents had than our little Beaker, and he was unused to human contact. (Marcus hadn't been let out of his cage in over three years before we adopted him.) So it did take some time, but again, the turnaround has been amazing and, honestly, so worth it! So I'm sorry if I'm babbling, I just wanted to let you know I understand, in a way and it sounds like in the future you will be able to care for a lovely flock, too.

Edited June 8, 2011 by MarcusCAG

[Popsicle]

Your story is very similar to mine. I didn't know anything about parrots when I got my Amazons either. Therefore I didn't deal with them properly. I also feel guilty about it but now I'm far from home I've been talking to my parents and making them buy toys, bigger cages, etc. Trying to keep them happier. Hope it is helping.

 

My husband seems so concerned about the commitment of having a Grey. He worries the bird is gonna annoy the neighbours and he will "rule" the house. lol It's his first parrot and he's scared of what our routine will be like after we get the Grey. I'm sure it will be great fun for us as we don't plan on having kids for 2-3 years. But sometimes I worry he might not cope with noise, etc. I wonder if I should start with a small bird, like you did. I find the Indian Ringnecks absolutely charming. Seen a few videos and seen them here in London, in parks and they are so cute. My husband and I were actually considering buying them in the beginning, before we fell in love with the idea of buying a Grey. I can see you have them. How is your Ringneck? Does he have a good personality? Is he affectionate? Does he speak? Is he noisy?

 

I know this is probably a crazy question as they are so different. And I'm sure you love them all, probably the same. But if you had to choose to buy just one of them, would you buy a Ringneck or a Grey?

 

Thanks for helping!

Edited June 8, 2011 by Popsicle

[MarcusCAG]

Your story is very similar to mine. I didn't know anything about parrots when I got my Amazons either. Therefore I didn't deal with them properly. I also feel guilty about it but now I'm far from home I've been talking to my parents and making them buy toys, bigger cages, etc. Trying to keep them happier. Hope it is helping.

 

I'm sure it is.

 

My husband seems so concerned about the commitment of having a Grey. He worries the bird is gonna annoy the neighbours and he will "rule" the house. lol It's his first parrot and he's scared of what our routine will be like after we get the Grey. I'm sure it will be great fun for us as we don't plan on having kids for 2-3 years. But sometimes I worry he might not cope with noise, etc.

 

Greys are long-lived and complicated creatures--they are a great commitment. But there are a lot of threads here in the different 'rooms' of these forums that address behavioral issues, training, and et cetera that can help an owner learn to treat their parrot(s) in such a way that they will not 'rule the roost' so to speak. It's like any relationship, really: You see parents with obedient, well-mannered children and you see people with crazy, disrespectful misfits. Some of it is inborn temperament, or perhaps a condition or disorder, but much of it is really how they're dealt with. Patience, love, respect, consistency, and education can go a long way.

 

I wonder if I should start with a small bird, like you did. I find the Indian Ringnecks absolutely charming. Seen a few videos and seen them here in London, in parks and they are so cute. My husband and I were actually considering buying them in the beginning, before we fell in love with the idea of buying a Grey. I can see you have them. How is your Ringneck? Does he have a good personality? Is he affectionate? Does he speak? Is he noisy?

 

I know this is probably a crazy question as they are so different. And I'm sure you love them all, probably the same. But if you had to choose to buy just one of them, would you buy a Ringneck or a Grey?

 

My, all these questions! To tell you the truth, we only just got Tybalt, our Ringneck, last month. He and Bunsen (our cockatiel) just finished their quarantine... Tybalt is very wild still, actually. He is an excellent flier, he makes lots of lovely figure-eights all around the room, and he is sharp as a tack. Although I think in the long run our Marcus will still be the more capable and consistent with his cognitive and vocal achievements, and has the most potential in that regard, I wouldn't be surprised if Tybalt ends up not too far behind him in the end. He really seems to comprehend already many of the things I tell him. He does talk a little, yes, he came to us saying "okay" and "good boy" in a lovely, crystal-clear voice. He's saying his (new) name now, too, and some other things I say to him--"Tybalt? Tybalt? Be a good boy!"--so I figure he must be happy enough here with us, if he's saying his new name already.

 

In terms of noise, I'd say our Quaker parrot is much louder, although my husband seems to consider Tybalt's natural calls "shrill". (And when he bit me once, it wasn't as hard as it could have been, which I appreciated--it was more of a 'cockatiel'-type bite than even a Quaker parrot bite... which can be very painful!!) Tybalt makes some wonderful happy noises at our other parrots though, chirps and whistles and things. I've seen some videos online of tamed Ringnecks and they are just the most affectionate little guys, in time I hope that we can work with Tybalt enough so that he can relax with us like that. I'm sure he will. Yesterday he took some cooked pasta from my fingers for the first time, so it's a start!

 

In terms of loving them all, who I love best--goodness, how can you ask a mother that? Marcus will always be my Marcus, I realize that. There's just something between us, he's my boy, and even though he loves his Daddy I think he's bonded to me. Yet believe it or not, little Bunsen the cockatiel is wriggling his way into my heart pretty deep, too. He's very sweet and obedient and surprisingly (to me) intelligent. Beaker, being a Quaker, is very fiery and obviously has bonded to his Daddy, although he loves me too. And Tybalt... we're still getting to know. So with any parrot, I think, there is the capacity for a wonderful relationship. They take a ton of time and energy, and sometimes they're rotten and bratty and they bite, but I wouldn't trade them for anything. The love and the joy and the playful times and everything else make up for all the 'negatives' a hundredfold.

 

...Hope that helps a little!

[Malikah]

It took me a minute to figure out why you wouldn't talk to your neighbors about getting a parrot. I'm just a small town girl.

[Popsicle]

Haha I knew it would be hard for you to "choose" one of your parrots. Thanks for answering all my questions though. It has been helping a lot.

 

I'm sure we are gonna love and enjoy any type of parrot we get. But I have to admit I'm very much in love with the Greys and very keen to buy one. But I'm trying to be cautious before we actually choose what we are gonna get because I wanna treat my new parrot right! After all is a long term commitment. And I wanna make sure he will be really happy in our family.

 

People say AG are a one person parrot. Do you agree with that? You did say Marcus loves your husband as well. Is he sweet with other people too? I really want a pet that both of us can enjoy, hold, play with.

[Talon]

I do not believe that a parrot is a one person only bird. Some do prefer one person over the other, (just like us, they do have their favorite person). But my 3 parrots enjoy all of us in my house. There are 5 of us,.

[Talon]

Im going to throw my 2 cents in here. Personally, I would not get a grey or amazon if I was planning on having kids in the near future. I know others do it, but I have seen too many people give their birds up because they dont have the time for them once the new baby comes into the house. You also have to be extra careful with children around any large parrot for any reasons, biting, escaping, etc. I would not be able to devote myself to both a parrot and my children until my kids were older.

I have 4children and we didn't get our first grey until my youngest was 7. Just my opinion is all, something to think about so you make the right choice for you and your husband, your bird and future children.

[danmcq]

Talon is right. They are not one person birds. Our grey and conure both interact with us and all guests that enter our home. They do of course have what I call their cuddle muffin, which is my wife. Both readily interact with me on a different level that includes lots of playing, flying around playing peekaboo and if they get the opportunity a good pinch/bite in if I let my reflex's slow down during all the playing. There is also at least a few times during the day that one of them will want and allow me to give a head scratch or two as well and a belly tickle sometimes. So put that concern out of your head.

[Popsicle]

It's a relief to know that it's a myth that AG are a one person bird.

 

And Talon I appreciate your advice. I agree babies/small kids are hard work and therefore I will be busier when they come. But I only want to have 1 or 2 kids so I believe I will still have energy for my other child as well (the parrot).

[GT_Jacket]

But I only want to have 1 or 2 kids so I believe I will still have energy for my other child as well (the parrot).

 

Isn't it cute how naive they are at this young age

 

It is my understanding that you need to work to keep an AG from becoming a one person bird. Make sure they are exposed to many people early on.

[MarcusCAG]

And Talon I appreciate your advice. I agree babies/small kids are hard work and therefore I will be busier when they come. But I only want to have 1 or 2 kids so I believe I will still have energy for my other child as well (the parrot).

 

I will admit that ran through my head, too, when I read it. I do know there are a lot of forum members here who have children and parrots both, but the idea of a newborn entering into a home with an established flock might be 'more than most people can chew at once'. It can be done, I'm sure, I didn't say anything because we don't have kids at this point and I didn't want to sound like I was judging for someone else, but Talon made a very good point. It's just something to consider... perhaps starting off with a smaller parrot before the children, and then waiting for a larger bird once the children are a bit more grown? Just a thought.

 

And like Talon and Dan said, Greys (most any parrot, really) can learn to love multiple individuals, even if they always have a 'favorite' in the household. Marcus, I know, tried to get head-tickles from my mom when she visited, but she was afraid of him and so I had to explain to him that she still liked him anyway, she just didn't feel comfortable giving him scritches. So I think he's friendly enough with strangers, and if they were here often enough I think he could see them as 'buddies' or something, at least people to get treats out of!

[Popsicle]

I agree Talon made a good point and it's something we should consider. I also like your suggestion of getting a small one for now and then getting a bigger one in the future. I had thought about that before. And will reflect about it some more. See what hubby thinks as well. Thx.

[Popsicle]

Oh dear... my husband just said he wants the Grey. But now I'm a bit concerned. I will open another thread to find out if anyone in the forum went through the same situation (getting a parrot before having kids). And see what they can share...

Edited June 9, 2011 by Popsicle

[judygram]

Well lets just put it this way, we have seen many people and even some members here give up their greys after they have a child, they don't realize how much time it takes to take care of human children, if you have never had children then you have no idea of what you are getting into until it happens, think long and hard about this before you make a decision.

[Popsicle]

Morning all!

 

Today I come with another question... Do you ever take your parrots on small car trips? I'm asking because we visit my husband's family in a town nearby roughly once every two months. Sometimes we go for the day only and in those days I'd leave the parrot home. But in occasions like Xmas we spend a few more days there and then I'd have to take him with us. Do they cope with it alright? Does anyone know?

 

Thanks. x

[judygram]

I answered your question in the thread you started about that particular subject.