News travels fast

[Karcar]

Hello Guys,

Boy am I in a dilema, I just received a phone call from a Boxer rescue group in Reno that heard of our rescue of Angel and ask if there was any info or if I would be interested in helping with a lady that they have gotten info on that has 182 birds in a small house. From what I understand the conditions are pretty bad. I'm not unwilling to help but I am not that experienced in this area. I work in a drug rehab, we don't deal with OCD or any type of mental disorders which this clearly is I am not familiar with hoarding and what the law allows in regards to bird ownership which I understand she can call herself a rescue or breeder and have quite a large number of birds. I know we got no where legally with this so called gentleman that had been Angel previous owner, birds for some reason have less rights that cats and dogs do at least in this state. What should I do? or better get what can I do? I have googled this in everyway I can think of and actually read a case where a lady had over 100 macaws and other birds and as soon as she got things cleaned up she was given the birds back. Any advice I hate to just refuse to even offer a suggestion of any kind I am going to be making calls tomorrow to the humane society, etc, etc If I am to be a completely honest I am a little gun shy right now after all that we went thru with poor sweet Angel but I'm not the type of person to just sit idle either. What do you think where do I start? I also thought about contacting her family but from what I understand her husband has already passed on and she has one son that moved to Boston because his mother refused to accept his gay lifestyle. There is a bird rescue in Reno as well but this lady isn't looking to have her birds rescued. Any and all suggestions are most welcome.

:confused:

 

Karen

[kittykittykitty]

Karen, I've read your post twice and wish I knew someone or even something. We have so many reports of this kind of thing in the news, mostly cats and dogs, but some birds. The SPCA, or usually animal control, sometimes the police, move in and remove the animals and often take the individual, usually a woman, to jail. This is really sad and you have such a good and kind heartI know it distress you greatly. Please keep us posted.

[danmcq]

Hi Karen, it's wonderful to see you are trying to help in this situation where hoarding seems to be a problem. The SPCA etc. can give you specifics on what they need information wise to take any action. Do you know if the living conditions of those birds are less than desirable? That would be #1 on a list. But as you say, unless there is a limitation on the quantity of birds a person is allowed to own, they may just do the same as the case you mentioned in regards once things are cleaned up (If bad conditions exist) the birds would still be left with her.

 

Please keep us updated on what you may find out.

[birdhouse]

Birds aren't apparently legally covered by the same protections as dogs & cats. But they may be protected as exotics.

 

I saw a website for Animal Ark & wondered if someone there might be able to help? If they aren't up on the specific laws that would apply, they might know where to go for official advise. And they may also know of local resources in the community.

[Greywings]

I just emailed you an excellent contact to give you some assistance.

[Buffy]

Call the board of health in your area. I would think it would be easiest to get the human some help first and then bring someone in to safely secure the birds into rescue organizations.

[Karcar]

I called the Spca, Nevada's humane society, the health dept, The local bird rescue, and the Reno police dept. I was spoken to rudely by some, felt blown off by others and told once that I was a busy body. I use to have a friend that always said" I care about me and my 4 and no more" He must of convinced quite a number of people to feel the same, but I refuse to believe the we are without hope. Thank you greywings for the info you sent I will contact her asap. I also found out about a feret rescue in a neighboring town I am going to give a call tomorrow and see if I get anything that can help me there as well. Please keep your fingers crossed the lady from the boxer rescued did say the conditions there are extreme.

Thanks everyone for your support, Karen

[judygram]

Karen be sure to let us know what you find out and I am not surprised you found some rude people and was told you were a busy body, sometimes it takes a "busy body" to get things done and for something to happen for the good, you go girl.

[Acappella]

I work as a professional organizer here in Ontario, and one of my colleagues has the specialized training to deal with hoarders. I'll ask her if she has any contacts near Reno. I know birds often are classified as exotics, with much looser regulations than have gotten passed for cats and dogs. The best way to approach it may be by looking at the overall health picture for the human involved, looking at the air quality etc... Due to tv shows, more people are now aware that hoarding is a mental disorder that is very resistant to treatment. The person has to want to get help. With animal hoarders it's even harder because they are, usually, very kind hearted persons who genuinely feel they are helping the animals they hoard, even when it is obvious to those of us outside the disorder that the animals are suffering.

 

First, I would say don't try to take this on yourself, you will quickly become exhausted and angry at the hoarder. When they are approached with anger and judgement they will shut down and retreat. The best approach would be to appeal to her love of the animals. Get some publicity for the situation, asking people to help her however they can to care for her animals. All publicity should be from the angle of helping a kind-hearted person who is overwhelmed. Maybe start a fund for vet care, ask for cage donations, food donations, even voluteers who could come into her home during the week to clean cages and give some out-of-cage time for the birds (much like human parents who have multiples often have volunteers coming into their home to help with laundry, feeding, cleaning etc...) Do Not threaten her, shame her, threaten to take them away. Things will only change once she trusts the people who are intervening. This will take a lot of deep calming breathing on the part of everyone because more than likely you'll want to scream "how can you do this, can't you see they're suffering". Remember this, she really really truly can't. If you can prove to her that the living conditions are the cause of health problems, both for her and the birds (it will carry more weight if you can prove the birds are sick - most hoarders are indifferent about their own hoarding-related health issues), that may motivate her to get some of them to better living conditions. Maybe take her to a place where birds are being cared for in ideal conditions, and let her see the contrast between that and the conditions her birds are living in, but again, not with a spirit of judgement. She has to open her own eyes, no one can do it for her.

 

See if you can get some help from the avian rescue you mentioned. They may be able to help organize a campaign amoung their supporters to improve the living conditions for these poor birds. This kind of story makes my heart hurt, not only for the animals, but for the hoarder, because she is trapped in her own mind just as surely as these birds are trapped in their cages.

Edited October 24, 2010 by Acappella

[judygram]

Thanks for sharing that information with us Marguerite as it helps to know how to deal with these kind of people and maybe it will be helpful to Karen in her quest to help this hoarder.

[Acappella]

One thing is virtually certain with a hoarder. If outside persons go in and clear out the space, without the persons' involvement, the hoarder will re-create the scenario as fast as he/she can. The loss of possesions and the re-gained open space actually creates anxiety in a hoarder, and because the anxiety feels unbearable they will do everything they can to fill up their space again. They are self-medicating, as surely as an alcoholic or drug addict is. We know now that just telling an alcoholic to stop drinking and taking away the booze won't cure alcoholism. Just removing the birds from this home won't cure this problem. Animal hoarders are even harder because they are actually able to tell themselves they're doing a good thing. With love and patience you have to gently and slowly show them the error in their thinking. Anything you do that creates anxiety will only cause the hoarder to hold on to their things tighter.

[Buffy]

I definitely like Acappella's ideas and think that would, by far, be the best way to go if at all possible. You might also want to contact your local PETA chapter, although I have some issues with the way PETA handles things, they are currently running an awareness of hoarding campaign. Despite my personal feelings about the way they sometimes go about getting things done, they do get results. I bet they could offer some advice and assistance as well.

[Acappella]

Hey, I was wondering if there was any update on this situation?

[Karcar]

So sorry, to be honest I was told about a person that could probably help this lady and I gave all info to that person, the lady (hoarder) is Native American and lives on one of the reservations in the area and so a whole new set of laws come into play from what I understand. I will try and find out what I can and I will also tell him of the conversations and idea's conveyed here. Thanks so much ! Karen

[Acappella]

Karen, my colleague got back to me with a name of a person who is a CPO-CD (Certified Personal Organizer-Chronic Disorganization) and has taken part in NSGCD (National Study Group Chronic Disorganization) studies. Her name is Sandra Lee Selden-Pawliszyn. Laureen suggested simply google-ing (pretty sure that's not a word) her name for more info, if you want to pass on the info. Marguerite