Madison/Madden my new blue fronted amazon...

[Brogers7684]

My husband and I re homed madison. We got him on July 25th, 2010. His birthday is May 18th, 2008. In his previous home he was kept in a small cage at all times. His past owner didnt know anything about birds. I have done tons and tons of research to prepare myself for my little life long companion. Of course i know that with all that research there are still lots of things i will have to learn directly from my little boy! with that being said i welcome all advice for my family and i on our new beginning with Madison.

 

 

I need a little advice please. We let Madden out of his cage when we get home until bedtime. At the top of our cage there is a opening that folds down and he can stand on it. this is where he likes to be the most while we are petting him. Last night when i went over there to give him some attention he sorta made a quick movement with his head and of course i pulled back and just walked away (not sure if that is a bad thing to do or not). my husband kept telling me to go back to him right then but i told him that i read to walk away from it and go back when i was ready. is that right? another question is with that opening on the cage being higher up than both of us tall is that a bad place for us to interact with him? his first night home my husband kept trying to get him to step up and all he would do is nibble all over his hands but never try to bite...is that a bad habit to let him do? i dont believe Madden has ever been trained to step up. should i do target training with his old perch that was in his old cage first and get him comfy with that then try our hand? he has flown off his cage once and just walked back to his cage which i thought was funny. also any advice to ME so that i will not let him know that i am "iffy" with him?? SORRY I AM ALL OVER THE PLACE!!! Thanks in advance!!!

[Jayd]

Great, Okay, lets get some personal experiences, they want to hear from you!!!! Jayd

[Brogers7684]

ok my husband just called me and said that he brought my step son and his friend over to see him (they were calm). he opened his top door and he came out like always. kevin said he was showing no signs of aggression so he went to touch him and he bit down. not fast no sound but bit down hard. kevin said he did not jerk back but it took him about 20 secs to free his finger. then when he went to try to put him back in the cage he went nuts. yelling and all. well i was trying to figure out WHY. and kevin told me earlier that he got him to step up on his perch and took him to sit with him on his lap in the recliner played with him for a bit them put him back in the cage and left to go somewhere. i am thinking maybe madison was upset that kevin put him back up after finally getting him to step up and playing with him. i am waiting to hear back from kevin on whether or not he got him back in the cage i told him to use a blanket. now that i know this do i need to be scared for him to come out again??

kevin just called and said that he went in his cage on his own. after hissing at him.

[Jayd]

This is normal behavior for a re-home Amazon. There's always 2 sides. Let's go back to what was said earlier, "go slow and easy". A Amazon gets over-stimulated easily, some need a cooling periods, just let them be for a little bit, then start over. If they bite, tell them "no, don't bite" firmly, there not like Greys, then try to touch their beak saying "Don't bite' nicely. If they won't go back to their cage right away, give them a little time, try coaxing or giving him a treat, before toweling. Your doing great, nothing wrong, like I said ups and downs and time and patience's. This birdy is testing you, pushing your limits to see how far he can get, don't change what your doing, everything your doing is ok! Zon's are very vocal!!!LOL... Jay d

Note: give him a little time to get used to you and your family before bringing to many new people over when he's not in his cage..

Edited July 28, 2010 by Jayd

[Brogers7684]

Jay I feel as if u have taking me under your wing

[Yossi]

Let me address the walk away vs. the not walk away question first. The rule of thumb is, if you are upset, yes walk away until you are not. If you're not upset, then don't. They pick up on your body language and other signs of emotion, including facial expression very easily. So let that be your emotions be your guide there. If you're just mildly disappointed/disapproving of them, don't walk away. Stay there and let them know it. It's how they learn social do's and don'ts of behavior.

 

For a bird that's been kept as you say this one has been, it's probably too early to start parading a stream of strange people through the house to show him off while he's outside his cage (his comfort zone). I would suggest a good 2-3 months depending on his tolerance for change. You've had him for less than a week and he's not acclimatized yet. At this point you really have no idea what his true behaviors will be, he's not showing them yet. Takes zons a long time to come out of their shell, so to speak. If he's not been trained, I would strongly suggest clipping his wings for now. Just this one time (I know this will stir some pots, but it does work). This will make him more dependent upon you and help facilitate your bonding and training for things like stepping up. A flighted bird can too easily ignore you and 'zons are really good at avoidance when they put they want to. You need to be in utter control right now. This also means no towels or blankets needed to get him under control, just a stick will do. You really don't want him to be afraid of towels or blankets, that creates more issues later.

 

Be consistent in his training. One person at a time, but both present. You need to both present commands to him the same way. This will help him build some confidence and comfort around what's expected of him. Work with him away from his cage. The bathroom (toilet lid down first please) is a great safe and quiet place to sit on the floor and work with him. Easier to clean up any accidents as most bathrooms don't have carpeted floors.

 

His cage looks great and it's fantastic he's showing interest in his toys. As Jayd mentioned, be ready to have him test your limits. He'll be like a child stuck in the terrible two's and he will be relentless in pushing boundries. 'Zons like to be the head of their flock and it will be up to you two to make sure he knows his place (another reason to work with him on the floor, not up high).

 

I probably could write a book here, but overall sounds like you're doing the right things and he's one lucky bird to have such loving new parents. I wish you best of luck!

 

Re: the wing clipping controversy. It only stirs resentment or causes problems if your behavior to the bird is wrong and the bird is treated wrong. I clip my 'zons during training and they have all been very happy well adjusted birds. They don't stay clipped and a clipping should never be severe. Just a few feathers so it's more work for them to try and fly. It's all about how you and the bird interact.

Edited July 28, 2010 by Yossi
clarity

[Brogers7684]

thank you so much Yossi! His Dr appt is Friday. my husband (Kevin) had him in his lap last night playing with him. i was in the room and gave him treats but i did not hold him. i talk to him all the time and i am the one who feeds him his yummy meals. I just want to hang out with him right now and us get used to each other before i start handling him right away. Kevin wants to jump right into it which is fine but i dont want Madison to bond more with kevin and end up being protective over him. I think i would be more comfortable like you said with him on the floor and do his training with him. when you say "no towels or blankets (which we didnt have to use), but a stick will do" do you mean to do the "touch it" command with the stick and everytime he does give him a treat or praise? if not what do you mean by that? are you saying once he learns that command use the stick in the cage and have him come in and "touch it"? thanks a lot!!

[Jayd]

Good morning and thank you Yossi. Remember http://www.greyforums.net/forums/showthread.php?190024-Ah-the-joys-of-parrot-mating-season! ? I feel a Zon need to be perched on both a finger and a stick, especially for that special time of the year. I do step-up training, finger and stick. Clipping, that's a choice only you can make. Always praise you baby...Bonding is a decision Madison will make, we have very little choice! Remember, "What works for one, may not work for another!" So be prepared for both success and failure. Store what you hear, and don't be afraid to try something new!!!

Jayd

Edited July 28, 2010 by Jayd

[Jayd]

I have a question?:confused: What are the colors under the wings?

Jayd

[pfcarquejo]

I have a question?:confused: What are the colors under the wings?

Jayd

Blue Front Amazon have several colours . Our Amazon ("Amazona Aestiva xanthopteryx"), have the flollowing coulours on their wings: Green (of course), yellow, Dark Blue and Red.

 

We are also having a behavioral problem with one of our Babies. As soon as I have the time I wil open a Thread here to discuss it ans get your opinion.

[GoDiego]

Hi Brogers7684,

 

SORRY I AM ALL OVER THE PLACE!!!

 

I know exactly how your feeling, I'm also a new mum to a Blue Fronted Amazon called Diego. He's 4 months old and is generally very sweet natured. Diego often gives me very mixed signals to how he is feeling. He will often fluff up his feathers, flutter his eyelids and then close them all together when I am talking to him so I feel we are going the right way with his trust. However, he could be giving me all of these signals and then out of the blue with no warning he could decide to give a slow quiet bite without any aggressive body language. I'm putting this down to him testing me on how far he can go before it is unacceptable, a bit like my young children who test me constantly on their boundaries. When he does act like this I simply walk away which he hates, when I return I do see a change in him at that moment. However, he will often try it again on another occassion, so I think it will be a slow process.

 

I have been doing a lot of research on bird behaviour so that I can understand him a lot better, hoping that by breaking a communication barrier we can live much happier together. I found some really good training videos on bird behaviour on youtube there are 11 videos in total and I found it really enlightening to some of the strange behaviour Diego often gives. Here's the link to the first video which may help

 

All of the searching I have done on parrots it always goes on about the importance of training the bird. I'm finding out though that it's me that seems to be learning from Diego rather than the other way around lol.

Edited July 30, 2010 by GoDiego

[Jayd]

Thank you, wonderful post.... Jayd

[Jayd]

Blue Front Amazon have several colours . Our Amazon ("Amazona Aestiva xanthopteryx"), have the flollowing coulours on their wings: Green (of course), yellow, Dark Blue and Red.

We are also having a behavioral problem with one of our Babies. As soon as I have the time I wil open a Thread here to discuss it ans get your opinion.

Thank you so much, your reply will explain that there are different under wing colors. I should have been clearer, the colors under Tagurit Amazons wings, Her baby looks like it might be a Orange-wing or hybrid...Can't wait for your next post.....Thank you again....Jayd

[Brogers7684]

Hey y'all! Just checking in with everyone! Madison has been doing great! We got him out night before last and put him in the floor and he.climbed in my lap! He started going for the back of my foot and I moved and he hissed. I just told him no and we were fine! He went to the Dr yesterday and She said he kooked good Just needed to lose a little weight but his new diet would fix that! She also said the diet we have on would make his feathers look better in time. Jay his feathers underneath are green blue orange and red.

[Jayd]

This is wonderful news, you don't know how happy I am, I always pray for all you Fids health and well being. Thank you, sometimes it takes a while for the head coloring to come in. Salsa is a Hybrid, her Papa was a Blue-front, and Mama was a Orange-wing. Salsa looks like your baby, if you notice, Pfcarquejo baby's and Diego are front colored. Post more photos when you get them please, I can't read but love to look at photo's!LOL Love-ya Jayd kEEP DOING THIS GREAT JOB YOUR DOING...

[Brogers7684]

OK Jay!! Ill have more pictures Monday and a video of him yelling for Kevin! I can't believe how fast he is saying stuff we say! The kids And I are making toys for him today alsoand I will post pictures of that too!!

[Jayd]

Wonderful..................................

[Jayd]

Hows the "Formerly Known as Madison" now known as " Madden"????

[Luvparrots]

It certainly sounds like Madden is doing great in your home. I know that with some corrections to his diet his his weight will come down and he will be in tip top shape. I look forward to hearing more about Madden and seeing pictures please!

[Jayd]

OK Jay!! Ill have more pictures Monday and a video of him yelling for Kevin! I can't believe how fast he is saying stuff we say! The kids And I are making toys for him today alsoand I will post pictures of that too!!

;):)Can't Wait...:)

[Brogers7684]

we decided to just stick with madison haha didnt want him to get confused ...I am beginning to get curious about madison. i took pictures of the "paper" he came with. It says no band given. and it doesnt say whether he is a boy or girl?!?!? i was just going by what the previous owner said. which she also said he was two and now when i look at this paper i see he is 3. we still love him though:cool:

[pfcarquejo]

Hello,

I cannot see the photos in much detail, but i can see you parrot is beautiful

I Don´t know about legislation there in Spain, but I guess you are also obliged to the CITES convention. It would be better for you to get information from the proper Spanish authorities about how to legalize your bird.

We got, along with our birds, a copy of their parents CITES, a declaration of the breeder with data of the selling, including the band number of each of our parrots and a copy of the identification documents of the breeder. All those documents, and an official form we have to fill, have to be sent to the Portuguese authorities for "wild life" which is called ICNB (Institute for the Conservation of Nature and biodiversity). Then, we have to pay a license for the registration of our parrots and in order to get their own CITES.

Please be informed about the laws there in Spain, because it is very sad to see your parrot taken from you if someone hears him and decides to call the authorities and you don´t have the proper documents.

Edited August 2, 2010 by pfcarquejo

[Brogers7684]

i had no idea!!! i am about to try to look up the breeder with the information that is on that paper!

[Brogers7684]

so i found her number...what all do i need to ask? sorry im all new at this. also i live in the united states.

[pfcarquejo]

You must get information about the law in the country you live in. I was confused with another Thread and i thougth I was 'talking' with someone who lived in Spain.

I am sure our may USA friends will inform you about the law there.

Edited August 2, 2010 by pfcarquejo