Janfromboone Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 I've got a question about a treatment I've been thinking about to help Tobie regrow his flight feathers. He has one wing that the flights have all broken or been chewed off short. They have regrown all year long - molting and then growing new ones - but they are so unsupported and awkward when they grow long they break or he may be chewing them and weakening them. You see they grow in one here and one there or maybe in pairs with gaps. Because his other wing grew a full set of flight feathers, he now crashes and has absolutely no control. I'm so afraid one of his falls is going to break something vital. My question is what about having all of the broken feathers pulled and then would they all grow in together so they would have support and be strong. I think if they would all grow in together he'd leave them alone. Any thoughts would be appreciated. I think I remember Dave007 saying that they don't grow back in just as soon as you pluck them. - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 I am not sure either Jan but Josey is going to a new vet tomorrow to see about her wing feathers on one side, she is chewing them off and I suspect some of the shafts are still attached and irritating her, they may need pulling but I will wait for them to regrow for as long as it takes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbpittman Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Jan, Beau had 22 flight feathers pulled from his right wing where he had totally destroyed all of them. The remaining shafts were irritating his skin underneath causing additional plucking/chewing. I have not seen any new feathers yet - it's only been two weeks - but the AV said that they would grow back better this way than if they were allowed to molt out or cause Beau to pluck them out himself. The balance issues it has created have resulted in a few falls from inside his cage - even though his perches are low and I've got a blanket covering the bottom. He does have a few scratches on his keel that I'm not happy with. The chewing has subsided quite a bit, and he appears to be preening more instead of chewing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janfromboone Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 rbpittman - hope you will keep me posted on the regrowth of those feathers. Tobie is in pretty much the same shape. He has hurt his beak twice and has had two cuts on his chest from awkward falls - usually jumping off my hand or his T-stand in the dining room. I've disassembled his play stand because there is too much furniture for him to crash into around it. Judygram-let me know what your vet sais. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 I sure will Jan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave007 Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 This subject has been brought up a few times. I've already said that the feathers would grow back unevenly. I also said that some new feathers would start getting old by the time more new ones took their place would die. Instead of getting opinions about what happened to others here concerning wing feathers, you need to ask a vet about doing such a drastic thing. You can't go by what others say concerning their problems because you don't know if the problems are or were the same as yours. You have no idea about certain areas where feathers would never grow back. A vet can answer that question. You have no idea about growth because you can't see into the shaft to tell what feather is popping out within a few days and which feathers are gonna take a while to grow out. You have no idea about the evenness of the new growth. You need to see a vet and get a medical opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Janfromboone wrote: Tobie is in pretty much the same shape. He has hurt his beak twice and has had two cuts on his chest from awkward falls - usually jumping off my hand or his T-stand in the dining room. Oh No Jan!! Not dear Tobie. It's painful reading this. We know we love our own Greys. But, we truly love all the Greys we have come to know here on the forum too. I am truly sorry to hear Tobie is having this happen to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollysmum Posted October 28, 2009 Share Posted October 28, 2009 Mali has had this problem with his feathers and he did have an operation to remove all of his chewed feathers and they have grown back but it took a good 6-8 weeks for them to all grow back and even then the vet didn't guarantee that the feathers would come back at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecodweeb Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 This gives me insight on Talula. This could be why she's pulling and chewing on the growth. Looks like I may have to make another visit to the vet.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbpittman Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 We visited Dr. Jose today and the new feathers are just now starting to become visible (2 weeks after being removed). The major point behind new growth coming in is that they be kept low in the cage so that falls or movements will not damage the new feathers causing additional chewing. As Dr. Jose explained it and as Dave would hopefully concur, the new feathers are very soft and are easily damaged with nothing already there to support them. In the case of Beau, I've removed all perches that were above his head if sitting on the floor of his cage. The grate has been lined with several towels and then covered with paper to soften potential falls. The highest perch in his cage is less than 3 inches from the floor of the cage. All of Beau's food and water is kept in crocks that sit on the bottom of the cage. The hardest part of all of this is discouragine climbing up his cage sides, and I may end up having to "block" this off, although with what I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janfromboone Posted October 29, 2009 Author Share Posted October 29, 2009 Yes! I think a trip to the vet is in the works. I just don't want to go back to the vet I saw before. It's not a bad idea though to have some information before going to the vet. Not all vets will have the same opinion or give you the same advice. If a vet wanted to pull Tobie's feathers, and I hadn't heard of that being done successfully before, then I doubt I would go along with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 I just got back from the vet and he didn't pull any of Josey's feathers but two that were broken trying to get her restrained. She has chewed on the feathers on one wing, some with just a short end sticking out but he never said anything about pulling them out. He did suggest we put a collar on Josey to keep her from chewing them so they will regrow enough to where they aren't irritating her any longer, I just don't know if that will work or not, I just hate putting a collar on her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbpittman Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 I believe the only reason Beau had so many feathers pulled was due to the severity of the damage he had done, his age, and in hopes of this not becoming a habit. Mind you this had only been a problem for Beau for just over a month as opposed to months or years of a problem. I did not request this procedure, in fact I thought a collar would be recommended before such a drastic action. Today I questioned the regrowth question and Dr. Jose confirmed, not all of the feathers will grow back at the same time, they won't have the same support as new feathers coming in, in a normal situation, and they are prone to more damage from falls and movement in the cage so additional precautions must be taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janfromboone Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Thanks for the follow ups. Ugh! I'd have a hard time putting a collar on Tobie. I have found another avian vet using your site (on the health forum). A friend who has a macaw goes to her and recommends her. Lets hope when she looks at Tobie's wing she has some reasonable suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovethatgrey Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I feel a bit perplexed. I log on regularly but I really did not know until this week that Tobie and Josey have been chewing their feathers. Did this suddenly occur out of the blue? Or has then been going on for quite a while? I'm saddened by this news and will send you all healthy vibes and positive thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmcq Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 It's good to hear you have found another vet to take a look at Tobie. I am looking forward to hearing what this new vet says regarding our precious Tobie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
judygram Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Yes Adina, this chewing has been going on for quite a while, I just hadn't posted much about it before but at first I just thought she was breaking them and then chewing them off because they were broke but since it has gone on for some time now I realize she is chewing them because they irritate her. She leaves the other side untouched other than preening. Jan, you probably won't find out anything more than you already know as I did but maybe the bloodwork will show something, haven't heard the results yet. I will not be putting a collar on Josey, I have been advised by our resident expert that would be a big mistake and I trust his judgment implicitly. I am going to give her very frequent aloe vera juice baths and put some aloe vera jel on her wing and then play a waiting game, he seems to think she will eventually stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbpittman Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 The aloe gel and juice misting are significant helps with this - apply the gel liberally. It has made a difference in Beau's skin, and I believe has helped stopped some of the feather chewing itself. Dave gives excellent advice and that is what he advised me to do. Thanks again Dr. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janfromboone Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 I've posted quite a bit about Tobie's feather problems but not recently. When Tobie was about 16 months he went into his first molt which was a very heavy molt. Seemed he lost alot of feathers at once. There were so many pin feathers that he began to pick and break off some of them. When the feathers stopped coming in the picking stopped. But when he shed his clipped flights one by one and they came back long he started biting them off - short. Now I don't see him chewing them but he may be chewing when I don't see it. Anyway, he has one wing fully feathered now - an improvement - and the other one is missing all flight feathers past the last joint - also an improvement. He still really can't fly though and the problem with that is that he crash lands and hurts himself doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearllyn Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Some of you may recall I had similar problems with Alfie earlier this year. Judy, what you are describing with Josie sounds just like what happened with Alf. I think she started chewing when some feathers got damaged and just forgot to stop. She removed all of her tail, and all but the two outer primaries on her left wing. In May, she underwent a number of tests under a general anesthetic, which mostly showed no problems - very minor irregularities with the spleen and liver, but nothing that concerned the vet(bloods revealed a slight calcium deficiency) - and while under, they removed all of the chewed feathers. I can't remember how many exactly, dozens tho. Her tail was the easiest to moniter because we could see it plainly, and it grew in evenly. She regained her flight around 6 weeks after the op, and became confident with it very quickly. She was on Metacam for a month aswell to make the regrowth less uncomfortable. Thankfully, she has not chewed since. As has been pointed out, every case is different, but removing her damaged feathers certainly worked for us. Jan, I hope you get Tobie sorted, I love him to bits! xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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