Pairing African Greys

[Leia]

Hi everyone. I would like to know if any1 has advice for me. i have a baby african grey, she is now 16 weeks old. i have all the time in the world to give her attention now, but im worried about what may happen when i start a family or have to travel. She gets alot of attetion and visitors but she only seems to wait for me and gets excited when she see's me. I thought of getting another bird as a companion, found a male thats 19 weeks old and he wanted to feed her, but she seemed to not want him to touch her or sit on the same perch. should i try to give them a few days together? or get another type of bird? or is she better off alone?

[judygram]

Thats nice and good that you have lots of time to spend with your grey now but don't overdo it if you know you will have less time in the future like when a new baby comes. That is a big mistake to spend more time with them than you know you will not be able to keep up in the future, you might want to cut it back some so she doesn't count on it to be happy.

 

That is a personal choice, we have members here who have more than one bird as I do and others who have more than one grey.

 

The main thing is that any bird you get whether it is another grey or another parrot they may not get along. My two, Josey my grey and Sunny my sun conure do not get along but their cages are close to each other and they are company to each other when I am gone but they do not share a perch or playstand. I leave a radio on when I am gone so they have some background noise.

 

Others will be along soon to add their opinions.

[Dave007]

You need a lot more than a couple of days. Maybe weeks. And if you're keeping them in the same cage, that's another no mo if you intend to have both birds as pets. Each one having their own separate cage allows each to develop their own personality to the fullest. One cage only hampers that. They'll eventually become good friends and will be able to be out of their cages playing with each other but the time will come when each has to be put into their own cage which is actually a homethat each bird designs physically and mentally. The so called feeding between a 16 and 19 week grey means nothing. Or yes, she could be ok left alone but it's up to yopu. You can either raise 2 greys or 1 grey and if you've never had a grey before, my opinion is to stay with one grey but you say you may have to travel or start a family. Only the traveling if it's for long periods of time will affect one bird. 2 birds will occupy themselves very well. Do you know if you have a introverted or extroverted bird right now? Lots of things to find out and it takes lots of personal time to do that. Everyone will tell you how unique they are. You can also get another type of bird but living situations will have to be the same. Also, any 2 birds no matter what the species need to be separated because it's impossible to know if they'll get along and only time can answer that question.

[casper]

Only get another bird if thats what you really want!

 

I have three greys, two of them get along so well they are very close but unfortunately I have two that dont get along at all.

 

Out of cage time now is closely supervised or has to be done at seperate times.

 

You can never tell how two greys will get along its a gamble you take.

 

Your baby is very young and will become more independent

as she gets older. Given time she will learn to play more on her own and not be as needy.

 

Give it some more thought and do whats right for you:)

[Tango]

judygram wrote:

That is a big mistake to spend more time with them than you know you will not be able to keep up in the future, you might want to cut it back some so she doesn't count on it to be happy.

 

I could not disagree more. My wife and I have varying schedules. Sometimes we're home a lot, sometimes we're not. Reducing the attention our birds get to the lowest common denominator is completely out of the question. When we're home, they get to spend 8+ hours a day out of the cage. When we're busy, it's dropped to 4 hours.

 

There's no way I'm not going to spend those extra 4 hours with my little ones because I might be gone the next week, that's ridiculous. They're healthy, happy, well adjusted, BECAUSE we spend those extra hours with them.

 

Worst advice ever. It's like saying: "I'll not spend the extra time I have throwing a ball with my boy because next week I have to be out of town." Obviously not a good plan.

 

No hugs for you because I might not be able to give you any tomorrow. Really?

 

Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/02 21:52<br><br>Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/02 22:00

[Leia]

thanks for your advice everyone. it helped, but i think i may have to think about it for a while longer. my grey usually gets along with most of the other greys she's seen, she usually kisses them to greet. but surprisingly she did not get along with the male i thought of pairing her with. she seems to be an outgoing confident bird but does not like any1 except me to touch her.

[rbpittman]

Having no intention of getting a companion for Dixie (Grey), I ended up with Sterling (U2) when his former owner passed and the options were unspeakable. I didn't intend for them to be friends, I hoped they would tolerate each other. After 3 weeks in the same room - separate cages, separate perches - I had to move Sterling to the living room out of my office.

 

Sterling was walking on the floor, Dixie on her porch. Dixie flew down to the ground and the scuffle started. Dixie leading the charge. I separated both birds before they actually made contact (I was already up and moving when Dixie left her porch), but the fear was there. Sterling could easily kill Dixie with his beak and Dixie I'm sure would do major damage on her own.

 

Dixie is a much happier bird now that Sterling is not "invading her space" and Sterling gets the company of my 13 year old son for most of the day. Even though we had done the "first bird gets everything first" routine, Dixie was obviously not going to have any of it in "her" house.

 

Not trying to make a decision for you, just think long and hard about adding to your flock for the reasons you listed.

 

--

Robin

[danmcq]

Leia wrote:

but im worried about what may happen when i start a family or have to travel... or get another type of bird? or is she better off alone?

 

Many younger people starting a family it seems can not handle the time they need to spend with their new baby in the early years AND spend the time necessary with their Grey to keep it happy. If your thinking these things now, two Greys would certainly not be a good idea in my opinion unless your planning on them potentially becoming a pair. This of course, would not really occur, if at all until they were 5+ years old.

 

Greys only flock together in the wild and seem to be that way for the most part in our human homes with other species of Parrots. Conures and Macaws for example flock with other birds in the wild and more readily tolerate and accept other bird species. But, for the most part, getting another species bird as a buddy for your Grey is not a good idea.

[Dave007]

Tango

 

"""""""Worst advice ever. It's like saying: "I'll not spend the extra time I have throwing a ball with my boy because next week I have to be out of town." Obviously not a good plan.

 

I'm sure that Judy was not trying to give the worst advice ever.

 

All birds are in very dividual households and those birds are very adaptable to different ways of doing things. You have your method which may be good for you. Judy has her method which may be good for her. You have feelings about methods as well as everyone else who is experienced with greys and other parrots. Either method may work for different people. As a matter of fact there's even more methods than what was mentioned. Her opinion wasn't aimed at you. She was trying to help. I may totally differ with the way you do things but my advice would be totally different and would not be the worst advice given.<br><br>Post edited by: Dave007, at: 2009/08/03 00:42

[lovethatgrey]

First and foremost, it is important to know that if you get another parrot that you do it for yourself and for YOU alone.

 

As already mentioned, there are no guarantees that your 2 parrots will get along. If they don't get along it won't matter because you purchased the parrot for yourself anyways. In my case, I had a pionus parrot before my african grey. My pionus parrot is a very independent and low maintenance parrot. In fact she makes being a parrot owner a very EASY experience.

My african grey came along and has given me SO much more WORK to do but it does not matter because I love her and I knew that this is what it would take if I wanted to do it right. My parrots accept and tolerate each other but nothing more than that and I am completely fine with it. My pionus parrot is a sweet as can be and my african grey is well socialized, a prolific talker, extroverted, and very entertaining.

 

The other thing that you might want to keep in mind is that your existing parrot's personality will change considerably and will not be what you know it to be today. My experience is that my african grey was alot less demanding at 16 weeks old than she is today at 17 months old. The way you behave with her right now will set the tone for what she will expect and anticipate from you in the future. This would be through no fault of her own.

 

I suggest that you take a step back and enjoy your time with her. Having another african grey will only double your responsibilities and any concerns that you may already have.<br><br>Post edited by: lovethatgrey, at: 2009/08/03 01:42

[judygram]

Tango

 

No one here has ever accused me of giving the "worst advice ever" and as I have been here for over two years and with lots of posts to my name I do take offense to what you wrote. I try to give good advice all the time and most of it is from personal experience, I might not be the smartest cookie in the pack but I feel I know what I am talking about.

 

So maybe what I said was true and maybe what you said for your situation is true, does that make either of us wrong because we differ? I think not.

[Tango]

Dave007 wrote:

Tango

 

"""""""Worst advice ever. It's like saying: "I'll not spend the extra time I have throwing a ball with my boy because next week I have to be out of town." Obviously not a good plan.

 

I'm sure that Judy was not trying to give the worst advice ever.

 

 

You're right. It's probably not the worst advice ever. That would involve tons of things beyond the current discussion.

 

However: telling someone they should dial down the time they spend with their birds to the minimum amount because they can't spend that amount of time with them all the time is ignorant, harmful and VERY bad advice.

 

The fact thatyou've posted here for two years and I've posted here for two weeks doesn't make any difference. Why would you advocate spending less time with your fids?? For any reason?

 

This has nothing to do with "my way or your way" or "what works for you" etc.

It's not about us, it's about them.

 

Telling someone to spend less time with their companion because it's not the norm is ridiculous. That's not a matter of opinion.

Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/03 03:22<br><br>Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/03 03:24

[judygram]

""""Telling someone to spend less time with their companion because it's not the norm is ridiculous. That's not a matter of opinion.""""

 

That IS your opinion and what I said is not ridiculous, we all have varying amounts of time we can spend with our fids and what works for one may not work for others but to me it makes sense that if you know you can't spend 4 hours a day every day then don't, if a parrot gets used to having 5 or 6 hours a day then a new baby or something comes along and that time is cut to half that then the parrot suffers.

[Tango]

judygram wrote:

""""Telling someone to spend less time with their companion because it's not the norm is ridiculous. That's not a matter of opinion.""""

 

That IS your opinion and what I said is not ridiculous, we all have varying amounts of time we can spend with our fids and what works for one may not work for others but to me it makes sense that if you know you can't spend 4 hours a day every day then don't, if a parrot gets used to having 5 or 6 hours a day then a new baby or something comes along and that time is cut to half that then the parrot suffers.

 

Apparently you don't understand how silly that argument is: reduce the amount of time you spend with the companion you love to the lowest common denominator because tomorrow you might not be able to spend that amount of time.

 

Really? Are you seriously going to hold that ground?

 

I'm glad I'm not your bird. Or child.

 

wow.

 

Bottom line: if you can't give your fid 4-5 hours a day then you should rehome him/her because you're neglecting him/her. That's not debatable. It's not a matter of opinion.

 

I've seen too many abused birds over the years owned by ignorant, neglectful, selfish people.

 

Bird comes first. Screw your schedule, your work hours, everything else. If you can't accept that, rehome your bird. It's like having a child.<br><br>Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/03 03:57

[judygram]

You dang skippy I am and I don't care if it sounds silly to you as it makes sense to me, I spend the amount of time I have with my fids and if you spend more with yours then good for you or better for your birds.

 

And for your information I am glad I am not your mother either.

[Tango]

judygram wrote:

You dang skippy I am and I don't care if it sounds silly to you as it makes sense to me, I spend the amount of time I have with my fids and if you spend more with yours then good for you or better for your birds.

 

And for your information I am glad I am not your mother either.

 

I have no idea what you just said.

 

EDIT:

 

Unless "you dang skippy" means you advocate spending the minimum time with your birds. Or that you need to retake that english class.

 

In either case, you're apparently a fan of neglecting your birds, which makes you... um... wow I can't think of a word that doesn't include profanity.<br><br>Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/03 04:09

[judygram]

""""Bird comes first. Screw your schedule, your work hours, everything else. If you can't accept that, rehome your bird. It's like having a child.""""

 

I love my birds but they are not the number one in my household, I feel sorry for the other members of your family if this is the way you feel.

[Tango]

You're sorry that I feel my birds come first? Are you really thinking about what you post?

 

Edit: let me drop this sesame street style for you:

 

I have a wife, couple dogs, 4 fids.

 

The most vulnerable creatures in the house, those most sensitive, those most unlikely to understand the human world... THEY get the most protection. The most deference.

 

I took the responsibility to accept them as a companion, and I'm absolutley responsible for them.

 

For you to imply that people should reduce the time they spend with these wonderful creatures TODAY because TOMORROW they might work late is *#&$* IGNORANT!<br><br>Post edited by: Tango, at: 2009/08/03 04:20

[judygram]

Yes I am but it looks like I am up against a brick wall, lets just agree to disagree, you have your opinion and I have mine and I don't care to argue with you about it.

[Tango]

judygram wrote:

Yes I am but it looks like I am up against a brick wall, lets just agree to disagree, you have your opinion and I have mine and I don't care to argue with you about it.

 

I have no problem with that. As long as you don't post here advising people to spend less time with their comapnions.

[judygram]

I will post what I want to post and that may include advising people to spend less time with their birds if that fits the situation.

[Tango]

judygram wrote:

I will post what I want to post and that may include advising people to spend less time with their birds if that fits the situation.

 

You have the freedom to post the worst advice ever. I have the freedom to call you on it.

 

Glad we can agree.

[Talon]

I have some days that I am gone all day and my 2 birds are in their cages all day. And other days when they are out of their cages all day when I am home. It's different every week. They are just as happy and easy going about either one. B) ;)

[danmcq]

Talon wrote:

I have some days that I am gone all day and my 2 birds are in their cages all day. And other days when they are out of their cages all day when I am home. It's different every week. They are just as happy and easy going about either one. B) ;)

 

It's exactly the same in our household as well Penny.

 

If we're home, the birds are out of their cages from Sun up to Sundown. Barring of course if we need to leave for all the various reasons that might come up during the day.

 

I suppose the key is, if you start this type of expectation from the beginning with all your critters. They know things can change daily and do not expect a routine to stay exactly the same every day of their life.

 

I do know though, that all the books and scholars do agree that there must be some kind of baseline routine and schedule that is maintained for the parrots and the household. So everyone has a good idea of what to normally expect in the flocks and packs of the home.

 

Example: The "Norm" in this house for feeding the Dobermans is 5am and 4pm. If we do not feed them by say 415, the Dobermans become restless and nudge us, Dayo (CAG) will start saying "Let's feed the dogs", then whistle for them and call Chloe and Bentley both to come and eat.

 

This example clearly illustrates all critters know schedules, what time it is and what normally happens at that time. It is the same in the wild with flocks of birds and packs of Dogs. They raise at a certain time (Normally before sun up) and start rallying together and preparing to take their trip together for food and water. It is a basic instinct in all of creation, time and schedules for everything under the sun.

 

I believe this is what Judy is pointing out. I am not trying to speak for her, but it is promulgated throughout many books written on Parrots and other Critters.

 

We all read and hear information and apply it as we translate all that data into our environment and lifestyle. It is rare that any two individuals will read the same book or hear the same comments and apply it identically.

 

The same is true in this thread and the comments made by all of us. Consume them like a Watermelon and spit out the seeds you dislike.<br><br>Post edited by: danmcq, at: 2009/08/03 15:52

[Leia]

to be honest i see both of your points, and i agree with you both on certain aspects of your points. i dont think that judy meant to say i must not spend time with my grey, i think she meant that i must not get my bird into a routine where i spend most of my time with her and suddenly change when something else happens in my life and i havent got much time anymore. She meant that this could cause my cag to get depressed, which is something i am aware of. i think she said it very light heartedly.

 

on the other end, i have a very soft spot for my cag, and well, i do feel guilty when i do have free time and dont spend it with her, so i understand totally where tango is coming from. i do agree its best to have variations with the amount of time you spend with your cag from day to day so that they dont too stuck into routine, but still be very affectionate and loving because they need this. and to be honest i have every intention of doing that. i hear your point tango, and we both have a very soft spot for cags, and pets in general because they are so dependent on us. but maybe you shouldnt be so hard on judy, i think all she meant was that i should give my cag a litle time to learn to enjoy her own company and not become too dependent on me as it may be hard on her if i have to go away or change my schedual. i really dont think she meant it as harshly as to say i must not spent any time with my grey any more.