KinNJ

Check out this page: http://amazonaonline.com/TAS/modules/article/view.article.php?c9/6 Highly informative, and appears at least as reliable as other pages I've found online.

ok, pic was too big, trying again:

sure, I'd be happy to come back and post to the "Other birds" forum and, due to popular demand, here's a pic (that is, if I do this right): they said he'll be ready to go home in probably a week and a half, we can't wait, and already have a bunch of toys, day cage, sleeper/travel cage with cover, food, full spectrum light, and cage liners waiting, and a bottlebrush play gym on order!

Update! Deposit has been paid, and 2 weeks to go until weaning is complete. And as it turns out, the humans didn't pick the bird, the bird picked the humans. :laugh: Wasn't a Grey or a Greenwing, but a Panama Amazon. We went to an exotic bird store, one with lots of babies about to be weaned, so we could ask questions and check out availability. After washing up, we were allowed to handle some of the older babies. One was very shaky, one flew away (twice!), and during it all my wife noticed another one that kept watching us the whole time. She asked to see him/her, and that was the end of us! He/she ruffled his/her head feathers when we scratched, stood on one foot, displayed wing feathers to us (thought this was a territorial sign, but it was accompanied by snuggling and playing, not biting or aggression), did lots of pinning, kept up a steady stream of cute little baby chirps, and even hung upside-down from a toy I showed him/her! The kicker was when I went to pay for a book on amazons, and the little fella grabbed my credit card, then jumped down on the keypad of the card swipe machine! So, now it's time to start buying stuff. Tomorrow we'll go back with our camera to take pictures, then make the 2-hour trip south to check out a huge 15,000 sq ft bird store we've heard about in Burlington to pick out a cage and some toys. We're both very excited, and a little shell-shocked! Sadly, it looks like maybe this isn't going to be the right forum for us after all , but again thank you so much for the help! Anybody know a good forum for Amazons?

Tari and everyone, thanks so much for the super helpful answers. I'm still favoring the grey, but the more research my wife does the more intimidated she gets, and I wouldn't want to start out from a position of tension/fear, just not healthy...so maybe Celery is right, we should expand the consideration set to some of the other species like the vasa. I'll be sure to keep everyone posted about what we decide, and thanks again for the answers!

Hello. Great forum. Sorry the following is so long, but I want to make sure our situation is clear so we can get the best possible advice. My wife and I are also considering getting a parrot. After tons of research (websites, forums, books, and a store visit), we have narrowed down the consideration set to two very different birds, either an African Grey or a Greenwing Macaw. In the Grey, we like the intelligence, more manageable size, great speaking ability, and relative quietness. I'm also a structured, analytical person, and find the Grey more "gut" appealing. The biggest concern is that it would end up very antisocial to visitors or even to one of us, no matter how disciplined and consistent the training and socialization. We really do not want a terror who gets territorial aggression or fear aggression when family and friends come to visit, or who decides he/she wants me or my wife to "drop dead." In the Greenwing, we like the striking appearance and gentle disposition, macaw playfulness, and that it is less prone to screech attacks than other macaws. The drawbacks are comparative speaking ability and large size. We are married, in our late 20's. No kids, but that could change in a year or 2. One cat, with claws, but is very calm and social (breed is exotic shorthair, which has gentle, doglike personality). House is condo end-unit, with decent but not perfect sound isolation from neighbors (we do hear loud yelling, but not TV or music)...also cage would be 1 room away from separator wall. Cannot make external changes, so so an outdoor aviary is impossible. My wife is currently at home most of the day, but that is subject to change. I'm gone daily from around 7-ish to around 6:30 or 7. No priceless heirlooms, but do have a few pieces of custom artwork on the walls. Might be moving in the next 12 to 24 months. Twice a month, maids come and make a lot of noise (we would prohibit use of dangerous chemicals). Occasionally I'm gone at night for work-related travel. Once a year, there might be out-of-country travel where the parrot can't come along. Cost is not a primary concern. From our research, we know the issues and sacrifices, but find disagreement over whether major problems (biting, pooping everywhere, being territorial, bonding to one person to the exclusion of all others, etc) can be addressed through proper socialization, training, and care. So we need the benefit of your experience! Also advice to guide us on picking the best species to match to us, and matching ourselves best to the species we end up picking. So, onto the questions: (1) Is a Grey appropriate to our circumstances? (2) My wife has fairly bad seasonal allergies but no problems with mammals (except me occasionally )... What's the best way to find out if she is allergic to a Grey's feather dust? (3) Is there a *large* risk that, no matter how we train and socialize the bird, it will end up bonding to one of us to the *total* exclusion of the other? (4) If the best we can hope for is tight bonding to one person and mere civility with the other, is there a way to control or guide who gets the bond (i.e. stick to one gender, have one person take the lead in training, etc)? (5) Are we going to run into big bird-related problems when our first (human) baby comes? (6) Are Greys more at risk than other parrots of psychological stress and trauma from being housed with a vet or other professional sitter during vacations abroad? (For domestic trips, we can drive instead of flying) (7) For the cage, is the best approach to get a small 20x20 baby cage for the first year, then a larger 36x24 (or bigger) adult cage and make the baby cage a sleeping/travel cage? (8) Do you think that, based on everything, a Macaw is more appropriate for us than a Grey, or vice-versa? (9) Other than size, occasional bouts of loud noise, and lesser speaking ability, is there something I'm missing that argues against a Greenwing and favors a Grey for people like us? (10) Is it true that Greys tend to "switch allegiance" from one person (parent-bond) to a different person (mate-bond) around sexual maturity? (11) Is there a reason to favor male over female, or female over male (and is it even safe and quick enough to get a baby DNA'd in time)? (12) In babies, what are the most important things to look for? Sorry again for the long post and many question... Thanks so much for any advice!