Christina

Very interesting points Dave. Although, I respectfully disagree on many. I think you have an obligation to keep your children safe and just accepting that your bird doesn't like others is not an option. I wasn't suggesting to swat the bird with the towel, just hold the towel up in front of you so they can't land on you. Have your tried it or do you just say no these are the things I've tried and only they work? I think an open mind, with safety being the most important and positive training is a great thing. I was not suggesting anything mentally or physically negative. Clicker training is used for all birds, look it up. Your opinion on a cage is interesting and has some validity to it. HOwever, the point of a forum I thought was to gather positive and safe ideas to have a handful of ways to help with your parrot, not to trash someone else's post.

Hi, you got some great advice. What is your cage situation? Is it in another room? Is it possible to have a small cage in the kitchen to use as a "time out" cage? When she does something naughty put her in the time out cage and everyone turn their back on her for just a few seconds or a minute...only a short bit, it will be enough. the best solution is to not let it happen. I would suggest not having your daughter or husand be viable landing zones for her. Meaning, arm them with a small hand towel, when you hear flapping, towel up, my grey will not land on a towel (they are very intelligent and it won't take long for her to not land on them). Although, that being said they are opportunistic and will wait for them to be "unarmed" so to speak, so you hear flapping and no towel, duck, don't make it easy for her land on them. Then clicker training and treats only given by your family members...whatever your greys favorite treat is, only they can give them to her. Have your daughter work on training her. It builds a bond, not like you and she have, but a different one. I think this is one of the most difficult situations because you can not have any animal biting your children. It is just completely unsatisfactory. I will say though, that clipping a grey is not always the solution. I recently posted about having a very hard time with an attacking caique (she was rehomed). I did choose to do a light clip on her, but those parrots are very cocky and sure of themselves and will attack continusouly and very aggressively (I will let her flight feathers come back and we will continue to work with her to get her fully flighted without attacking, that is our ulimate goal). My experience with greys, are they more sneaky and act like all is well and then CHOMP they give a good hard bite, or they do a fly by and keep flying to a high spot that you can't get them. I feel like greys also need flight becuase it does give them more confidence and makes them less fearful (I won't go into the safety aspects, I think Dan hit on them). I hope you give redirection and training some time before you try clipping.

Thank you everyone for your advice. I did join a parrot psychology group on yahoo and found someone who actually has experienced this with a caique. The only way to explain a caique is to tell you guys she is the bull shark of the avian world. A flighted can opener. Relentless in her pursuit of blood. This isn't a fly by, bite, and keep going so you don't get hurt. She flies, bites and grinds her beak so you will actually have to shake her off of you. I know what you mean Dave about a few blocks and most birds will back off, but a caique will come back again and again, and whatever they can latch onto they will, be it a hand, and ear, nose, neck back, butt, doesn't matter they will get it and bite! At any rate, here is what we did...a light clip to her wings. She can still go 8-10 feet before lightly coming to land on the floor. I adore my birds being flighted, but not at the expense of major blood letting. Her cage was moved to the main part of the house with intentions of her being my husband's constant companion, the treats from only him were also added. I don't believe (as she is only two) that hormones are a big factor here, but she is in a heavy molt, so that might be contributing to her ferocity. At any rate, she is a smart bird and after launching herself at him twice and not making it to him (because she can still get pretty far, he has to be on his toes and not get too close or he will be in target range)she stopped flying at him and and just postured for him. Anyone interested in what an angry caique looks like, they puff up and dilate their eyes so the main part of their eye is bright red, so she looks very demonic, if she is on top of her cage or on her stand she high steps like a nazi and paces back and forth...it is a sight to behold. Unfortunelty, she then starts to whistle the Andy Griffith theme song, which cracks us up! It's hard to take her seriously when she is whisteling that tune! I'm trying to teach her Darth Vadar's introduction, as I think that is more the song that she is looking for! :-) At any rate, she did take some food from my husband's hand and eventually ignored his presence (after he sat next to her cage for a few hours). I think we have a long road, but with everyone's good advice, and a lot of patience, I'm hopeful for a harmonious atmosphere in house once again. Thanks for your suggestions, I know this was a hard one becuase it is not a grey and most of our experience is with our greys. Although, aside from the basic differences in personalities of the different species, I think the positive reinforcement and patience goes a long way with any parrot, so that is the road we are taking. Thanks again.

Okay, I realize this is should probably be in the "Other Birds" forum but because this issue is escalating, I hope the mods will leave it here so it gets the most views and hopefully responses. As you can tell this isn't about a grey (I have my fabulous grey, but she is well behaved). My problem is with my caique, a recent rescue, I think we have had her for about 4 months. She is fully flighted as are our two birds. She is two years old and her background is that she was in a cage for at least the last year, possibly longer with little to no interaction with anyone other than passing by her cage and maybe speaking to her. When she got here, she couldn't fly (she had her full flights but did not know how to fly). She now flies very well and joins in with the other parrots in some flying activity. Although she seems to have assimilated well, she seems to have a nervous tick, where she will bite herself if she is uncomfortable. I think it's more show than anything. We just try to stop what we are doing when she does this and let her get her bearings and then move on to something else. She has always loved my son, she likes me very well and tolerates my husband. Okay, now for the real issue. She has suddenly decided that she hates my husband will attack him as soon as she sees him. Not just a "fly by", but an actual I'm going to bite the crap out of you and make you bleed or take a hunk out of you like a shark. If anyone has ever seen a little caique in full battle mode, then you know they are a force to be reckoned with. We have tried, just ignoring the behavior (this does not work when she keeps attacking), putting her in her cage about a million times, as soon as she comes back out she goes right back for him (we could probably try this for longer, but she eventually gets through the defenses of everyone and you can only bleed so much before you loose patience), and having him assert himself by posturing as a bigger presence than her (this doesn't work by the way, she could actually care less and found it to be more of a challenge and would attack with even more vengence). I realize that clipping her wings is an option. I would prefer not to if I can avoid it as she becomes more aggresive with the other two birds when she is left with no "flight" option. At this point, I'm just thinking a clip might be in order so she can collect her bearings on her new flock. I find it interesting though that she was fine with him previously, he was never her favorite, but she would sit with him and play and fly to him to get a scratch and overnight just decided that not only did she not like him, but that he must be destroyed at all costs. I've also considered a cage move to the main area of the house and have him and her constantly be together...he works mainly from home so, he could cart her with him in her cage everywhere he goes, so they are constant companions. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Sorry this is so long, but I felt like I could get better responses if you had all the facts and backgroung. Thanks!

There is some website out there that Pirate parrot or something, the guy who free flys his birds in fairs and stuff. If you read some of his articles on free flying, I believe he says that greys are one of the worst canidates for free flying as they startle very easily. I can see where that has a lot of truth to it for most greys (obviously not all). And given my situation with a macaw and a grey, my macaw will come every time I call him, my grey often looks at me like keep dreaming! She seems to beleive she is quite above the demeaning training BS that the macaw seems to love.

Awesome video! Greys are pretty quick too aren't they?

That is funny! Jane08 my b&g buzzes us all the time, I'm waiting for his feet to get tangled in my hair one time and then he will come to an abrupt halt! They are soo funny! We have our blue and gold, my TAG and we purchased a caique a few months ago. All can fly. Now you want to talk about crazy, when all three get going just for the joy of flying, it is insane in our house. I will say though, that they will leave the room we are in, but only for a short period of time, they much prefer to be with the whole family. It sure is fun to watch them fly though. Finnigan, my tag, likes to screech at the top of her lungs while flying for fun, it sounds like she is very frightened, but she isn't...the other day, the caique joined in the flying fray and started screeching...I was LMAO!!!

Keep in mind, you can never be a "paranoid weight watcher". That is how you can tell if they are sick. I weight all my birds at least once month, I try for two so I know what their average weight should be. It fluctuates but overall, I know if there is something wrong before they start showing it. A good scale is a necessary investment IMHO. Oh, and strangley enough, almost all (3) my birds are small framed. But they all have big personalities!:laugh:

Although I'm sorry that Dave is tired of talking about this subject, I love to talk about it. Instead of telling you my experiences, I would suggest that before you make a decision, you check out this article from Hartman Aviary http://theparrotuniversity.com/flight.php It really goes into the genetic make up of all parrots and how flying is a fundamental part of a bird. It is, in my humble opinion, a scientific powerhouse punch to the necessity of allowing our birds flight. I realize it is an individual decision and I respect that, I certainly wouldn't want someone telling me what to do, but before making a choice, know what you are deciding. Good luck.

Satchel, I'm sorry if anyone in that macaw forum offended you. I thought some of their posts were abrasive and very negative. Unfortunetly, the most "senior" members there seem to have adopted a "holier-than-thou" attitude making the less experienced macaw owners more reluctant to post their thoughts and views. I did see some encouraging words of advice and cheers, but wanted to apoligize if Don and Sandy put you off. I think it's great that you are keeping Tiko and are taking time to learn his body language and moods and all. You will be as fine a macaw owner as you are a grey owner. Don't give up.

If I was you, I would pay attention to when he is doing this and take some time to learn his body language. He may be biting when he is tired, or when your grey is with you, to try to get you to put that other bird down. He may have also brought a few issues with him from the pet store. At this point it's your job to figure out what he is saying to you and make those adjustments and/or show him the proper manners for your flock. I will say this Satchel, macaws are not secretive, if you watch his body language you will know exactly what he is thinking. My TAG will act like she loves you to death and when you move in for a kiss or a scratch, she will nail you. My B&G, I can look at him and know darn well, he doesn't want me to come within 2 feet of him. I think when we bring a new family member home we are pretty excited, and then everyone is in the "honeymoon" period, once that is over, it is a matter of learning everyone's moods and attitudes and meshing them altogether so there is an even flow. I might also suggest go to this web site: http://www.birdsnway.com/boards/mt/mt.cgi they are very informative and will have tons of advice and lots of sympathy, as most are multiple bird owners and have been through this process. good luck, don't give up and just take your time with him. It will work out.

Great looking B&G! A few things I know about B&G's. First, they are senstive to the dust that cockatoos and grey's give off, that is why a seperate room is often recommended. I do keep my B&G and TAG together, they both take baths very often and have a very good air filter in the room. That is a personal choice. B&G's have one of the most laid back personalities of any macaw. They are very awesome birds. If I ever got another one, I would name it Blueberry! We spend a lot of time calling our b&g, Blue Bird, Big Blue, and things like that. I dunno, maybe we are weird with out nicknames. :-) We recently added a white bellied caique to our flock. One thing I have done with Finnigan to try to keep jealousy issues at bay, is if I see her "eyeballing" Jeckyl (WBC), I make a point to spend one on one time with her that day. we may just spend 20 minutes on the bed playing or put the others to bed early and keep her up for a little while longer, with no other birds, all my attention is focused on her. This seems to be what she needs and she stops giving the new bird the "evil eye". As far as wing clipping, I think some very good points have been brought up, but to show the other side of the coin, the new addition to our flock can not fly (she has the wings but not the know how) and the others expect her to move her bum when they come to where she is. Because she can not fly yet, she stands her ground and feels it necessary to defend it because she can't get away. Between the fear of an unknown place and unknown birds, and not being able to flee, it has made her more aggresive, in my opinion. I see the points of clipping a new bird, but then I also see the points of not clipping a new bird. Again, it's a personal choice that you will have to make knowing your flock/family and what would benefit your household and birds the best. At any rate, there is my two cents...congratulations...I do love b&g's. They rock!

10 Things about Finnigan (TAG) 1. She loves a good scratch. 2. She loves the family to all be together in one room. 3. Her favorite foods are cantalope and watermelon. 4. Her favorite toys are foraging toys. 5. She loves to give kisses, putting her beak to your lips making a kissing noise. 6. She loves to have lip moisturizer rubbed into her beak, but you have to tell her beautiful her beak is after she lets you rub it. 7. When she is very energetic, she flies in circles as fast as she can screetching like a wild banshee. 8. Her favorite way to spend the morning is to sit outside on the lanai watching the wild birds going from place to place. 9. She does not like to put her harness on. 10. Her favorite way to bathe is to get into a palm tree or a plant when it's raining and flap around until she is soaked.<br><br>Post edited by: Christina, at: 2009/09/15 21:48

I'm just going to ask...can Yoshi hear? Does she respond to sounds at all? If so, then, I would say everyone else is right on. My vet said to me when I took Finnigan in right after I got her, "well, she can hear, AG's are prone to deafness". I had never heard that before and have never seen anything on it really, but have no real reason to doubt what she said. Anyway, if she responds to sounds, then she is just calm, if not, I might check with the vet. An intersting read from this site about a deaf grey, but it seems like a fluke more than a normal happening. http://africanqueenaviaries.com/deafnessblindness.htm

You can actually take Monk to Europe with you (I didn't check, I'm assuming you are American). You will have some hoops to jump through and it will be expensive, but you can take him and bring him back. My husband was offered a position over there and we have a strict "no man/bird left behind" policy. So, I did a lot of research into it. We decided not to accept the offer though (not because of the birds). If that isn't something that is financially viable or you are not comfortable putting Monk through those hoops for a month abroad (it would be stressful on a bird) then I would look into a friend or family member keeping him for that time. If you can't do that, a lot of rescues or bird sanctuaries have long term boarding and those will often take pictures and keep you updated via e-mail. A vet would be my very last choice as they have a lot of sick birds coming and going. I'm sure that Monk will remember you and love you. I think those options would be fine for Monk she will be no worse for the wear. You always hear how things should remain the same for greys, but they are very adaptable birds. She will be fine.