PhillyT

Thank you everyone. We brought her home last night. We'd been to see her a few times at the breeder's and i was petting her and she stepped up onto me with no problems at the breeders so all was good! She's beautiful. The travel cage we ordered hadn't turned up so I had to create a make-shift cage with a cardboard box! [ATTACH=CONFIG]25475[/ATTACH] The journey home was about a hour and a half, she was very quiet and didn't really move much, just observed and checked us out really. Name wise, we decided on Raphael (after the ninja turtle & because of the red tail) as we wanted something fairly unique. Here's one from inside the car [ATTACH=CONFIG]25476[/ATTACH] It was nice to see her feeling comfortable enough to be falling asleep though, even during the somewhat bumpy ride... [ATTACH=CONFIG]25477[/ATTACH] We had quite a long first night trying to get her of out the box though!... I slowly ripped and then pulled down the 'bar's of the front of the box, to 'open up' the 'cage' for her, after a hour or so of feeding bits of apple and trying to coax her out, she eventually came to the edge, but then flew out over my hand around and up on top of her new cage!! lol. I tried to get her to step up on my hand, so she flew on top of the TV, then back to the cage... you get the idea. This went on for about 5-7 minutes before she half (soft) crash landed between two pieces of furniture i picked her up, from underneath, supporting her weight by the belly and had one foot held down with my two fore fingers and thumb. She tried flying toward the cage again but because I had a hold of her I held her back onto a soft cushion by me on the sofa, she tried again, and i did the same, this time proceeding to stroke her head, neck and back. Whilst every second felt like an eternity it also felt like we were both calming down (from adrenaline not any bad atmospheres!) by huge amounts. 10 seconds later and she was content and happy being scratched and started almost falling asleep in my lap. After about 10 mins of this, now that we were both calm, I put her in her cage That first few moments though was so intense! I had my hand under her belly/chest (holding her feet) and my other on top, and could feel her heart beating - though not quite as fast as mine i dont think!! Today, she has been quiet, gave her some warm softened pellet 'soup' this morning. She is yawning an AWFUL lot though. Is it normal for her to be so tired? I tried all ways to get her out of the cage today but she wouldnt have it. I am able to touch her feet, stroke her back, scratch her neck and sometimes she'll stand on me, but looks to hop/fly off as soon as she realises its me shes on! But what's weird is, every time i go back to do any of the above, its like starting again. Very slow, gradual approach, over 5-10 minutes. She chirps a little when (i assume) is excited, and feel like sometimes she wants to step up or come out but is holding back, so i try not to force it. I'm just concerned the longer she goes 'in' the cage without spending time out or on me, the harder it'll get? She was sooo loving and easy to deal with at the breeders, which im guessing is because she was fully comfortable in her 'home'? So may is still adjusting. She's eating well, ive been moving and adjusting perches around inside her cage for a bit today and she doesnt mind my hands wandering in there or anything, so I guess thats good. She stretches her wing (with one leg) a lot, what does this mean? Just a stretch? ..and a few times has wagged her tail after shaking her head vigerously. I just hope we can get the contact back sooner rather than later but don't know if im expecting too much too soon? I want to clicker/target train her and eventually get a harness on (which arrived this morning) but it all seems quite far away if i cant get her out the cage. Still watching to figure out what her fav foods are too for 'treats'. She doesnt seem to go nuts for 'seeds' yet, sunflower, hazel, wal, almond or anything. Fresh Apple chunks I think are the thing atm. So aaaaaaaanny advice and thoughts and opinions you can share I would be GREATLY appreciative for!!! I think my girlfriend took some video last night of trying to entice her out the box, so i'll try and post some of that later if you'd like to see? Thanks again, ~ Phil

Thanks Jeff! I went with a 1:3 vinegar/water solution, rubbed and wiped down with that, rinsed, dried and then misted the entire thing with bird disinfectant from a local store. smelled nice, but ive wiped all that off now too and its dry. Getting muh birdie later this evening *excites*

Hi everyone, Some of you may (or may not) remember that I posted a thread a short while back about putting a deposit down and which sex bird to pick for our new baby grey. Fast forward a few weeks and we've been to visit the breeder and see the babies several times and have found the female of the two more settled and happy with us and she is ready to collect tomorrow! *so excited* I also picked up our cage today too, which is an ex-display unit and was pre-built. It has been sitting in the pet shop for at least 4 weeks, if not more (before I found it) and does look dusty. So my question is, how do you suggest I go about cleaning it? :confused: After much research online, hot water, lemon juice, white vinegar and possibly some baking soda seem to be the suggestions of the majority, if not a 1/10 bleach/water solution to disinfect. My problem is though; the cage won't fit in our bath tub to 'shower' it with hot water. I have no hose for blasting outside, though this would be cold, and I just want to make sure a thorough job is done before the new perches/toys are put in. An additional question is, should I be washing/disinfecting the toys/perches too, before they go into the cage? Food bowls I have had through the dishwasher already, so they're good to go, but its the cage im worried about getting really clean.

Did you choose to have a female Sterling? How did you decide? There are 2 birds at 7-8 weeks old, so obviously a choice of 2, but he also has another clutch of 4 or 5 who are only 3-4 weeks old... more choice, but surely even less likely to know what they're doing to be able to 'pick' out their human, no?

Hi, So we're about to put down a deposit on a baby Grey after almost 12 months of consideration reading and research! I have (eventually) found a breeder we are happy with, who is local to us and who will not let us have the grey before 12-13 weeks old (others had wanted us to finish of weaning from 8 and 9 weeks old!). His birds are hand-reared, close rung (I know thats a debatable one), come with papers etc and he has a number of chicks in wait. I basically have two main concerns or questions... 1/ What sex do we plump for and do you grey owners feel it has much bearing? Ive read males can be slightly more aggressive with their 'sparring' but that its best to humour or ignore their attempts & nips when they have their moments and not react. Also, that males tend to be more outgoing and are more likely to initiate or instigate friendships with people and are happy to be handled. I have read that females on the other hand can be much more quiet, less social and disinclined to interact with people; actively resisting handling much more so than males and potentially become 'one person birds' more easily than males. Do females have 'pms'-type moments? The breeder has recommended we have a hen as I will be the main carer and work from home (its also me who has instigated the acquiring of a bird in the first place) but everything I have read seems to point to the likely hood of the female preferring females! 'We have a hen but she wont go near my husband' type of situation seems all too common. 2/ Can a bird, 6-8 weeks old, really 'pick' you ? I have suggested to the breeder that I would like to visit the birds again this weekend, there are 2 and they will be 7-8 weeks old, to see if one particularly 'picks' us out. He said I was welcome but followed it up with "it won't remember you". A little abrupt, but how much weight do you put on this philosophy? In his defence he has said he often tries to pair birds off with customers, so if someone has experience he may offer them the more rowdy or active bird, and if its a first-time owner perhaps the more docile / calmer personalities are better suited. We need to make a decision on which sex we want ASAP and after hours of reading and searching are no further forward. We plan to socialise it and both spend time as much as possible, evenly to hopefully bring up a well socialised bird but really feel some advice would help re the sexes and 'bird choosing you' idea. Any info, advice and experiences with babies you can share would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!

Thanks for your replies guys, they're helping a lot. In regards to the website, I have looked at it and the site is a fake/fraud. No real contact info at all, a home user hosting & domain company and blank T&C and About Us pages. It seems just like a template site to copy people's genuine adverts on to, amending the title in an attempt to put people off the genuine sellers. Which, to be frank worked on me. And even though I know this now I'm still uneasy because it's tainted my thoughts if you will. Re "Bart", and the above mentioned website aside. I don't think that he doesn't care about the birds. He told me stories of people he wouldn't sell to, who's home he had seen or heard how they'd lost/treated a previous bird and declined the sale (amicably & tactfully to spare their feelings), so he does seem genuine in his passion & care. Maybe he just has an alternate opinion on the weaning thing - but I do appreciate its a serious and big issue. If I can get a vet check (and I assume proof of? Certificate or something??) thrown in with the price, and he agrees to ring, give hatch certification and fully wean the bird until 14-16 weeks for me, I'm thinking maybe take it then? Would that be a good deal? With those conditions met, the only downer is that it's been hand reared as opposed to parent/bird reared, right? So he/she may still think they're a human rather than knowing they're not (and knowing they are in fact a bird). Or is that a big deal breaker too? Many thanks again for your replies peeps, you've all been great

Thanks Dan! In an update to my last post I called a 4th breeder from the website birds4saleuk.co.uk and they also knew nothing of diseased birds - their advert title was "PBFD Diseased African Grey Baby for sale" but they'd never heard of the site. They were at the computer so i gave them the full URL to take a look. And we're surprised to see the ad. I decided to investigate the site a bit more looking for contact details, T&Cs page is a no content link, as was the about us page. The sell with us link however contained content. It seems to me from looking at the site that it could well be bogus with the owner copying other listings and adding "Diseased" almost like a prefix to the adverts, which otherwise read with some credibility. So my question now is, for those of you who have read and been following... assuming this website is a fraud and the concerns raised from listing on it are disregarded, does this make Bart my initial breeder worth a shot? Still a few questions to ask him, how come no need to deal with insurances, why is only one of your two birds rung, why no hatch certificate etc.. or do you think I should still avoid?

Thanks guys... Just out of curiosity, I decided to call a number of those "DISEASED" adverts on the website I linked to above, put the phone down literally 5 mins ago. Out of 3 adverts (none of them Bart), not one of the sellers/breeders knew anything about a diseased bird advert! I confirmed the advert text and mobile numbers to the people I spoke to but they all said they never put diseased into their advert titles and genuinely seemed surprised at the suggestion. One even said he has his tested before sale. Two of them said to me, "who's going to buy a diseased bird?" To which I replied, well that's what I was thinking hence my call. Very strange indeed. Does anyone have any info on this or why all these adverts may be popping up like this? Makes finding an accurate advert / trustworthy breeder even harder!

Not that I'm aware of. To be honest I've found breeders and even shops that sell parrots -very- hard to come by other than on the south coast. If anyone knows of any uk breeders that are reputable and prepared to courier a bird by all means let me know. Most 'breeders' or sellers rather tend to sell via PreLoved and the likes of those sites so credibility is low at the best of times. You get used to seeing the same 'new' and 'actual' baby pictures after a while. Is there a way to view uk members on this forum and maybe pm or speak to a few of where they got their babies from? What of Bart was to claim the diseased bird listing was for another clutch of birds now sold/gone and these ones are in good health? Still avoid do you all think? By the way here is the site with all those listings of diseased birds. And yes, "Bart's" ad is on that page somewhere too. http://www.birds4saleuk.co.uk/african-grey-parrots-for-sale?page=3

Hi everyone. Just signed up, but have been reading on here since September! What an excellent forum this is and everyone seems friendly. I've been wanting to get an African Grey for a while now and have spent the last 3-4 months researching extensively on the breed, training etc and reading loads on this board. We had a cockatoo when I was young so not a complete newbie, though obviously this would be my first time buying as my own. Anyhoo, after speaking with two breeders, visiting a residential home where their pet was up for sale and not feeling comfortable with any of them for various reasons I came across another ad on PreLoved, let's call him Breeder#3 or 'Bart'. And it's this guy I'd like your advice on if I may. Please forgive the length of the post but I think you'll agree the detail is necessary. I had a long string of emails go back and forth with Bart. He has 20-25yrs experience works from home and we eventually had a very long phone call too. During the call he very briefly mentioned he had 3 birds which have all gone now but he had lowered the price "to get rid of them quickly" without ellaborating and the conversation moved on. He sounded very caring, passionate and assured me of his professionalism and experience. We talked at length about certain aspects of ownership. He told me some stories of his own birds, how he got started and into breeding etc etc. He has 2 baby Congos available now which he said would be ready in about 3 weeks, and would cost me £550. No cage included. I really am hoping for some communal advice, thoughts and opinions on Bart and this situation I have described as I am unsure what to do, whether I have been filled with 'Sales Patter' or if my concerns are justified. My problems or issues are these; - Bart has said the two babies will be ready in 3 weeks; at 8-9 weeks old. All I had read said 12 weeks minimum. - They will need spoon fed twice a day for a couple weeks, then they'll start to move onto regular diet Bart said. (Also said he'll provide the powder to mix to a paste for this spoon feeding, and that he's never had a problem with anyone hand feeding in all his experience & years.) - When I mentioned everything I'd read suggested the bird should be 12 weeks old, he said he finds it better at 8/9 because the bird is still dependent on you for a while so helps to build the bond etc and makes a difference in that sense because you're helping to raise the bird. After the call I felt completely reassured, he was pleasant, seemed very genuine and approachable, knowledgable and trust worthy. The only niggle I had with him after all these emails & the phone call was that he wasn't overly into the thought of me visiting regularly as a) it's his home and he doesn't like people 'coming and going' as it's unsettling for the birds and eyes nothing to see as all they do is eat and sleep, b) he has a second job and doesn't like to be tied down and c) the birds will be 'ready to take home' in 3 weeks anyway, so it'd be a wasted trip for me to travel over to him only to have to come back in another week or 2 to collect. Though when pressed he did say I could visit once if I really wanted to and did offer to send me new photos weekly or daily if I wanted. I wanted to visit to see which of the toe birds 'chose me', but he says it doesn't always work like that and by taking them @ 8-9 weeks the bond would be strong anyway. So this is all fair and well, so I thought. A few days later he got in touch to say he had 2 interested parties but wanted to give me first refusal on one of the birds. I emailed back to say I was interested but stopped short of sending a deposit (it's a big purchase, decision and I don't want to rush in) so instead asked some additional questions; Are the birds close rung, do they come with a certificate and did he have any contacts for insurance or an idea of approximate cost? His reply was; one of the two was ringed, no papers or certificates though he advised I could make one myself or buy the papers online and he would give me the birth date! As for insurance, he'd never needed it in his 20-25 years experience as all his birds are healthy he said. So immediately I thought the following; Why would you ring one baby and not the other? Weird. Second, no papers? Make your own? A little unprofessional but I guess it made sense. He said they weren't worth much because they're so easily made & faked. I have friends in IT so could easily get something realistic made up if I wanted, but that is besides the point. And the answer on insurance shocked me a little and made me wonder if *I* was being over protective or too worrying/precautious. This would have been the end of the post, except yesterday as I was closing down loooads of open parrot related browser tabs I had a selling site open and happened to browse the results. As I did I noticed "Diseased African Greys for sale". I scrolled passed and about to hit the close / red X button I stopped myself out of curiosity and thought; who's going to buy a DISEASED bird!? And at what cost? I also then noticed there was LOADS of these diseased bird listings from lots of different sellers. Over 50% of the listings were for diseased baby African greys! So anyway, I scrolled back up to the initial listing that caught my eye and clicked it...... I was SHOCKED to find this seller was based in the same town as Bart. A little more reading and I discover Bart's phone numbers! IT WAS BARTS LISTING!!! Diseased African Greys for £550! The ad was for 3 birds not 2, but it had been posted about 2-3 days after I started talking with Bart (last week!) and also mentioned the "Reduced Price" of 550 given their health condition (PFBD - poor immune system, malforming beat, nails & feathers - uncurable). After some bad gut feelings with other breeders/sellers I've spoken to in the last 4 weeks and then feeling so happy with Bart I can't tell you how disappointed, angry & confused I feel. His listing mentioned PBFD which I now know all about from googling and obviously don't want to buy a bird that's diseased which could die within a year! How do you know who to trust? How can you be sure you're not being lied to? Even the papers are easily faked! It's really put me off, and even though I still want a bird I can't afford to risk buying a diseased one. I've thought about having another phone conversation with Bart to ask about disease testing, and any health guarantees on the bird (Do such things exist?) to try and catch him out and mention the listing of his I found, but haven't gotten around to it yet. What do you guys make and think of all this? The take-home age? The rings & papers? The disease listing! Should I demand a vet check for clean bill of health? Surely I shouldn't have to cover that! What would you do in this situation? Since finding this forum I've read about unweaned birds being illegal to sell, people recommending 14-16 weeks before taking home (all breeders I've spoke to have said 12, except 'Bart' who said 8-9). So much contradictory advice. The only local shop I had a bad experience on the phone with as the owner wash out snappy and just unpleasant to speak to so I never called them back or went to see their birds. There are no other local breeders in my part of England that I've been able to find, so the situation seems difficult. Any advice, help and guidance would be greatly appreciated.