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This is a wonderful thought provoking subject. 1. Do I feel sorry for my 3 parrots? Yes, almost every day.... 2. Do I feel guilty that I have to work and they stay in their cages all day until I get home in the evening? Yes, absolutely,..Terrible guilt.. But I keep telling myself that my 3 were bred in homes..they do not know the life their ancestors have. The old saying you don't miss what you don't have.. 3. Do I wish they could fly free and experience what their instincts tell them? Yes, a lot..however, they most likely would not survive in the wild, They don't know what "wild" is. So I do the best I can for them, they all have macaw size cages, filled with toys, and toy baskets with toys wrapped in paper so they can forage. I give them as much attention as I can. Feeding them as healthy as possible. My house looks like a giant bird cage, I have rope perches, boings, birds tree stands EVERYWHERE, So when they are out, they have every opportunity to fly wherever they chose. They mostly chose to be with me or my honey, eating dinner with us or watching tv on us, I long to be able to give them the kind of out of cage time I used to be able to (some days, all day) when my job was different, but now I am working full time, long hours, but Sat afternoon & I dedicate Sundays to their time. I go nowhere on Sundays as that is there time to be free out of their cages from morning to night. They only know life with me except for Rikki who was purchased by someone else in a pet store, they had her for 1 year until the man (Rikkis favorite, was too ill and the wife gave her to another couple. After 6 weeks they came on this forum and asked how to keep her quiet as she whistled too much and was too loud! Turns out they lived 2 hours away.. I made a sarcastic comment to them, and next thing I know, they brought her to me..her forever home) So like all of you, I do the best I can and try to not stress over the lives they have..after all thats all they know..<3 GREAT TOPIC!! Thanks to all who posted, it is really nice to hear others thoughts, after all we're not alone like we feel sometimes.

You know the old saying, things in motion tend to stay in motion, things at rest tend to stay at rest. It was on my mind, and thought it would be a good topic to get folks talking again There are no right or wrong answers, just thoughts.

It IS a great topic. And it's a topic we can easily become defensive about. This thread didn't go there, thankfully. At the end of the day, we all just want what is realistically the best for our parrots.

If I could go back to the 1996 when I first adopted a parrot; I wouldn't. At the time they seemed like amazing colourful pets. I have since placed 3 of my dear parrots in a parrot sanctuary so they can fly free. I kept Snickers (my grey) because he can be difficult but my other parrots were those well adjusted, social, never-met-a-stranger types. I think they are happier flying free with others of their own kind -- it's a HUGE aviary -- lot of room for full flight. Today I wouldn't think breeding parrots is a good thing. But 20+ years ago -- I thought it was the coolest thing ever. I have a meme on my fridge: "you are forever responsible for what you have tamed". Those words mean more to now than when I first put it on my fridge. We do our best with caged companions, try to give them lots of free time outside their cage, provide toys and attention, cuddles, offer healthy varied diets -- but it's not being free. Most don't even know better, our world is all they've known, and I want to believe they find some happiness in our homes in spite of us knowing better. Please... no haters. I kept indoor (my home) caged/companion parrots for 22 years so I AM you too. I still have Snickers in my home. But at my death, he too will go the parrot sanctuary and get a glimpse of the world he was meant for.

Just about everyone has given good advice about many basic things concerning the human to bird or the bird to bird relationships. But everything here isn'tset in stone. What may happen right now with your birds may be in your favor. On the other hand, maybe not. One of the best things to do with pet greys ( for the person who has more than one) is to keep them in separate living quarters because greys each have totally different personalites from each other. The only way for you to experience the very intricate and detailed personality WITH YOU is to keep them separated. That allows each bird to show their full personality without any interference from another bird. You'll never know that full scope of each bird when they're together. They can play all day, they can hang out together but each bird has to have it's own place to go back to which is HOME which is the cage. Each bird designs a cage to their own likes. It'll be different than the next cage. Wanna practice talking to them? Again, they need to be separate because both birds may repeat the exact same thing or not repeat it or only one may repeat it. How does a person know the bird's capabilities? Separate HOMES. Wanna have a specialized relationship with each of those birds? Separate HOMES. Wanna see who's more jealous or possessive? Separate HOMES. Wanna let each bird feel very relaxed when it feels like playing with it's own toys? Separate HOMES. Wanna watch as each bird's personality develops? Separate HOMES. And I can tell you that your birds have come no where near what their final adult personalities will be. There's a lot of other reasons for separate HOMES and none will hurt the birds as far as their liking each other. Wanna see who's the more dominant or passive bird? Separate HOMES. It's very possible that keeping 2 greys in one cage will actually hamper one or the other as far as showing their individuality. But, if you wanna put them together than go for it. My opinion is that greys are so drastically different from each other that I would wanna enjoy each bird by letting them show me their differences. All greys are different and that includes breeding birds. What may go on at your breeder's house is not necessarily the same as what goes on in another breeder's house. I have breeders. When breeding season is over, all are put into a communal aviary. I and my wife can deal with all of them. We;re the owners and they've lived with us for years but if you came around them in that communal area you would see very different birds. I'll put it this way---you would really wanna get out of that aviary quickly. Everyone who gets different parrots thinks about breeding them in the future. It's only natural. But as time goes on you'll see that because your birds are very complex you'll forget that idea. Basically, everyone is saying to keep them separate. Is that so hard? Everyone knows where their birds are at. Let each develop separately. There's not really much more to say, at least from me. Look through the whole thread. Recheck what people have said. Focus on good individual relationships with those greys. Like Jayd said, you may be confusing the words bond and friend. You say that you don't know much about raising greys. Dealing with greys is different than dealing with other parrots. Dealing with Amazons is different than dealing with Cockatoos which is different than dealing with macaws which is different than dealing with conures which is different than dealing with eckletus etc etc etc. People here aren't telling you what will or won't happen. They're telling you what may or may not happen and they're trying to put you on that safe and happy path. Anyway, you've got a lotta years to go by before you may or may not consider breeding these birds. Even in the human world, identical twins need to be dealt with separately because each excells where the other doesn't.

I had 2 male Congos, Caesar and Cyrus, that have passed away, RIP. But I don't want to go into that story. But I do have some potentially helpful information as I have introduced my female Timneh Greycie who is 5 now to 2 different male Congos. You started off perfect introducing them in a cage next to each other. But putting your baby in the other birds cage after 2 days is a big risk. You are very lucky she didn't seriously hurt him. What I did with my birds was always leave them out on top of the cage as long as I was supervising or in the room. They will get to know each other on their own, you can't force it. Trying to force it will make things worse. Anyhow after a week or so they started climbing around checking each other out, my female Timneh Greycie would go on top of Caesar's cage and hang out. Then slowly within the next few weeks I walked into Greycie and Caesar in the same cage eating out of the same bowl. And when I had Cyrus I had the exact same results. Sadly both my male Congos, Caesar and Cyrus came from the same breeder and I got 2 sick babies from them. I had a necropsy done on both and I was told they were both basically born to die, which was hard to hear. Because they were both so sweet of birds. But I'm getting off track, make sure you let them out of there cage to climb on top and they will become friends. One more big piece of advise that I would follow that I got when I got my 2nd parrot is always do things for your 1st parrot 1st. Now I know that might sound confusing but I'll give some examples. Like I'm sure you cover your birds, when you wake up in the morning always uncover the parrot you've had the longest first. If you had 3 parrots it would be the same way. The 1st one 1st the 2nd one 2nd the 3rd one 3rd regardless of age, in my opinion you need to take care of the parrot you've had the longest first. Because if you don't jealously can happen, and that's what makes birds start hating each other. Same thing with feeding, giving water, saying hello, all that. It might not sound important to some people but it makes a big difference. Parrots are some of the smartest animals but they are exactly like little kids. I hope some of this helps you and isn't repetitive suggestions you've been receiving. I hope all is well.

Hi, You need to speak to Dave007 about this......Just to clarify, once your Greys bond, they will no longer have anything to do with you, your duty will be to feed and care for them, they won't even be friends with you. A grey can only bond with one person or one bird at a time, bonding with another bird always takes precedents. Once mated and bonded they revert to their wild mind set, even if you separate them, there are sanctuary for pre-breeder Greys, they are no longer human compatible. You will need to find someone who is willing to teach you how to raise hatch-lings. They'll need special breeding box's, food, temperature and other condition requirements. You can breed and raise cockatiels fairly easy, they do most of the work, not so with Greys..Once again, once bonded and mated, they will be relinquished to their own world where you will become their care taker and owner, not companion or friend......Sorry for being a advocate, there's more than most people realize to breeding parrots then putting two birds in the same cage and waiting for a egg to drop and hatch.....

I want to chime in;-) I actually want to say just two things since you already got so great advice. First. If you had your female for a time know, treat her in the same manner from this point on: bring her food first, give her water first, let her out first...so she would keep her status and IMO that may help prevent jealousy. Second thing, with all do respect, please do not breed greys if you haven't mastered the basics, which you obviously haven't (don't feel bad, I haven't either). IMO you should spent educating yourself constantly and observing the greys for a long time before you should even think about breeding them because it is a highly sensitive process. I get chills just thinking about all the things that may go wrong. Do find all the threads which talk about baby greys (since you have a baby). It is a good place to start as any;-) Good luck and all the best! :-)

I also don't think you made a mistake or damaged your chances. You will be surprised how adaptive they are. We also have a male and a female and they were about the same age, we got the female (who was 3 months then) a year after the male and wanted them to live together. We had them in separate cages when they came home and let them out together at the same time. Our male was a bully to her but she just learned to fly away from him. After 3 moths we noticed that they seemed to get on and one day the female screamed when I put her in her cage and when I took her out to see what the problem was she wanted to go to the males cage. I let her in and sat there for an hour and watched them. She checked out his cage (seeing if it met her standards to move in, hehe). I then took her out and put her back in her own cage. Over the next week we increased the time she was in his cage with him everyday until finally they were happy to be together full time. They now live together and are bonded together, but they are also bonded to us. Like you say just let them work it out for themselves, you do have a good chance as they are so young just give it a few months.

Just remember, you've made no mistake..........Only you know your goals........Thanks.....Jay

I'll let them figure it out by themselves. I do want them to mate in the future when they are old enough and my plan was to have them in a big aviary but unfortunately it sounds like that is not going to happen? I was aware of that they might not become friends and that is why I have no problem at all keeping them both inside separated from each other :-) I can't describe to you how much I love them. I only want the best for them :-)

did you get the 2nd bird just to have 2 or is your plan mating? :confused:

The others are quite right, they both need to be in separate cages and if one wants to become friends with the other then it will happen on their own and in their own time but I imagine that they will tolerate one another but not be friends. The person who told you to put them together does not know much about greys.

Sorry, the best thing to do is leave them be, let them out of their cages, they will either go on as if nothing is wrong ,or one might fly to the others cage and be accepted or told to move on, Greys are independent of each other, their main concern is themselves, not another bird.... Show equal attention to each, treat each as they demand, likes and dislikes. Let them teach you, not you teach them. You don't want them to bond, only get aong, if they bond with each other, they'll have nothing to do with any human, remember they won't be domesticated like a dog or cat for about 200,000 years, sit back, let the be. No psychology, no forcing or planning, let the show you how to coexist. Ask Dave007 about bonded Greys and breeders, read through some present threads....We have some parrots that still do as you say after all theses years, it's their way, were just caretakers. Thank Jay

I agree. Coexisting should always be the goal. Separate cages at all times. Eventually... have two play gyms, see how they do next to each other. When timeout away from cage, do you have a significant other that can have one of the greys on him, one on you? Play a game together. You should focus on your greys learning to trust you first. That is the MOST important. Nancy

Whoever told you to put them together after just a few days was dead wrong! Lulus cage is her space and it must be up to her who she invites in and it may never happen. Greys are basically monogamous so if Lulu has a close relationship with you she won't easily accept another Grey straight off. Your male is still a baby and will be very confused. He has no affinity with Lulu but he does have a natural need to learn from an adult. Again with an adopted baby Grey that would be now you. He should develop a bond with you as well but that could lead to Lulu getting jealous. When he gets to around two his instinct may well be to seek a relationship with someone else. By then Lulu may tolerate him better but if they do pair up you could well be left in the cold. Grey relationships involving human carers and other Greys can get complicated so it is hard to predict but I think if you keep them in separate cages and supervise their together time they will grow to tolerate each other in time and even get to like each other but there are no guarantees. Greys are natural experts in body language and can read each other (and humans) very well. So they will communicate on various levels. One way is to whistle to each other so if you can encourage that by joining in if you can that may help. Steve n Misty

Janet is more than right, keep them in the same room just separated, they'll decide what to do...Most of the time they will coexist, thats what you want. If you want them to bond, they'll bond with each other, not you...Their from 2 different, in the wild that means their from 2 different flocks, now their in a new 3rd flock, they have to adjust to you and each other...Thanks

First put each of your greys back in their own cage. You can't force a friendship/relationship between any two birds be them male/female or female/female or male/male. They should have their own cages. I have three parrots, all are flighted. They do not like each other but do tolerate each other. They have under supervision found their own "pecking order". Some birds/parrots do grow to like each other but that is their choice and up to each of them.